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Original poster

My DD is confused and a bit upset by gender fluid teacher

354 replies

CosmicCanary · 17/09/2018 18:12

DD is 11 and in her second full week at high school.
We were going through her home work today and part of it is drama.
She needs to learn the meaning of various words such as reflection, preformance spontaneous etc.
DD loves drama and is very enthusiastic about it now being a weekly lesson. I asked if she was enjoying it and she said yes but she is confused.
She said she does not know what to call her teacher.
I said Ms, Mr or Mrs last name.
DD said its not like that. The teacher has said they can call her Ms Mr or Dr as they are gender fluid and their pronoun is they.

I said well call them by any of those then if they dont mind. DD said its hard as the teacher is a Ms/she/woman and although she is trying hard to remember the they pronoun she (DD) keeps getting it wrong.

DD is a very kind and does not want to upset her teacher as she likes her/him/they very much. DD is also scared as she does not want to get in to trouble as, and I quote "misgendering is a crime".

I have reassured DD that her teacher has said its fine to call her Ms Mr or Dr so she has nothing to be scared of and wont upset the teacher.

In private I am very angry. My DD has enough to deal with and worry about just starting high school and now she has to deal with a teachers chosen identity and the worry that if she slips up because despite the short hair and Mr reference her teacher is a woman.

This is not trans bashing before that gets thrown at me I am just upset my DD has to deal with this when it only benefits the teacher and causes distress to a child.

OP posts:
WeWantJustice · 17/09/2018 23:33

Yeah actually, what discrimination do genderfluid people endure?

SheCameFromGreeceSheHadaThirst · 17/09/2018 23:33

Really sorry that someone else's existence has inconvenienced you so much by them being really fucking annoying to you. Maybe they should just hide indoors and refuse to engage with the public?

Did a 13-year-old write this? It reads like Kevin the teenager Grin

WeWantJustice · 17/09/2018 23:34

They didn't ask to be born.

Grin
MrBeansXmasTurkey · 17/09/2018 23:37

Is this for real? It sounds very unusual.
If it were my dd she would be happy to respect the teacher's wishes. The YouTube generation are very Woke in that way.

Original poster
CosmicCanary · 17/09/2018 23:38

Seems strange she's so stressed about this then. I can't imagine either of my children being bothered at all by this, they are both very open minded.

Why strange? Because she is a twin? They are different people not the same person with the same personality!

Both DDs are respectful and as much as being 11 allows open minded. However this has confused and upset my DD2 and I can understand why. I am pleased your children would not be bothered by this however mine is and I want to handle this in a sensitive way without telling my daughter she is in the wrong/closed minded/over sensitive. She isnt. The teacher is not a Mr.

OP posts:
AsAProfessionalFekko · 17/09/2018 23:39

I'm off to bed now. I'm my PJs - the ones that I bought my teenage son from GAP but they were 'too lame' so I kept them for myself.

Goodnight from Mr Fekko esq.

Original poster
CosmicCanary · 17/09/2018 23:41

Is this for real? It sounds very unusual.

Yes it is real.
This school is an academy and has been open 6 years. I have had involvement for 5 years. DD1 and 2 are child number 3 and 4 who have attended this school and this has never been an issue before.

OP posts:
SheCameFromGreeceSheHadaThirst · 17/09/2018 23:43

Yeah actually, what discrimination do genderfluid people endure?

Don't hold your breath for an answer to that. You're only uber-special if you're being persecuted on a daily basis. Wink

Perfectly1mperfect · 17/09/2018 23:43

Why strange? Because she is a twin? They are different people not the same person with the same personality!

No, nothing to do with being a twin. I mean it's strange because you say she's usually very relaxed and she's not someone to feel stressed and anxious about things.

Do you have an issue with gender fluid ?

letsghostdance · 17/09/2018 23:44

Yes, yes, questioning my age really is a clever argument winner. Great work.

Anyway, as long as you all continue to believe that gender is a choice then this conversation is fruitless. This is just an echo chamber. But try to remember that you're talking about a real actual person who, regardless of what you think, has gone through a level of stress and confusion about who they are and how to present to the world. That's a difficulty that the vast majority of people will never have to experience. Your daughter will bounce back, for her this is temporary. Enjoy.

Perfectly1mperfect · 17/09/2018 23:45

Is this for real? It sounds very unusual.
If it were my dd she would be happy to respect the teacher's wishes. The YouTube generation are very Woke in that way.

Exactly my thoughts.

D2018 · 17/09/2018 23:47

I don't really get the issue here?
Her teacher has given her 3 options to call them by so surely that reassures your DD that said teacher understands it may be confusing for some kids so is addressing that by saying you can call me Ms, Mr or Dr. As for using they rather than he or she i doubt it will ve very often in conversation your DD will refer to her teacher as they very often anyway. I had a German teacher with a difficult to pronounce surname who have us shortened options of what to call him. It didn't confuse anyone it was actually helpful. Tell your DD it's lovely that she wants to respect her teachers feelings but she doesn't have to worry about offending them. She should just try her best to use they end select the title she will remember

Original poster
CosmicCanary · 17/09/2018 23:48

Do you have an issue with gender fluid ?

No why would I?

I do think the whole "I am not male not femsle call me Z today" is ridiculous but that is not a conversation I have with my 11 yo child.

DDs issue seems to be the teacher is female so cannot be a Mr and she is worried calling the teacher she in a conversation with a friend is a crime.

OP posts:
DinahMorris · 17/09/2018 23:53

Most people are gender fluid or gender non-conforming. Sometimes I wear trousers, sometimes skirts. I like rugby and ballet. I'm not unusual or special. I still know the difference between men and women, and the appropriate pronouns for those two groups of humans.

Expecting children to disregard years of grammar teaching wrt pronouns and titles is unreasonable in a classroom. Recognising that some children may be confused or anxious about the conflict between personal preference and correct grammar is completely reasonable.

Overall, I'd tell DD that misgendering as absolutely not a crime and see it as a learning experience - sometimes their friends are seriously misinformed and it is always best to check with an adult. The teacher doesn't care about titles, so that's fine. I'd still check with the school regarding pronouns though. IMO the school and teachers should absolutely not be teaching that "they" is an acceptable singular pronoun. Unless/until the gcse exam boards accept it.

D2018 · 17/09/2018 23:56

CosmicCanary
Simply explain to DD that some people don't feel like they are one gender or the other so would rather go by gender fluid names. However, its not a crime to make a mistake amd say the wrong one. No one would be angry or upset with her if she accidently used the wrong pronoun as long as it wasn't done in a cruel way. Sometimes people say the wrong pronoun deliberately to be hurtful but everyone knows and her teacher certainly knows that DD would never be hurtful if she said she or he instead of they.

Perfectly1mperfect · 18/09/2018 00:01

DDs issue seems to be the teacher is female so cannot be a Mr and she is worried calling the teacher she in a conversation with a friend is a crime.

Then I am sure that a quick call to the school will soon clarify that your daughter will not get into trouble for accidentally using the wrong pronoun. You can then reassure your daughter that there's no issue.

Gender fluid is going to be something that your daughter will come across in her life. I think it was in Year 7 or 8 my sons Religioud Studies lesson covered there being more than 2 genders and gender fluid. Apart from a few sniggers from the immature idiots, the kids seemed to just accept it. I had certainly talked about topics like this with my son by age 11 and my 9 year old daughter has an awareness.

AssassinatedBeauty · 18/09/2018 00:06

I wonder when they'll be teaching about gender being a hierarchy, and not just a harmless spectrum.

SheCameFromGreeceSheHadaThirst · 18/09/2018 00:09

Anyway, as long as you all continue to believe that gender is a choice then this conversation is fruitless

Of course it's a choice. Gender (as opposed to biological sex) is a social construct, and hence 'gender fluid', like all social identities, is a choice. Or rather, in light of the element of fluidity, a series of fluctuating choices.

Original poster
CosmicCanary · 18/09/2018 00:14

Then I am sure that a quick call to the school will soon clarify that your daughter will not get into trouble for accidentally using the wrong pronoun.

I have no reason to do that as I am confident no crime has been committed.

Gender fluid is going to be something that your daughter will come across in her life.

I dont teach my children about gender. They wear play with and do what they choose, teaching them about gender would restrict that. What my DD does understand is that Mr is how you address males. Tgat is why she is confused as the teacher has said addressing her as male is ok but tge teacher is female.

OP posts:
mumprincess12 · 18/09/2018 00:17

Oh for goodness sake - she/he should not be saying this to 11 year olds - ridiculous - it has nothing to do with the lesson or learning. Tell the school and ask them how on earth anyone is to address this person. It's attention seeking and not acceptable.

Perfectly1mperfect · 18/09/2018 00:26

I have no reason to do that as I am confident no crime has been committed

YOU are confident but your daughter is still worried and upset. Hearing it from the school would help her. I would personally want my daughter to stop worrying and this would be the easiest way to do it.

I dont teach my children about gender

You could have a conversation to explain how some people feel about gender. That some people don't just feel like one gender as D2018 said above. It may help your daughter understand more when situations like this arise and stop her from feeling worried. It's certainly never restricting to educate.

Redcliff · 18/09/2018 00:47

"she is confused as the teacher has said addressing her as male is ok but the teacher is female" - so she can just use Ms. My DS has been upset about non-important things this week as he has also just started secondary school and there is a lot to take it - give it a couple of weejs and I bet it's a non-issue.

Original poster
CosmicCanary · 18/09/2018 00:53

Yes Perfect I am confident in telling my child she has committed no crime. She does not need to hear it from the school especially a school that employes a teacher who caused this in the first place.

You could have a conversation to explain how some people feel about gender.

Why?
DD is not confused that the teacher is genderfluid. To her that just means the teacher has short hair and doesnt like dresses just like DD tbh.
What is confusing is that a female teacher wants to be calked 1 of three things, 1 of which DD knows is used to address males.

It is not my 11 yo fault she is confused. The adult who is supposed to be teaching her drama has made somthing very simple confusing for her own reasons.

OP posts:
MistressDeeCee · 18/09/2018 01:38

God this is tiresome.

Reminds me of the 2 teachers on GMTV, 1 lesbian and one bisexual, smugly wittering away about them coming out to their pupils. They were so very pleased with themselves.

I just thought oh do shut up with the attention seeking, who cares what your sexuality is you're there to TEACH your specialist subject. Just do that

It's as if everyone wants their 15 minutes of look at me me me fame by any means necessary nowadays

Perfectly1mperfect · 18/09/2018 06:30

I would have thought the issue here was helping your daughter to not feel stressed about this. If it was, then you would clarify with the school and have a conversation with your daughter. Your daughter would then feel reassured and all would be well. I think if you rang the school you may hear a slightly different version of events anyway.

Clearly that's not the issue here. You have an issue with someone who has probably struggled with life and their identity. You clearly think this is a load of rubbish and have your own agenda. I didn't realise that at the start but it's very clear now. I prefer to be open minded and bring my children up to be the same. You never know what's around the corner so I prefer not to judge on matters like this. If the teacher is a good teacher I couldn't care less what they choose to be called. I hope your daughter never feels confused about her gender.