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Original poster

Absolutely raging - need to vent!!

535 replies

Cleanerrates · 02/09/2018 21:41

14 year DD went away bank holiday weekend to the seaside with her dad, his gf and her 10 month old baby brother, she's seemed a little upset and withdrawn since coming back and tonight she finally told me why.
Two reasons - firstly for 2 nights out of the 3 DD was made to babysit her brother so her dad and gf could go out for dinner and drinks, apparently they were only at a bar a couple of minutes walk away so told DD to call if baby woke up and left her with a KFC for dinner both nights - ok some might say at 14 DD is old enough to babysit but they were all supposed to be on a holiday together.
Second reason I'm so raging I've sank a bottle of red in 20 minutes trying to keep calm. They all shared a room, DD was on a sofa bed, she heard/saw her dad and his gf having sex TWICE!!! First time she said she was facing the wall drifting off to sleep and heard them having sex, second time she was facing out into the room half woke up with a cramp in her leg wanted to turn over but saw they were having sex and shut her eyes and didn't dare move as she didn't want them to know she saw anything.... I'm fuming!!! DD said they came back from both nights out extremely drunk so don't know if they were both so pissed they weren't with it but what the actual fuck!!

DD has made me promise not to say anything to her dad as she doesn't want them to know that she saw/heard anything cos she's so embarrassed, upset and she spends every second weekend with them so doesn't want any awkwardness, obviously i wanna rip his head off but want to respect my DDs wishes. DH thinks I need to say something regardless of DD asking not to as he thinks it's too serious to just leave.

OP posts:
Original poster
Cleanerrates · 03/09/2018 00:03

Hi.
DD feel asleep about 20 minutes ago I’m just downstairs with DH, both wide awake and still in shock.
Too many replies to answer individually but yes DD does have contact with him during the week, she’s old enough for me to not get involved with that so I’m not too sure how much contact she’s had with him since she’s been back, obviously now I know what’s happened he will be told to not contact her until she feels ready, I do know her password to her phone so I could check but i will ask her instead tomorrow.
Also I’m in no way minimising what’s happened because he’s been a good father in the past, I was just trying to express how utterly shocking this is because without trying to sound smug we’ve had it really easy with co-parenting DD. There’s been a couple of wobbles when he got a gf and then when her baby brother arrived as she was used to having her dad all to herself for years but apart from that everything has been great. I thought I knew this man pretty well and I would never in a million years thought he would put DD in a situation like this.

OP posts:
Chickenwings85 · 03/09/2018 00:05

Firstly, they're arseholes for using your DD as a free babysitter.
Secondly, how embarrassing for your DD, I hope she's ok? On a plus note, how lovely that she felt comfortable enough to tell you what had been going on. I really feel for her, she sounds a lovely kid too.
I'm with you though OP, I'd be raging and want to say something to him. I agree with previous comments, chat to your daughter so she understands the seriousness of it all. Good luck.

Scrumptiousbears · 03/09/2018 00:06

Jesus. So many of you want the dad hung drawn and quartered.

DD has a god awful weekend and was taken advantage of with regards to baby sitting.

There is no foundation in that dad knew she could hear or see anything he was doing and more than likely thought she was asleep. I bet he is mortified when he is told.

Not taking anything away from how the DD feels but come on slow down a bit and breath guys.

louise5754 · 03/09/2018 00:10

I don't agree it's sexual abuse. Very wrong of them but i doubt they knew she could hear or see anything. I think you have to be careful how it's worded.

Notasunnybunny · 03/09/2018 00:10

Of course you wouldn’t, because you would never behave that way yourself so you couldn’t imagine someone else doing it. My comment re minimising was because that would be exactly what I would do, I would think this was all some big mistake and that I must be wrong in making it a big deal, backing up my own argument with thoughts about how ex is a good dad etc.....

Charolais · 03/09/2018 00:12

If she were my child I would explain to her what they did was very damaging to her, unwholesome - wrong and even though she loves her dad, he and his girlfriend could be not be trusted again for overnights.

I would never let her stay with them again.

Aeroflotgirl · 03/09/2018 00:12

Scruptious it is a big deal for the poor girl, and she sounds really upset about it. I hope that he is mortified, what he did was very wrong, and has upset his dd immensely. It must have been awful for her to witness that and be too afraid to speak up. Op does need to talk to him about that, and op dd has to be supported if she does not want to see her dad at the moment.

Notasunnybunny · 03/09/2018 00:16

From the link to NSPCC website that gives the different forms of sexual abuse not taking proper measures to prevent a child being exposed to sexual activities by others

Again, no one is suggesting the abuse was deliberate but it has occurred and the trauma from that is real regardless.

Uncreative · 03/09/2018 00:17

@PickAChew

Thank you for posting the link to the NSPCC definitions.

If it happened again, I think it should be considered abuse. But at this stage, I think it is better for the OP’s daughter if it is treated as child neglect.

Aeroflotgirl · 03/09/2018 00:17

The poor girl witness sex twice, not just once, totally unacceptable.

AcrossthePond55 · 03/09/2018 00:38

Oh for heaven's sake, @NoMudNoLotus and others! I never said it was OK for parents to shag in front of their children! And whilst the 14 year old no doubt knew the score, I doubt a 10 month old would have had any idea of what was going on. Not that it makes it OK.

I said that it's not unheard of that children see or hear it, UNINTENTIONALLY. If your child saw or heard you and your DH unintentionally would you call SS on yourself? Of course not! You'd be embarrassed to death and upset that you had upset your child. And you'd deal with it calmly AND you'd be much more careful in future. I've seen threads on MN where people have posted "OMG, my DC just walked in on DH and I" and not one single person has suggested that the OP should turn herself in as a child abuser.

Her ex was stupid and probably drunk. It's not an excuse. He needs to know that his behaviour was unacceptable, starting with being too drunk to make responsible decisions when in charge of children.

GlitteryFluff · 03/09/2018 01:07

Your poor DD.
Some really good advice on this thread.
I'd sleep on it and tackle tomorrow.
Thanks

IhatetheArchers · 03/09/2018 01:25

Not reporting you across the pond, but your response was fucking stupid. It is sexual abuse, and I've seen that type of thing; a parent having sex in front of a child, on child protection reports. It really isn't a case of ' Oh whoops! We'd better be quieter in future!'

AcrossthePond55 · 03/09/2018 02:22

As I explained before Ihate, I'm speaking of unintentional exposure. Not parents who knowingly and intentionally have sex in front of their children.

IF OP's ex did it knowingly and intentionally when in a unaltered state of mind, then yes, that abuse. But I don't think that's the case. It was a stupid and drunken fuck up. I'm not excusing him, but I don't think he's a child abuser. Just a dumb shit who perhaps shouldn't be in charge of his DC until he can control his drinking.

If the OP knows differently, if she truly believes it was intentional or if her ex says that there was nothing wrong with it, then yes, she should report him.

Havabiscuit · 03/09/2018 02:35

How can any parent think it’s ok to have sex with a girlfriend in the same room as his 14 year old daughter? You obviously didn’t know this was the sleeping arrangement before she went. It shouldn’t have been booked if they couldn’t get a separate room for her.
if I had a 14 year old babysitter no way would I get so drunk. If there was a problem who would drive? I suppose I might let a 14 year old babysit but it just sounds like she was brought along to be the live in nanny. Obviously she won’t be going again.

pallisers · 03/09/2018 02:54

I'm actually a little disturbed at the posters who think it is normal for a man to have sex in the same room as his 14 year old and think there is some sort of "unintended exposure" in having sex in the same room as your teenage daughter. There isn't.

If you have sex in the same room as your 14 year old you don't care whether you are exposing her or not to your sexual activities. for all intents and purposes you intend to have sex in the same room as her.

unintentional exposure is when you close the door, start having sex and the 14 year old walks in because she feel sick.

Are people thick or what that they can't tell the difference?

Not surprised though that a traumatising event for a young girl is being dismissed and minimsed. thats the way the world works. OP, don't be like that. Acknowledge and deal with what happened your daughter.

For what it is worth, given what you've said, OP, it may well be that your dd's father went completely nuts, drunk, etc. and this is a new issue that can be nipped in the bud. doesn't mean your dd should have to minimise what happened to her and you still have to deal with it. I wish you well.

Havabiscuit · 03/09/2018 03:02

pallisers
Exactly. Like most parents we have had the kids walk in on us when they had forgotten the “ knock first” rule.
I suppose we have had very quiet sex when our kids were babies and still had their cot in the room. Spent the camping holiday years not having sex on holiday!
However never never in a situation like this.

Notasunnybunny · 03/09/2018 06:41

Pallisers - Amen

You don’t ‘accidentally’ have sex with your teenager in the room. That’s a choice.

AwdBovril · 03/09/2018 07:23

pallisers - I also agree. Staggering that it has to be spelled out.

AdoreTheBeach · 03/09/2018 07:26

OP- So sorry for your DD. This most definitely needs addressing so it doesn’t happen again. Firstly the sex in the same room, secondly leaving her to babysit two night in a row. Clearly EXH and GF had a fabulous time on holiday and didn’t think their actions were wrong (hence a repeat performance). This needs not to happen again.

So as precious posters advised, a discussion with DD needs to take place to ensure her feelings are validated - what they did was wrong. Let her know if it’s not addressed, could happen again. Clearly she is close to her dad and doesn’t want to stop contact, so to ensure she can have contact, and feel safe, it’s needs to be talked about.

EXH and GF, even if drunk, will know they had sex. Even if they deny it to you when confronted, they’ll know. Calum discuss that DD was upset by these two repeated performances (both leaving a14 year old babysitting in. Hotel and especially the sex in front of her) and it cannot be repeated. No more babysitting until an appropriate age AND in home setting with support ready at hand if needed - especially silly no drunken state of both baby’s parents. Secondly, never again shared rooms as it’s shown on both nights they cannot stop themselves having sex in front of DD. If they can’t afford DD to have her own room, then don’t go on holiday. Advise you’ll need to know sleeping arrangements in advance of each visit to ensure DD is dafeguarddd in future.

I’m not conversant with safeguarding procedures but it was mentioned if you don’t report, that your own parenting comes into question. So perhaps sending an email to EXH to record incident and steps you’re taking to ensure no repeat performance will suffice (others can advise on that point). Perhaps concluding that DD was traumatised by the sex in front of her and that you’d like to address this safeguarding issue between yourselves without having to involve authorities but should anything happen again, it would be reported as well as this first double event.

Something has to be done to ensure no repeat of events. If they don’t think they did anything wrong, and did it twice (so not a one off mistake), without action they’ll likely do it again.

Motherwell91 · 03/09/2018 07:30

An awful situation. Talk to dd before talking to him she deserves to know first. Also you should take great comfort in the fact she could tell you. It shows what a strong open and safe relationship. Its sound like you and dh will be a great suport. I hope he takes responsabuilty .

NotTakenUsername · 03/09/2018 07:46

Safeguarding extends to the baby too.

I really think this must be reported. They have shown themselves to have very poor judgment.

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 03/09/2018 07:49

I'm not surprised you're bloody fuming. You have every right to be. Having sex in the same room as a young girl knowing full there was a chance she could/would hear or see. Thats abuse. Yes couples have sex but no one wants to see it or hear it and certainly not children. It's no wonder she's mortified.
I agree with pp it sounds like they wanted her there as a baby sitter.

NynaeveSedai · 03/09/2018 07:55

you don't have to report it to social services

You can, if you feel it would be helpful. But the only thing social workers will do is speak to her dad about it, and if you can do it yourself that should be sufficient.

You know him and you know how he may react. If he will be contrite and do what he needs to do to make it up to DD then good. If he will be defensive and minimise it then you may need to step in and say DD won't be coming to stay with him at the moment.

The getting drunk and leaving her in charge also needs to be addressed with him. I did say it should be just you and not your DH but I'm thinking maybe you need your DH to support you in this.

Notasunnybunny · 03/09/2018 07:57

Please please consult the professionals. They may take the stance some people have on here that is was a ‘mistake’ but the important part is they will be able to help the dd with her feelings. It’s not about punishing the ex and his gf, but it does need acknowledging to some sort of safeguarding team as there is another child involved here and you don’t want them to have to suffer the same in a few years.
Most important - dd is given help with processing the situation
Then- other child is protected from history repeating by educating the couple how damaging such behaviour can be