Absolutely raging - need to vent!!

[Cleanerrates]

14 year DD went away bank holiday weekend to the seaside with her dad, his gf and her 10 month old baby brother, she's seemed a little upset and withdrawn since coming back and tonight she finally told me why.
Two reasons - firstly for 2 nights out of the 3 DD was made to babysit her brother so her dad and gf could go out for dinner and drinks, apparently they were only at a bar a couple of minutes walk away so told DD to call if baby woke up and left her with a KFC for dinner both nights - ok some might say at 14 DD is old enough to babysit but they were all supposed to be on a holiday together.
Second reason I'm so raging I've sank a bottle of red in 20 minutes trying to keep calm. They all shared a room, DD was on a sofa bed, she heard/saw her dad and his gf having sex TWICE!!! First time she said she was facing the wall drifting off to sleep and heard them having sex, second time she was facing out into the room half woke up with a cramp in her leg wanted to turn over but saw they were having sex and shut her eyes and didn't dare move as she didn't want them to know she saw anything.... I'm fuming!!! DD said they came back from both nights out extremely drunk so don't know if they were both so pissed they weren't with it but what the actual fuck!!

DD has made me promise not to say anything to her dad as she doesn't want them to know that she saw/heard anything cos she's so embarrassed, upset and she spends every second weekend with them so doesn't want any awkwardness, obviously i wanna rip his head off but want to respect my DDs wishes. DH thinks I need to say something regardless of DD asking not to as he thinks it's too serious to just leave.

Wtaf Mellie?

Are you drunk? How can you even suggest that, 😱

That is epically bad advice Melliegrantfirstlady . Truly awful. What experience of child protection and safeguarding do you have that qualifies you to offer it?

Op, I'd also agree not to have him and his girlfriend to the house, what's the point, it will serve no purpose and he and she will downplay whatever occured.

Right now he's making his daughter out to be a liar. On everything. Her reaction to him based on the fact you said they had a good relationship tells you something went very very wrong during this trip. That says it all.

Tell them not to come round.

To answer Aurora - I think the OP has to tell her DD that what she has told her happened is something she, the OP, needs to understand very clearly because it's serious and ask her to talk through what happened on both evenings before her dad and his gf came back to the room. Someone telling the truth will repeat the same things. I think it's entirely possible the OP's DD did make excuses so she could stay in the room, but as a parent her dad could have refused to let her for her safety, etc. And of course, doesn't excuse his behaviour.

@Cleanerrates I don't think your DD would make it up. I'm sure she knows the difference between a kiss and a cuddle and what it sounds like to do more. Also they were both pissed so they will have a pretty woozy recollection of it. The overreaction from him can be guilt, not righteousness

And whatever actually happened, it's your daughter who feels scarred, she's the child, she needs protecting

@Melliegrantfirstlady you clearly have a previous experience with a "hormonal teenager" that is massively clouding your judgement here. Whatever experience it is that is causing you to be so out of line has nothing to do with this young girl and what she has experienced.

I just would not automatically believe a hormonal teenager

Then that's where you and i part ways.

Believe your daughter she needs to know that if she has anything worrying her that you are there for her. Don't let him bring her down with his defensive about his inappropriate behaviour, they need to know they should have boundaries of how they act around her. She is still a child and feel safe in her surroundings. Well done to you in the way you are dealing with this you are been a wonderful parent to her

Oh and why should the g f be included in the meeting. You and him are the parents. Is your partner going to be there? I think they are going to mob you so perhaps your other half should be involved in the discussion if she is

I believe both of them.

if you have no reason to distrust or disbelieve exH, then is it not possible that he got back to hotel and they had a pissed kiss & a cuddle under the covers that could quite conceivably look like full sex from across the room in the half dark.
I'm thinking how giggly and noisy we are when we roll into bed after a night out - it doesn't extend much beyond a cuddle sometimes but I'd be mortified if dc walked in as it could look like we were having sex. If this is the case he needs a stern talking to but I do think it's unfair to liken it to child abuse so not surprised at his reaction as I'd flip my lid if anyone suggested I'd hurt my children in any way.

Crossed posts same thoughts as @Melliegrantfirstlady

Why are you missing the point and defending thr father mellie qnd throwing this child under the bus?

Whether there was actual penetration or not is irrelevant. What ever happened on that trip was so damaging this child won't speak to her father whi she adored. So something happened.

And they left her with an infant for up to three hours. Alone. They came back and did something in bed, he's not disputing that, he's simply downplaying how much he did. He's also admitting to being drunk. As was she. Two nights running.

What part of that is defensible to you?

WhT kitty said. Get proper advice

He's used his daughter to facilitate his nights out with his gf. As if that wasn't bad enough, he's then acted as though she didn't exist by doing whatever he was doing with the gf when they were back in the room.

I wouldn’t discuss it with either of them any further-I’d report it to your local MASH team and ask for their help to investigate.

@Melliegrantfirstlady do you genuinely believe that the best way to deal
With this situation is to gang up on a child and accuse her of lying?? This poor girl is mortified. You seriously think have a big group convo is the way to deal with this?? To have her dad shouting and swearing and crying again in her face?? After the damage that has already been done that would be horrific for her. No matter what did or didn't happen.. the small possibility that this girl was mistaken does not take away from how she was made to feel by what she believed happened. Dealing with it the way you have suggested would be damaging not only in this situation but also in any future potential issues this girl has as she will never feel
Comfortable speaking out. It could destroy her.

I really hope you have a personal issue here that is clouding your judgement because if this is just how you think then I feel very sorry for whatever teenage girl you do have experience with.

I hope to god your experience of teen girls doesn't involve them trying to tell you of any serious safeguarding issues they might have encountered Melliegrantfirstlady because you are seriously fucking warped in your thinking if your first instinct is to call them liars.

OP, you might want to talk to your daughter and tell her what her father had to say but make it clear that you are not in any way doubting her or that you are not on her side in this. I honestly wouldn't question her any further about it though, maybe seek out a professional counsellor she can talk to, they know how to do it and can be objective where you can't.

I'm concerned about the baby too to be honest! If they think getting drunk and leaving your poor dd in charge then doing that in front of her then what else do they consider ok?

A kiss and cuddle can go quite far. That doesn't make it any better at all who knows if inter course took place. It was enough as it was to traumatise his dd.

Just because your dd may.. Have offered to baby sit maybe she felt uncomfortable and left out? Maybe they should have turned her down and insisted they all went.