My daughter is transgender- ask me anything

[EvelynTent]

Please be kind!

This is also helpful
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/trans-women-toilets-changing-rooms-rules-b992398.html

So providers can ban transwomen if it is proportionate to meet a legitimate aim.

Well I'd say keeping women and girls safe is a legitimate aim unless we live in a society that does not value women and girls.

Any organisation that put's the wishes of males above the safety of women's and girls is a sexist one, which should be called out on their sexism.

@lifeturnsonadime
No, I don't think that women should be put on any kind of a leash. I understand the tension between the needs of women and transgender people. I'm a mother whose child is transgender - not something I chose, encouraged or anticipated- and I have to balance my wish for my child to be happy, safe and fulfilled with living as a considerate responsible member of society. It isn't easy. The fact that some transgender women are sexual offenders is terrible, but I don't think my daughter is responsible for that - just as my son isn't responsible for the acts of predatory men.

My intention with this thread was to share some of my experiences- I realise many people won't agree with how I've chosen to play the hand I've been dealt and I accept that

Your child is an adult human male. You keep telling me he was an adult when he made this decision.

He has male genitalia and is as capable of causing harm to a woman as any other male. You have stated he has sexual disfunction but how is any woman or child supposed to know that when we face him in a space that should be single sex?

Your adult child is NOT responsible for the harm that other males cause women in single sex spaces but He should be considerate to the fact that his presence causes women harm. Once you let one male in you have to let them all in. There is no True Trans test and the presence of males in womens spaces HAS caused harm to women. They said it would never happen and now it has it is not bad enough.

You have come on AMA with a view that harms women. I can't help that. It has also harmed your adult son (he no longer functions sexually).

You keep talking about a 'middle ground' but you won't accept that this isn't one without ALL males staying out of women's single sex spaces.

We are not going to agree. Yours is a sexist position though. You are putting your adult son before women and girls.

And just one further question. Why does your son need to be in women's single sex spaces to be fulfilled?

He could go about his life fully and use the men's toilet safely when he's desperate.

Or is this about the validation of women? Does he need to be in women's single sex spaces to fulfil his fantasy of being 'seen' by other women as a woman?

I don't think she needs to be in women's spaces to feel validated - indeed she tries to avoid them in general. As I've said above, I don't clearly understand her feelings as I can't share them but it seems to me that she feels more physically and emotionally comfortable now that she is having treatment. The way she's described it to me is that she's always felt that her body doesn't match how she feels as a person. I don't think the issue for her is how people perceive her, but about how she feels- but as her appearance has changed people obviously do perceive her differently and now just assume she's a woman.

How do you reckon with the impact gender-affirming care has had on her fertility? What did your discussions around her desire to have a family of her own sound like?

We did discuss this and her consultant and counsellor also discussed it with her. She had the option of storing sperm prior to treatment. Ultimately she decided not to do that and doesn't plan to have children.

As to how I reckon with it - her particular autistic traits are such that I don't think she would want to have children anyway so it doesn't upset me as much as it might. The transformation in her mental and physical health has been so positive and dramatic that, for her, it outweighs the negatives.

Has your child shown any interest in romantic or sexual partners at all? Do you think she has capacity for that over the course of her life?

She says that she would love to meet someone and have a life partner but that she doesn't envisage it happening. She says that she doesn't have much interest in sex but likes the idea of romantic love and companion. This isn't just since transitioning, I think it's always been her view on relationships.

Do I think she has the capacity for a relationship? No, in all honesty I don't think she does but I would love to be proved wrong.

@EvelynTent, this thread shows how trans issues issues can sink into micro arguments about toilets and similar and don't address more important areas.
Trans people have families and others who love them. They are at the end of the day people, who do not have easy lives. Trans people have to live their lives as objects of curiosity and sometimes antagonism or aggression. The attitudes of others can reveal more about those displaying their attitudes than wanting to explore the issues.
Thank you for creating more light and avoiding reacting to the heat!
Trans men attract less attention, and certainly less venom, than trans women -although I worry for my son's physical safety from the modern equivalent of queer-bashers.
For the record, my son seems well-adjusted with no mental health issues. He works in a "normal" job, and has a (non-binary) partner. He has had top surgery and has eggs in deep-freeze storage. Sometimes he wears a dress and a lot of makeup, and if people find that a little baffling so do I. I just tell myself that labels should not matter!

@Namechangeparent
Thanks so much for that, I couldn't agree more. And how wonderful to hear about your son having a great and happy life - that gives me hope!

Have you really just written that op?

You've been sensible all the way through, and then this.

So, we have 'might get strange looks' vs 'might get raped.' Nice.

I've read now you have 2 boys, so have another question...Do you think you might feel a bit differently if you had 2 daughters?

Sorry that we disagree on that issue. Obviously as a woman myself I feel the danger from men and the tension between that and being a mother who cares about her child's safety is difficult to manage. Nice of you to say I seem sensible apart from that- I hope that broadly sensible people can disagree respectfully.

People can disagree respectfully.

But your position and your son's is not respectful of the safety and dignity of women.

I think you know this but don't care.

@EvelynTent, this thread shows how trans issues issues can sink into micro arguments about toilets and similar and don't address more important areas.

Single sex spaces are the most important issue to protect the safety and dignity of women and girls. That you choose not to see that is up to you. Toilets may seem. a minor issue but allowing males to enter into women's single sex toilets is the thin end of the wedge for all of the other invasions of spaces. A young girl was sexually assaulted in a supermarket single sex toilet by a trans woman but rather than ask the trans community to be respectful of single sex spaces and make women and children safe you'd rather blame women for raising it and call it a micro argument? That says a lot about you.

What more important areas would you like to address?

Trans men attract less attention, and certainly less venom, than trans women -although I worry for my son's physical safety from the modern equivalent of queer-bashers.

Trans men are women therefore do not pose the same risks to the safety and dignity of 51% of the population. They also don't seem to be as aggressive as the more 'vocal' transwomen towards women, being told to suck lady dick for trying to protect women's rights is not unusual.

I don't think any individual should be harassed for their appearance or sexuality and you won't find me doing it. Most of the aggressive behaviour comes from the TRAs. Blame them not women.

@arethereanyleftatall

I don't know how I'd feel if I had two daughters, I can only speculate. I care deeply about sex-based rights and would want my biological daughter to be safe as much as I want both my children to be safe I imagine. I'd also want them to be courteous and able to defend their own views whilst respecting those of others.

Thinking about this a bit more, I'm close to my half-sisters who are in their late 20s so not much older that my children. They're very 'woke'. When we discuss things they often get very emotional and call me transphobic. So if I had a daughter maybe she'd be trying to 'educate' me.

@EvelynTent - would you and your transgender child consider campaigning for third spaces alongside single sex provision? So that women and girls would still have the right to single sex spaces in toilets, changing rooms, hospitals, prisons, rape crisis centres, domestic abuse shelters, sports, dormitories on school trips etc? And campaigning amongst the trans community to ensure that they respect single sex spaces and especially the needs of the women and girls who use them?

I see that your child does not want to use single sex spaces to validate their identity as a 'woman', and that is admirable - but the problem lies with the trans women who feel entitled to invade our single sex spaces, and give not one tiny, shiny shite about the effect that has on vulnerable women and girls.

Even this week, a trans woman has been appointed as CEO of an Endometriosis charity - I know I am not alone in thinking this person has absolutely no idea whatsoever about the impact of endometriosis on a woman's life, or in wondering whether there were no women at all who might have been a better fit for the job. Yet again, the needs of actual women are being put second to the desire of a male born individual. It happened with Scotland's first Period Dignity Officer, when they appointed a man (presumably there are no women - actual, biological ones - in Scotland who menstruate??!) - that caused a massive backlash, but it seems lessons have not been learned.

Yes I absolutely agree with the need for gender neutral spaces alongside single-sex ones. I also think an endometriosis charity would probably be better run by an endometriosis sufferer. I don't agree with activists or people who insist trans people have a blanket right to enter women's spaces and I know my child agrees with me on most of these things. I'm not a campaigner by nature but there are more prominent trans voices along these lines - they don't seem to get the same attention as more extreme views

I know a lot of autistic people in my own social group who are often deemed asexual in this new world when in reality, due to their own challenges they need to feel comfortable with someone to engage in sexual relations or a loving relationship with them. A lot of them ended up in relationships a bit later than what is deemed ‘normal/average’ (early to mid 20s). Some reading:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32535668/#:~:text=Existing%20research%20suggests%20that%20people,being%20on%20the%20asexual%20spectrum.

To just accept at face value that an autistic person will never want a relationship or family (children are of course optional) is crazy to me, especially at 18. I’m a mother now, at 18 I was a ‘girl boss’ who never thought I’d have kids, I was also (and still am) gender non conforming. I’ve always thought of gender as BS, so what I don’t wear makeup and like baggy clothes? Does that mean my female card is revoked? That’s not gender, that’s a preference. My sex will never change, irrespective of my feelings or discomfort with female biology.

You do a lot of growing in your 20s, thankfully no one sterilised me due to my ADHD/trauma issues with romantic relationships. I get so angry seeing the new generation of NDs being sent down this gender pathway instead of receiving appropriate psychological care as I did.

They (therapists/social groups/family) say ‘asexual’ or ‘have a gender label’ and just accept it instead of offering care and support so these individuals can go on to have healthy relationships.

I'm glad things have worked out so well for you. My daughter was an adult so able to choose her own pathway but she did have extensive counselling and psychiatric evaluation so we hope she has made the right decision for her. It certainly seems that she has from what we see - she is much happier, growing in confidence and taking better care of her physical health too. We can never know the outcome of the road not travelled of course.

Dear OP,

I’d also like to echo a question around detransition. I’d ask your child to look into Richie Heron who is part of a group of detransitioners suing the NHS for transition without due diligence.

Ritchie found out he was actually Autistic and not gender dysphoric but has lost his genitalia due to gender surgeries. Worth looking into his experience so you can see the other side of the apparent ‘euphoria’. I’d be interested in your thoughts on the other side of affirmation.

https://www.transgendertrend.com/nhs-service-specifications-adult-clinic-legal-action/

https://seen-network.uk/posts/2023-03-12-detrans-awareness-day/

Note : not an attack, but this is the reality of when things don’t go right.

Yes, it's one of the reasons I encouraged such extensive counselling and am slowing the rush to surgery as much as possible. She is aware of de-transition stories but I think the immediate improvement in her self esteem that she's seeing at the moment outweighs it for her. She says that every day she feels more sure she's done the right thing - and we're years in now. She is thinking very carefully about the risks of surgery though and I hope she doesn't go ahead with it