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The self-ID petition is live #2

(922 Posts)
YesItsADebate Sat 17-Mar-18 10:42:59

Here it is:

The signatories now stand at 5444.

The grey areas on the map are:
- Airdrie and Shotts
- Staffordshire Moorlands
- Bassetlaw
- Harlow
- West Tyrone

The constituencies with the highest number of signatories are:
- Calder Valley
- Brighton Pavillion
- Lewisham West and Penge
- Lewisham, Deptford
- Bristol West
- Edinburgh North and Leith

It’s due to be reported in this week’s Mail on Sunday and Sunday Times.

Thankyou to everyone who has signed, shared, discussed and thought about this petition flowers

Ihavesomeballs Sat 17-Mar-18 10:45:46

Does it have to reach 10,000 to be heard in parliament? I genuinely don't understand how it's not in the hundreds of thousands considering the potential impact on women?

NoSquirrels Sat 17-Mar-18 10:49:27

It won’t even be “considered fur debate” let alone heard in Parliament until 100,000 signatures.

Article in Guardian today on Labour self ID shortlists and no mention of it, so please spread the word. Women just want a respectful debate but are being misrepresented- and then told its women misrepresentating trans people. It’s depressing.

Mouthtrousersafrocknowandthen Sat 17-Mar-18 10:59:47

Shon Faye says this:

Spaces that are currently segregated by sex, including women’s prisons and refuges, would still be able to make risk assessments and exclude potentially dangerous individuals, she argued. “If there is evidence that a person is a potential risk it is appropriate to exclude them,” she said. “What it is not appropriate to do is exclude someone for identifying as trans.”

Make a risk assessment of potentially dangerous persons.

This is the wrong way around. We do not have the resources or legal system to do this. This is impossible in practical terms. In one on one situations how do I do that?

BlackeyedSusan Sat 17-Mar-18 11:03:12

bed time monday: 2839 signatures.
bed time Tuesday: 4046
bed time Wednesday: 4659
bed time Thursday:5089
bedtime Friday: 5402

TheGoldenBough Sat 17-Mar-18 11:03:47

No one I have told about it, or about any of the issues, had even heard of the GRA let alone proposed changes or self id.

I've blown a few minds with it.

Although more people have dismissed it on the basis that I am a bit deranged and have clearly got caught up in some radfem propaganda that I don't really understand because, of course no one in power/politics/government would be so ridiculous as to believe 'transwomen are women' and just let any man say they are a woman.

That would be madness and an utter nonsense.

Ekphrasis Sat 17-Mar-18 11:05:34


NoSquirrels Sat 17-Mar-18 11:06:29

“What it is not appropriate to do is exclude someone for identifying as trans.”

The problem as I see it is not that people want to identify as trans - they don’t. They want to identify as women.

If they wanted to identify as trans I’d have no issues, frankly.

BlackeyedSusan Sat 17-Mar-18 11:06:36

eastist: eastphobic!

Kingston upon Hull EAST
Leicester EAST
EAST Antrim

I identify as East midlands I transitioned form the west midlands though it seems I have detransitioned again now and bringing up children west.

Stop the discrimintation about the east...

boatyardblues Sat 17-Mar-18 11:11:51

Glad to hear this is to be covered in the Sunday papers. I imagine there will be an uptick in activity on the petition tomorrow.

TheGoldenBough Sat 17-Mar-18 11:14:27

The problem as I see it is not that people want to identify as trans - they don’t. They want to identify as women.

They don't even want that, they want other people to believe that they are women.

Yep, identify as trans - no problem. Preferred pronouns - no problem.
Live free from discrimination and prejudice - no problem.

Deny my biology because it makes you <sad face> - I don't think so.

Mouthtrousersafrocknowandthen Sat 17-Mar-18 11:15:01


The current law refers to transgender, being transgender is protected. I think this is a subtle but important difference, it's the trans that is protected.

The Equality Act says that you must not be discriminated against because:

Of your gender reassignment as a transsexual. You may prefer the description transgender person or trans male or female. A wide range of people are included in the terms ‘trans’ or ‘transgender’ but you are not protected as transgender unless you propose to change your gender or have done so

NoSquirrels Sat 17-Mar-18 11:30:25

Mouth yes, absolutely understand it is trans that is law-protected. So that’s the official line when Shon Faye is speaking to journalists.

But when politicians are saying biology is outdated and transwomen ARE women - and therefore by implication it is transphobic to think otherwise - then that’s a radical shift.

It’s that radical shift that is problematic.


I am not able to agree that trans = female.

Ellenripleysalienbaby Sat 17-Mar-18 11:43:05

Risk assessing aside, what Shon Faye doesnt seem to understand is that women in a refuge just might not want to be around male bodied people, whether or not they have been deemed by an external risk assessment as 'dangerous'. He obviously thinks feeling that way would be 'discriminatory' because as we know, when it comes to male bodied people, women are not allowed to say no.

athingthateveryoneneeds Sat 17-Mar-18 11:47:13

I've just peak transed a colleague who has vowed to tell everyone she knows.

People don't know about this. Once they do,.they are agog.

CircleSquareCircleSquare Sat 17-Mar-18 11:50:22

Got a relative to sign in one of the previously grey areas.

OldCrone Sat 17-Mar-18 11:56:32

If transwomen are women the transgirls are girls and can share girls changing rooms at school, and their dormitories on school trips. I think this is the way to get people on board with this - look at what is happening to children.
This is the guidance for Scottish schools on Transgender students.

Quote from p.21

Good practice
If a transgender young person wants to share a room with other young people who share their gender identity, they should be able to do so
If a transgender young person is sharing a room with their peers, there is no reason for parents or carers of the other young people to be informed

Anyone who has children in school, particularly girls, should be concerned about this. Girls can be forced to share changing rooms and sleeping accommodation with boys, parents will not be told, and the girl will be labelled 'transphobic' if she objects.

Most parents will not be aware of this guidance, so completely unaware of what is happening in schools. The link is for a document relating to Scotland, but I have seen others for the rest of the UK including one from the cps.

TheGoldenBough Sat 17-Mar-18 12:10:26

Yes, OldCrone and if any of the actual girls are uncomfortable, they are the ones to be moved.

What happens if all the actual girls are uncomfortable? There will be a boys dorm and a transgirl dorm. Where will the girls go?

OldCrone Sat 17-Mar-18 12:19:55

It's the issue of not telling the parents that really bothers me here. I wonder how often this has already happened without parents knowing anything about it. I have seen threads on here about parents finding out about a transgirl in the changing room, but the girls don't want to make a fuss because of the 'transphobia' label. This may be the tip of the iceberg, with some girls not even mentioning it to their parents for fear of being labelled transphobic, due to the way young people are being brainwashed at the moment.

OvaHere Sat 17-Mar-18 12:27:39

This is a response to the peak trans threads on reddit from a young college girl in the US. It's typical of what seems to be happening all over the place.

I play intramural soccer at my college and we have a men's division, women's division, and co-rec division (I play in the women's division only). Anyways, when a couple of clearly un-transitioned MtF players joined the women's division, a lot of us just hands-down said this is nuts, they are obviously male and they can play in the co-rec division. And no they should NOT be in the female locker room with us. That was basically peak trans for me, taking the view "some women are male and some men are female, but we still need separate spaces for males and females."
Our school policy for intramural sports is to go with self-identification, no medical treatment required. So unfortunately there is not much we can do, or else we risk being reported to the dean for "discrimination."

IAmADancer Sat 17-Mar-18 12:33:12

It’s because people still don’t realising what’s happening. I had my neighbours round for dinner last night and was explaining the situation to them and they were horrified, but it’s just not out there in there general public enough. Most people don’t even know what the gender recognition act is let alone what they are trying to do to it. I think also, with newspapers like the Guardian and Independent promoting the acceptance of trans without questioning what it means for women it just makes us look like we are bigoted. It’s incredible frustrating that there is no conversation happening around this in the wider public domain. It’s such a tricky subject to discuss.

MrSlant Sat 17-Mar-18 12:57:44

Am I allowed to shout BINGO for Wales or would that lower the tone of the thread?

YesItsADebate Sat 17-Mar-18 13:05:00

<high-5s circlesquare>

I’m about to have a topless photo shoot to go in the papers alongside the #ManFriday story. Don’t say I’m not willing to take one for the team blush

BlackeyedSusan Sat 17-Mar-18 13:08:39

good luck yes... taking more than one for the team.

YesItsADebate Sat 17-Mar-18 13:09:29


Bingo is acceptable!

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