can I insist in WFH in this situation

[helloMickey]

Content warning (added by MNHQ)

I work in a hybrid role though work can be done fully from home.

DC (13 years old) has poor mental health and did attempt to commit suicide 2 weeks ago. Adamant, they will try again. Loads of people involved now (camhs, crisis team, ss). Been told I have to provide 24/7 supervision due to ongoing suicide risk. Been WFH since it happened but work are now making noises and asking me to find a babysitter or someone else so I can do my hours in the office. I have no family and a babysitter for a suicidal teen is completely inappropriate. DC will not be able to cope with a stranger ATM. I have no way of knowing when the situation will improve. Do I have any legal right to WFH in this situation and if so, on what grounds? Google wasn't helpful.

I manage my workload fully from home despite the hugely stressful situation. I was just hoping my LM would be understanding. But maybe I expect too much esp since it's open end.

What's more important, your team or your child? Come on, I understand you're trying to do what's best here, but if the worst was to happen you wouldn't care less about your team. You're minimising your own condition too, you are not 'just' really stressed, stress is real and important. Take the time off work.

If you have a niche role that is good. However lets take all the emotion out of this and say there is no way you can carry on like this with your son in this situation. You will not be working 100%. Can you offer part time working as a temporary option?

The other thing is who will be doing your work when you are not working 100%? Does it get left? Done by someone else?

What's your workplace like, what space is available? Could you push back and ask to bring your teenager + their laptop with you? ...

(note I also think this is highly unlikely to be appropriate just found myself thinking around the problem a little too much ...)

I hope you can find a way forward and that your DS starts to find himself in a better place.

The GP can sign a fit note stating you are only fit for work if you WFH. Its the second box on the fit note, shouldn't be an issue for the GP to do and the employer should not ignore the medical advice for you. Ask for a referral to their occupational health team as well. So sorry you and your family are under so much stress, sending hugs OP 🫂 💐

I am sorry to hear about everything that has been happening OP. I'm not sure if this will help, but there is some useful guidance here:

https://www.carersuk.org/help-and-advice/work-and-career/your-rights-in-work/

I disagree, in a situation like this if an employee can't fulfil their normal working obligations they need to be signed off sick. Hard to say if the employer is BU here, or if they're highlighting the fact that OP shouldn't be working and trying to care for an unwell child. I've been in a similar situation where an employee was very stressed and not coping but refused to leave work. It makes it worse for everyone.

big open plan office with 30 people. completely out of question. It's a child that needs support, not a circus act (sorry if this is coming across too blunt).

So do you think you can work 100% if you were at home? No difference in productivity?

Could you escalate above your LM? Or even talk to a sympathetic colleague and see whether they can talk to your LM?

Just thinking about it from a work perspective, I imagine it’s a tricky situation to them to manage. Is there any chance they are attempting to lead you into going off sick for your own benefit without actually saying it? From their perspective I wonder how it would work if people were trying to get hold of you but couldn’t because you’re dealing with your teen? Or if your performance is suffering (understandably) how can they broach that with you without adding to your stresses? It would obviously depend on your role and who you interact with etc as to the likelihood of the first scenario.

I’d like to think as a manager I’d be as accommodating as I can be (which would involve agreeing to your WFH request) but I do think it’s slightly more nuanced than them just being unreasonable dicks.

I hope things get easier for you and your DC soon though.

Just echoing what others have said really, your employers are being morally wrong, but I don’t think technically they would be in the wrong sadly, and could argue the case that you should be in work, as callous as that is. I agree the best bet will be speak to the GP and explain that while you are currently fit to work, that’s only because you are able to work from home, and the insistence on having to go into the office will cause a huge amount of stress and render you unable to work at all.

Take the safety plan with you when you see the GP/share the email with them.

I do not work full time. I give loads of breaks. I do not have customer contact. I can do my hours given I have flexibility. Hope this makes sense.

The post you quoted states op needs the money, the link you posted is for unpaid leave?

It isn’t a question of being callous. Unfortunately since you don’t know how long this will go on for (presumable years?), the company would then have to make the role permanently work from home. As this then is against their hybrid policy, it would open the door to everyone else in the company working from home which clearly they don’t want. I know it isn’t nice but they are thinking of everyone and unfortunately no matter how awful your situation not just you.

Should they make a temp provision? Yes. It’s been two weeks so clearly they want to know what’s going on and what the next steps are as it can’t go on indefinitely.

No, you don’t have legal recourse to wfh. You can request it and they have to evaluate it and let you know their decision but it doesn’t sound like they will say yes. Also, it doesn’t help your case if you have to be at home to supervise your child 24/7 but are still working as they will feel that you should be focused on work during working hours. Again not nice but true.

I would ask to meet with HR and agree a set time (a month?) to allow you the space to settle in this situation and hopefully get some more help for your daughter. Giving a deadline will get them off our back and will give you some breathing space. You can then see where you are then.

You can also take unpaid parental leave until the kid is 16 so you may want to look into that. And holiday of course…….good luck.

I feel that insiting you can't work at home could be classed as discrimination by association (as currently your child I would argue disabled) . I'm not saying it would hold up in court but might give your employer pause for thought. Also you can be signed of work by a private GP. Good luck - sounds really stressful.

i am so sorry, OP. Have NC for this.

It happened with my (slightly older) daughter. I told my direct boss exactly what happened and that i would prefer to WFH for the foreseeable. They agreed and offered me a lot of flexibility and understanding that i hadn't asked for but much appreciated.

Have you told anyone at all why you want to WFH? I know it is hard but if you can tell one person who is in a position to help push this through, in strict confidence, please try.

Ultimately, 4 years later, i had to downgrade my job, then change jobs because i couldn't cope with the old one. It has been worth it, although my daughter is still mentally not 100%. But she is working on it.

How are you feeling? do you have someone you can talk to IRL?

Don't just not go in when your manager has told you to. I think your manager is being unreasonable BTW.
Can you talk with your manager again (not text/email) and explain its a temporary emergency, that you dont want to go off sick with stress but feel you are being pushed to do this... when you really want to work.

If no joy, perhaps appeal their decision to a higher level.

Yeah but I think it gets a bit sticky as you are fit to work and fit to work in the office, it’s just that you can’t because of your daughter.. so a fit note for you doesn’t work….

No. OP. You have to put your child first here.

It would only be advisory, the employer does not have to agree and could say you need to be off sick until you are able to work in the office.

You can self cert for a week by the way. I'd suggest doing this right now, just call in and say you're off sick with stress, or poor mental health. It gives you a week of breathing space.

If you're hybrid, does that mean you go into the office a set number of days usually? You could say you're sick on those days but not sick on your WFH days and then have two (or whatever it is) days off sick a week. I suspect you need the rest anyway if you're awake all night as well with your teen.

While I don’t think there are any ‘rights’ as such in your situation, if you were fired, you could claim sex discrimination on the grounds that caring responsibilities affect women disproportionately. I suspect that, though it’s hard to see how, some sort of timeline or compromise would show willing. Eg the date of an appointment at which future care needs will be discussed or some sort of childcare one day a week.

How likely do you think she’ll work ‘100%’ in the office, as she’s wondering if her child is, at that moment, killing themself?

I know many mumsnetters think it’s a hobby to out bitch each other, but some of these posts are vile.

Anyone writing snide comments to a parent in this situation needs to ask themselves what is wrong with them.

@helloMickey While seeing your GP is not a bad idea, and seems to be your only option really, I just wanted to clarify that even if your GP is happy to write that you're only fit for work if you can work from home, it's only advisory to your employer.

They can involve Occupational Health; or they can decide that you WFH is unacceptable to them and therefore you are unfit to work overall, and then you'll be off sick.

If you've already levelled with your LM and there's no movement from their side, you may just need to take the 6 months sick pay, and then see how the land lies. If things have got better with your DS, and I really hope they have, you can return then. If they haven't, you may have capability assessments, but you could choose to resign at that stage, I believe.

All the best.

So sorry you are going through this OP. My DD was very similar and tried to take her life multiple times. I simply couldn't leave the house for over a year (apart from the shops or a quick walk around the block for sanity) unless I knew she'd be asleep for a while in the morning.

To those who are saying that you can't work to full capacity when at home if you are ok suicide watch. This wasn't the case at all. My DD was either up in her room as the op has said staring into space/ sleeping or watching something on her laptop. I'd pop up for 2 minutes to check in on her every hour or so

I would appeal to your Manager and HR department to extend the WFH due to extenuating circumstances. Ask them to refer you to occ health.

If not, go to your GP and get them to sign you off with stress, you are entitled to sick pay.