Is maternity leave sexist ?

[mozhe]

I think so.....surely it should be parental leave that is available to both parents,( or maybe even members of the wider family network, like grandparents ? ), and there should be financial incentives to encourage both parents to take it. What do other people think ? Instead of trying to make maternity leave longer should we not focus on supporting parents back into work sooner and providing better/cheaper/more appropriate childcare...

big fecking yawn yet another thread started by the 'same' poster trying to not spark intellectual debate but to ram her views down throats of others!

fwiw not I dont think maternity leave is sexist, yes i do think it would be great for fathers to be able to have longer off when new offspring arrive but men cannot breast feed unless of course milk expressed..

ditto no way i could have gone back quickly as emergency c-section, post op complications, breast fed for 12 months and also PND.

lol @ ghosty's post

I worked up till 2 weeks before hand, in a job similar to Gingerbears but on a much smaller scale. No need for the clambering as I would have broken all our posh and expensive pipework if I had tried. I had 4 months off and went back on full shifts. DH had 2 weeks off, unpaid and had to take another week off as I got re-admitted to hospital. His boss refused to pay him paternity leave as he said 'you won't be milking the system just cause your wife spat out a kid!'.

However, he used the 2 weeks as a holiday and winged a lot when DS woke up, cried or I asked him to do some housework. He wasn't that great so I was happy to see him go back. He's much better now DS is older and can do stuff.

I don't think it's sexist as has been said before, men don't get pregnant or breastfeed. Sometimes it would be better if they had more time off to help but if they don't help, they cause more stress. I would have been happy if when I went back to work, DH could have had 4 months off with DS but that would be unlikely.

nd for anyone who works in a predominately male enviroment, they spend the last month before you give birth asking if you're okay, panicking everytime they can't find you and kecking their breeks whenever you stand near a puddle. My shift boys made me promise not to go into labour at work. We had a plentiful supply of sterile stuff but they were terrified. Mention a dilated cervix and they ran, screaming!

I intended to work up until 34 weeks, having worked through horrific morning sickness ( all day sickness really...threw up in the waste bin a few times! ) had one week off early on due to a big bleed....

fell at 32 weeks, had a bleed, and therefore started maternity leave early...

DH had 2 weeks of paternity leave

this time, I was not working , so it was not relevant

Mozhe...have you seen the blogs from people who have chosen to remain child free..and curse us 'breeders'? they equate maternity leave to a sabbatical, and say that if they wanted 6 months paid leave, no way would they get it

well , get this. maternity leave is not a holiday..!! and yes it is sexist in as much as only women get it, but until men can get pregnant, that;s the way it;s going to be!!

this i sdone in Canada, parents can spilt the 52 weeks 'leave' however they want, I know of a few couples where the mum took the first few months off and then the father took a few too. Seems to work
breastfeeding might be a problem though

In Australia the leave is parental - same as twentypence said for NZ. Lots of my friends split the 12 months leave between parents. Sometimes separately, sometimes together. Can't see that it has made much of a difference to the 'glass celing' though.

I thought taking the last few weeks off before birth was brilliant. And who cares if I'm not sick - its all coming out of my leave. Besides, despite being healthy, I could no longer drive to work.

Interestingly, if I take sick leave after 29 weeks, the company can force me to start my maternity leave anyway.

My male boss ask me not to move around too much in case I fell over (which I had done a couple of times).

I was even provided with an arm chair to take naps as and when I required. I wonder if my male colleagues thought that was sexist?

Look, many men (and employers too) have to have it spelt out to them that pregnancy/birth/breastfeeding does drain a woman's physical resources a bit. Maternity leave reinforces this so that women get a chance to take it easy in the last few weeks, mostly for the sake of the baby, and to prepare for the endurance test that labour/birth can be. Some ladies might risk doing permanent damage to their bodies if the keep working too long in late pregnancy.

Some men would selfishly take the chance to be the one to stay home and pack the mother of their child back off to work with barely healed stitches, leaky boobs and troublesome piles. Some men, in a relationship where both parents work, will not take turns at getting up in the night when babies/children wake. Some men take every opportunity for a weekend lie-in or mid afternoon nap, leaving their other half to yawn her way through to bed-time.

Wasn't child benefit originally payable to the mother of the child to ensure it stood the maximum chance of being used for the benefit of the child in question, rather than just increasing the spending power of the father ? (men definately controlled the majority of families' finances when it was introduced).

Please note I am not generalising here but there are thoughtless/selfish husbands and partners in all walks of life and for their wives/partners non-negotiable ringfenced maternity leave is a godsend. Lets not consider it sexist, it just makes best practice in caring for a pregnant woman THE LAW.

Maternity leave is not a perk based on your sex it is necessary to protect pregnant women and mothers of tiny babies from unfair demands of employers and in some cases husbands/partners.

Its not sexist, its a sad necessity in the current government backing of the "get out to work if at all possible" theory of workforce management coupled with potential male attributes of thoughtlessness/ immaturity/selfishness not being altered as the females are by pregnancy hormones.

P.S. I took vey short maternity leave myself for (selfish) personal career reasons but that was my choice.

gscrym

And I thought I had the monopoly on self-centred husband thinking 2 weeks paternity leave would be a sort of holiday.

He moaned that "he hadn't got anything done that he planned to do with his time" because of my needs/demands and looking after ds1 whilst I attended to the new baby.

I agree very much that it depends what your job is. If your feet are swollen, you shoes don't fit, and your job requires you to stand all day then you might prefer to start your leave and go home and put your feet up.

However, I much preferred to go to work in the last few weeks, especially when I had a toddler at home. And I remember feeling a bit pressured to start my maternity leave. I could tell the men araoung were a bit uneasy, as if they didn't want the burden of me going into labour at work. And this annoyed me. I wanted my time off with the baby not before he was born. And it was their problem not mine if they were uncomfortable with very pregnant state. I had every right to be there, and I was going to start my maternity leave when it suited ME not them. So, I think these pressures go both ways. And, of course, I do realise that I was fortunate to have uncomplicated pregnancies.

I remember that getting dressed and then walking up the hill from the cark park to the building which I used to swear got bigger every day was quite a chore. But, once I got to my desk I was so happy to know I could just sit there for the rest of the day. And I definately didn't want to be at home waddling around after a toddler.

I was a right narky cow just before I finished work on mat leave & I think they were somewhat grateful.
I also stopped safely fitting behind the wheel of the car.

It was in no-ones interests for me to work up to my dd/labour

Grrr, DH kept saying 'I'm so tired, I need a bit of time to myself, I've got work home with me, can't you take him out for a bit'. How dare I struggle to walk because of tight stitches.

The other classic was 'would it be okay if I go down to the country park (he volunteers there), they're awful busy and I don't have much to do here. It's not like I can feed him'.

I don't agree that we should be encouraging parents into work sooner I believe the current maternity entitlements are about right in terms of length of time away from the workplace. I do agree that we should be supporting parents more in terms of more affordable/appropriate childcare if they wish to go back but I am not sure how to do that.

The current maternity guidelines could be construed as sexist but in my opinion it is important that the first 6 months are taken by the mother as opposed to the father as we should be encouraging exclusive breastfeeding for the first 6 months and it is important that the maternity guidelines reflect this.

What really makes me angry is the blatant sexism that goes on in companies in relation to maternity/paternity entitlements. I know of countless companies that offer enhanced maternity benefits for women but only offer the bog standard statutory paternity pay to men. I know of one firm that offers incredible benefits to women they receive 100% of their pay for 6 months are guaranteed a part time job and receive a retainer bonus when they return and yet they only pay the poor men 2 weeks pay at the statutory rate... I don't know of any legal challenge to these type of practices but I am sure a tribunal would rule in favour of the men if it was challenged.

Oh come on ! People DO try it on with this pregnancy malarky....most people do have problem free pregnancies,( actually my last, twin, pregnancy ended at 32 weeks...but I was at work and it wasn't that dramatic and came on over a number of hours...),and don't really need weeks and weeks off.As I said those that do for genuine medical reasons could have it...Working is good for people and that includes the pregnant 'Protective' men just have to be put in their places !

Depends what you do.....

Mozhe, mine was a twin pregnancy and I was exhausted from the beginning. I really suffered with tiredness, nausea for the first 16 weeks and was so big by 28 weeks that I had trouble walking.

One of my colleagues is 28 weeks pregnant and is suffering from blackouts due to the stress she is under with her job (she nearly crashed her car last week whilst undertaking her 30 mile journey home).

There are women who have problem free pregancies and there are those who don't. Either way, it is up to them when they take their maternity leave, whether they return to work full or part-time or not at all and nobody has the right to enforce their preferences onto another. In the era of serfdom that may have been the case when the working class wenches had to be subservient to their middleclass lords and mistresses but in these more enlightened time, women can make their own choices.

Also looking afer your children is work because if you don't do it, you have to pay someone else to do it.

Mohze, HOW REDICULOUS

"People do try it on with this pregnancy malarky"

It's not trying it on, it's using the time allocated by the Government in the best way for you.

3 months off before birth = 6 months off afterwards.
Work until you pop = 9 months off afterwards.

It's that bizarre concept called "MOTHERHOOD". Some ladies HAVE to work, and some ladies CHOOSE to work, but don't try and suggest that we are somehow "trying it on" if we don't work, or take mat leave.

Who is paying you to harrass women who SHOCKINGLY do not put work at the top of their list?

Mozhe, Do you also tell mentally ill patients to stop trying it on and get a grip?

Why de-value motherhood in this way? I don't understand it.

Mozhe obviously thinks we should squat behind a filing cabinet and give birth and then get straight back to work.....

"'Protective' men just have to be put in their places !"

I shall remember that.

"Working is good for people and that includes the pregnant"

hmm - I guess you work in a nice office job sat at a desk with not much time on your feet, 'normal' working hours, and not much physical work - oh and of course as you're working 'normal' hours you don't have to look after your 2 younger children during the day........

I went back to work with ds1 and ds2 at 9 weeks (was the rules back then) and ahted it- was no use at all, I sobbed through the first few weeks. But financially we had no choice. With ds3 I took a year off *before returning to study) and if we have a No4 I would again, it worked so much better for the family. My CM and the nurseries here don't tkae until 6 months anyway, so tehr wouldn't be an issue (Mum ahd them before but we moved away)

Should it be interchangeable with DH? Oh yes, if I was at Uni I twouldn't want to miss graduation- i'd be back quickly, but that would be for 8 hours a week- hardly full time. 8 hours that Dh can cover due to his shifts.

I worked up to 36 weeks with ds1, ended up really, really ill (hyperemesis then pre-eclampsia), when i got to twenty weeks with ds2 work offered me paid leave! (ther was more to it- boss had made an ill advised pass and been seen by Dh- but it was purely their own guilt, I said nothing at all). With ds3 I meant to work until 36 weeks, but at 32 baby stopped growing and tbh I was so tired that my work was suffering, I was working with parents abusing their kids which with the hormones amde it ahrd- although it was sheer exhaustion that had me in the end.

Flexibility is the key. Bt Mum shoudl have to agree it- because I agree there are some lazy / abusive men out there who would see it as a skive. not amny, mind you.