Who gets ovarian cancer?

[JellySaurus]

A 19 yo woman goes to the doctor with classic symptoms of ovarian cysts or cancer and is fobbed off with classic medical misogyny of periods are painful and her symptoms are due to anxiety. Result: life-changing consequences that only a woman can experience.

Enlli Thompson seems to have amazing positivity,despite what has happened to her, and I hope she goes on to live a fulfilling and healthy life.

Then the interview with a Gp who claims to always pay attention to these symptoms. This attentive GP refers only to 'people' with ovarian cancer, as does Cancer Research UK.

49% of PEOPLE are at no risk whatsoever of ovarian cancer. 49% of PEOPLE are never going to have their possible cancer symptoms dismissed as period pains.

WOMEN. Only women get ovarian cancer. Only women have their symptoms dismissed as 'normal' period pains. Only women have severly or increasingly painful periods dismissed as 'normal'. Only women get thrown into menopause by medical treatment. Only women have to live with the extreme consequences of premature aging as a result.

Not just medical misogyny but also medical dishonesty.

BBC News - Ovarian cancer and menopause at 19 mean I can't have kids, but it's changed me for the better
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cy9wn7w4982o

So young to have to go through all that 😡

What a lovely and brave woman, I hope she fully recovers. It's appalling how often women's reported symptoms are dismissed.

This hostility to trans men and nb people is exactly why some don't access critical gynae services when they need to.

It's why they ignore the pain and hope for the best, fearing how they will be treated by HCPs.

Inclusive language on healthcare messaging is critical for encouraging them to attend screening, get early symptoms checked out and avoid the worst outcomes.

I am related to a trans man who had ovarian cancer (not my son, who is also trans). The cancer was massive, had spread, and he nearly died. He was a teenager at the time, and not one HCP cared how he identified. They treated him with dignity and respect - as should be the due of every person who needs help.

He was also subjected to medical misogyny in how his fertility was considered more important than making sure all the cancer was gone. They were wrong, and had to reopen his (huge) scar only a few months later to do a the full hysterectomy they had refused him the first time.

Its really obvious they refused to do the hysterectomy because he was trans and they decided he wanted it for gender care reasons. They took the decision his fertility mattered more, despite his (correct) fear that the partial procedure they decided on put him at high risk of cancer recurrence.

It is medical misogny which we need to be fighting. The idea that our fertility is more important than our pain is something so many women have experienced. And guess what, trans guys do too.

That is our enemy. That is what we need to fight.

All this would make sense if the same language was used for men/male cancer. Instead it’s NEVER testicular cancer in people, they always use the word ‘men’.
Does it mean that the person you call your son will now have to deal with the possibility of getting testicular cancer because you address him as ‘man’?

Also, you can’t experience medical misogyny if you are a man. It just does not exist.
Bet if I asked for a double mastectomy because I had male feelings they would have given it to me faster than when I had to justify my decision because of cancer. Almost a decade in my oncologist stil asks me whether I’m sure I don’t want a reconstruction. THAT’s what medical misogyny is.

I'd say it was a matter of context and language (people are pregnant rather than have a prostate). And as I pointed out, inclusive language is used for trans women & nb people who have a prostate (e.g. "anyone who has a prostate" is often used).

But if you're determined to be nasty about my kid there's probably no point. Trans men exist, and language evolving to accommodate their increasing visibility is an just inevitable.

Also, about inclusive language. Let’s do that! Let’s also include women in the inclusive language!!

I truly hope the young woman in the article is able to recover fully and take care of all her scars.

‘But if you're determined to be nasty about my kid there's probably no point. Trans men exist, and language evolving to accommodate their increasing visibility is a just inevitable.’

Please. I’m not nasty and I’m not against inclusivity. If you want that though you add to the group, not detract. What’s wrong with ‘Women and people who have a uterus’. If your son’s feeling need to be taken into consideration mine are as delicate.

Cervical and ovarian cancer messaging most often uses 'women' but inclusive language is becoming more common. You're only noticing the inclusive campaigns.

Same with Prostate Cancer UK, which overwhelmingly uses 'men' but frequently uses 'people living with prostate cancer' too. You can see examples of this on their landing page. The site also urges trans women and nb people to get checked.

But sure, be shitty about trans guys accessing care for ovarian cancer. That'll solve medical misogyny, rape culture and the difficulties women have accessing any care at all.

That's our big issue. Words on a frigging poster.

@TransParentlyAnnoyed

The site also urges trans women and nb people to get checked.

Which nb people? Are there any clues?

“anyone who has a prostate" is often used

This is never used. Because trans identifying men don’t want to be reminded that they aren’t women, don’t want language used that doesn’t call them women, and everyone complies because they’re cowards. And no one cares that “men, get your prostate checked” excludes trans identifying women. Because they’re women so no one cares.

Reading the article I don't see medical misogyny. I see a rare disease that was correctly diagnosed & treated. Ovarian cancer in young women is fantastically rare. It really isn't the first thing that comes to mind when a 19 year old complains of abdominal pain. From the article

Cancer Research UK said about 120 young people aged 15 to 24 are diagnosed with ovarian cancer in the UK each year, and about five in Wales.

There are about 180,000 young women aged 15 to 24 in Wales.

DOI I am a retired male A&E consultant

Thank you for a medical viewpoint and the DOI.

Even if it were not the case in this specific instance, women's pelvic pain is routinely dismissed, our suffering is seen as 'natural', we are routinely infantilised by doctors and we are pissed off about it.

I’m quite surprised to see @TransParentlyAnnoyed describe the experience of a transman as ‘misogyny’. There was quite an extended discussion on another thread trying to make the case that it is transwomen who experience misogyny because “TWAW”. During that discussion, it was highlighted that that leaves no word for transmen as, if transmen are men, they cannot be subject to misogyny.

Of course those feminists who understand the centrality of the female sexed body to the oppression and discrimination that women face, have never disputed that transmen would be subject to misogyny. As I said, I’m just surprised to see the likes of TPA agreeing with us.

"NBs with ovaries" is as accurate and just a little more concise than "female NBs except for those who have had their ovaries removed during a hysterectomy they may have had for many reasons, including the treatment of other gynaecological cancers"

Brilliant example of misogyny to demand womens healthcare needs to be made gender neutral because of the extremely small number of female people who don't identify as women.

Trans ideology only removes from women: female specific healthcare, terms, words, respect. It never adds anything and never works for women.

I mean it was in relation to Prostate Cancer UK, but if you think NBs with ovaries need checking for prostate cancer you do you.

I've said it several times.

All trans people experience misogyny, and talk about how it affects them. Why on earth would that be a surprise to you?

Hatred of women affects everyone perceived as a woman, therefore it affects trans men, trans women and nb people.

It is the root of homophobia, transphobia, biphobia and acephobia.

Misogyny isn't hatred of our tits and specific genitals. Misogyny is why cis men judge and hate our bodies.

We know that there will always be some excuse for that. We didn't dress up enough, or dressed too much down. Dared look too masculine or feminine. Transitioned, or didn't transition to their satisfaction.

Misogyny unites all of us.

"All Lives Matter"

Misogyny isn't hatred of our tits and specific genitals. Misogyny is why cis men judge and hate our bodies.

Misogyny stems from men wanting to control women's reproduction and sexuality.

Which is why men can't experience it.

A man looking at another man and thinking he doesn't like his fake breasts, is not displaying misogyny.

Transitioned, or didn't transition to their satisfaction.

Lol

Indeed, this smacks of all lives matter, classifying oppression so generic that you can never demonstrate the negative impact and hides the reason of the oppression in woolly words.

It also runs counter against the argument that the rootcause of experiencing misogyny is the way women and girls dress and if they only dressed differently...

Ah, the shooting themselves in the feet party are objecting to the consequences of shooting themselves in the foot again.

Look. If trans people have challenges accessing health care because the words everyone else simply uses to refer sex are words they project their own personal ideas of gender and identity onto, the very very simple answer is just to ... not project their own personal ideas of identity and gender onto everyone else's sex.

Accept the words "man","woman","boy" and "girl" don't in fact mean personalities or genders, they just refer to sex, and as if by magic, being referred to by your sex, in a circumstance where sex matters, cannot in any way negate or deny anything about a person's personality or gender because the trans person themselves very existence proves these are different things to sex.

All that is needed, all that has ever been needed, is to have different language for sex and gender and the whole thing is solved. Gender-first people can make clear cases for why and when we need to consider gender rather than sex from the ground up without finding themselves defending the undefendable, and Feminists can focus on women and girls without having to defend our right to exist outside the sexist boxes Genderists wish to put around us. Win all round.

@PollyNomial "NBs with ovaries“

This is getting ridiculous!! You mean women! ONLY women have ovaries.

Misogyny: It oppresses women who know they are women, and women who think they are men, and women who don't think they are women or men, and men who think they are women, and men who think they are women just some of the time, and men who don't think they are women or men, and men who look a bit like women.

Not exactly catchy is it.