Is advocating the ridicule and scaring of trans-identifying children deeply concerning?

[Whatchamacallitt]

The full post can be seen here.

The first reaction should always be ridicule, denial of the demand and an adult response so scary, from the home to the school to society in general, that never again will a child make the statement of cult initiation... "I am Trans/Non-binary". That point of declaration is the death of childhood in the most brutal way possible, our response should be equally brutal.

Am I the only one that finds this response extremely disturbing? Trans-identifying children are deeply vulnerable with high rates of abuse, living in care and being autistic or homosexual. How could ridicule and being 'scary' possibly have a positive effect in that situation? This just seems outright abusive to me.

What trans-identifying children need is kindness, empathy and honesty about the immutable nature of their sex. They need an adult they can open up to and discuss the factors that have led to them rejecting their healthy body. Bullying it out of them will never work and only lead to them being more isolated and disturbed.

Yes, but who he?
I'm not on X, and this random guy's post reassures me that I'm not missing much.

Yes, that is a deeply disturbing response to trans-identifying children/teens. I can't imagine any good would come of it. Adolescents exploring and developing their identity need reassurance and intelligent, respectful discussion, not ridicule and fear-mongering.

Who is he? A random man or someone of political or scientific importance?

If a child comes to you declaring their transness the first reaction should be….
Breathe
See your child
Hug your child
And tell them you will do your utmost to make them feel good about themselves. That you will love and support them.

To me, that doesn’t involve prescribing puberty blockers, cross-sex hormones, Go-Fundme page creation for future ‘top’ surgery - grandparent education to reconfigure their grand-daughter to grand-son etc…

To other parents, the above applies.

I think the latter reaction is misguided. Wrong, however well-intentioned. I can’t do anything other than object. Please don’t affirm your child’s self-loathing - no matter how many people are cheering you on and flag-waving. Please trust your gut.

I don’t know that guy but he sounds awful.

All boomer ranting achieves is pushing 'wrong think' underground & distrust.

If you can't discuss issues with your children without losing it you will soon find you won't be discussing anything of consequence. If I had a dollar for every perversely repressed dysfunctional weirdo with this kind of parenting I'd be a trillionaire.

I agree its always weird that you have a forum on an open platform, and then there are random posts from X or reddit as though they are something we are all part of.

Even though we have chosen to be on MN FWR not part of the tech bros online night mares.

But without bothering you with the details he is a gay man, who refutes the pairing with all the QTI whatever bit.

And someone referenced boomer. Not relevant at all.

In a possibly not very nice way he it telling the forced coalition with all the various parts of the rainbow to FO.

And has participated in the Battle of Ideas etc.

And now I am pissed at myself for even bothering to have this maybe gay, but quite likely misogynist, reality in my hear.

Of course if he has millions of followers that is a concern.

But as X is now one of the smallest (in terms of users) SM platform not something to worry about, but shame his name will now be linked to FWR.

I think the latter reaction is misguided. Wrong, however well-intentioned. I can’t do anything other than object. Please don’t affirm your child’s self-loathing - no matter how many people are cheering you on and flag-waving. Please trust your gut.

You see this is as insidiously harmful if not more so than the original post. The suggestion that gender non conforming children who seek to align their bodies with their minds are only 'self loathing' or they (& their parents) are 'brain washed' fails to recognise their cognitive autonomy over their own biological reality.

And anyone that advises 'trusting your gut' rather than medical expertise a safety risk to children.

Children don’t have cognitive autonomy. This is why we don’t let them drink, drive, gamble…..and we certainly should not let them make harmful changes to their biological reality.

Ah no, yeah they do.

Bell v Tavistock was a case before the Court of Appeal (England and Wales) on the question of whether puberty blockers could be prescribed to under-16s with gender dysphoria.[1] The Court of Appeal said that "it was for clinicians rather than the court to decide on competence" to consent to receive puberty blockers.[2]
The case was related to Gillick competence, the legal principle governing under what circumstances under-16s can consent to medical treatment in their own right.

Ridicule and causing fear are never the best way to react to a child.

recognise their cognitive autonomy over their own biological reality.

Um, nobody has autonomy over their own reality. Unless you're Neo and you live in the Matrix, or something.

False. Depends how you define personal reality. While we rarely have total control over external circumstances, biology, or the actions of others, we possess a fundamental degree of autonomy over our subjective reality.

@Whatchamacallitt

Why did you not post the entire tweet?

https://x.com/headwarriortwm/status/2075102679789928541?s=46

“ The first reaction should always be ridicule, denial of the demand and an adult response so scary, from the home to the school to society in general, that never again will a child make the statement of cult initiation...

"I am Trans/Non-binary".

That point of declaration is the death of childhood in the most brutal way possible, our response should be equally brutal.

This is firstly an educational problem, whatever else is going on we must ensure that we do not create a therapeutic continuum from the first claim to whatever follows.

When we do it becomes a bedrock.

That must never happen, and parents require alternatives and we should give it to them.

We must lay out a path of consequences, clearly, through education, persuasively designed, brutally honest, and which firstly attempts to divert the child from any therapeutic intervention or pathway.

That is the reality of what we have created.

Yes some children will get hurt. But they will not be fed into the maw of the monster by allowing it credence it does not deserve.

Many more will be saved, and the word will spread.

So be it.

Some times the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

I would like to talk to genspect CanSGorg, segmebm about creating a boundary between the clinical argot and practice of their field and the argot of my field, education.

I think this would be helpful for us all.

What do you think? “

He has definitely used words that are problematic. Why not discuss the context in where and how he has used them too though?

I suspect he is trying to use dramatic words to catch attention and it is not articulated well at all. I don’t believe that Barry is calling for child abuse though.

I believe he is attempting to convey that therapy should have greater focus on honesty about outcomes for those children. I read his full tweet and he is talking about being honest about the very scary future health issues and the realisation that a childhood decision was not the correct decision after all yet will have caused irreversible harm.

I suspect though, that some people will believe that being upfront about those harmful effects, even sensitively handled will be considered ‘abusive’.

Indeed.

No one can control how they are perceived by other people. It is also a fruitless task of controlling the environment someone lives in to only support a subjective and personalised reality while material reality just rolls on.

The point is adults & minors can govern their own thoughts, values, and beliefs. People can choose to reframe a situation, adopt a different mindset, or decide what holds meaning for them.

The idea that individuality should be subjucated to popular social opinion is exactly why authoritarian parents can't communicate effectively with their children that no doubt contributes to mental dysfunction.

https://parentingscience.com/authoritarian-parenting/

You see this is as insidiously harmful if not more so than the original post. The suggestion that gender non conforming children who seek to align their bodies with their minds are only 'self loathing' or they (& their parents) are 'brain washed' fails to recognise their cognitive autonomy over their own biological reality.

Why do these children feel like need to conform to gender stereotypes though? Why must their perception of their minds "align" with the relatively superficial aspects of their body? It is only our society (often including their parents) telling these children they're wrong and that they must either change their personality or their body to become gender conforming in either the traditional way or the trans way.

There is another way. One which doesn't seek to erase homosexuality, constrain autism or paper over experience of abuse: Genuine acceptance of not conforming to gender stereotypes. And psychological support if needed.

Not seen anyone advocate authoritarian parenting.

It's good to critically analyse the culture kids grow up in though. Recognise the homophobia, sexism, ableism and child abuse that is often found in the background of these crises of identity. (If you don't believe me read the biographies of adult trans people in their own words)

Allowing kids to truly be themselves is going to involve an element of safeguarding them from the above aspects of society/ culture.

Yes they can have their own thoughts.

The context of being able to change sex is a lie. One that has irreversible consequences that children can’t conceive of because they’re children.

if you’re arguing against his tone/ approach here I’d agree.

if you’re saying that they should / could be allowed to think they can believe a damaging lie. Then no. It’s a concept outwith the comprehension of children.

How many children has this man seen through to adulthood, and what have their lives looked like?

Id certainly put advocating for ridicule and fear responses quite authoritarian.

The point is adults & minors can govern their own thoughts, values, and beliefs. People can choose to reframe a situation, adopt a different mindset, or decide what holds meaning for them.

Well then, what's the problem with helping trans kids reframe the situation from "I'll die if I don't get socially transitioned right now!" to "I can be happy in my own sex" ? What's wrong with helping them adopt the mindset that "I owe it to myself to wait until I'm an adult to make adult decisions" ?

And someone referenced boomer. Not relevant at all.

Yeah. I doubt there are many "boomers" about that have teenage kids.

Are they really conforming to cultural pressures or more expressing internal inclinations or both? You're assuming feminine & masculine inclinations are only learned rather than a complex interplay of biology, evolutionary psychology, and social conditioning.

And aligning one's body to mind isn't exclusive to trans people. Cis people routinely engage in gendered body modification en masse via exercise & medical interventions. Are you going to suggest that they too are hapless victims of social pressures & should cease & desist?

The idea that parents & people in medical authority are "telling" children to choose a life of objective social & medical struggle is preposterous because there simply are zero incentives to do so. It's just another version of 'gay groomer' mentality we’ve seen many times before that authoritarian conformers attempt to impose. In fact the MRA are notorious for asserting feminism is all about 'man envy' & the ideological grooming/contagion of mindless emotionally led infantile brained women. The parallels to gender critical are astonishing.

There is another way. One which doesn't seek to erase homosexuality, constrain autism or paper over experience of abuse: Genuine acceptance of not conforming to gender stereotypes. And psychological support if needed.

So no more mocking of 'men in dresses' so long as they don't call themselves 'women'? Save the hypocrisy.

Not according to the highest appeals court in the UK that armchair pontificating isn't qualified as.

Lol.no he's calling for emotionally abusing your children. Don't cover for him.