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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Guardian: weaponised emotional blackmail from 14yo 'trans' athlete

392 replies

teawamutu · Yesterday 17:40

The Guardian's rearguard action on reality continues. Apparently the problem is not the parents and authorities who conspired to lie to this boy, coddle his delusions, disadvantage all girls around him in the service of his own wishful thinking etc etc etc: it's definitely the people who pointed it out:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jun/17/trans-athlete-no-one-should-face-vicious-attacks

I am prepared to feel a little sorry for the kid, who couldn't have been exposed like this if the useful idiots around him had done their fucking jobs. But the Grauniad can fuck off with the tired 'beee kiiiind' shit as a solution. Been there, binned the t-shirt. We want our shit back.

I’m a 14-year-old trans athlete. No one should face the vicious attacks I have faced | Lina Haaga

People understand gender differently, and I was taught to respect all ideas. But the vitriol I recently experienced was not a healthy debate

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jun/17/trans-athlete-no-one-should-face-vicious-attacks

OP posts:
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6
OttersOnAPlane · Today 09:19

EvieBB · Today 08:45

Absolutely!

2016 called. They'd like their scaremongering hyperbole back.

Because as the Tavistock themselves said, that sort of suicidal idiation simply didn't happen.

When a delusion persists in a child, you get them help to handle the delusion. You don't tell them they really can fly.

TheywontletmehavethenameIwant · Today 09:20

TransParentlyAnnoyed · Today 09:12

Her sister celebrated the win, because her sister's a decent person who can cope with normal human difference.

You're online being abusive to a child.

His sister has been conditioned by her parents to accept her brother as her sister.

TheKeatingFive · Today 09:20

TransParentlyAnnoyed · Today 09:12

Her sister celebrated the win, because her sister's a decent person who can cope with normal human difference.

You're online being abusive to a child.

Imagine being this poor girl. Knowing that she has to put her own feelings/ambitions aside to allow her entitled brother to enter into her sex class and beat her.

Denying the extraordinary misogyny of this is gross

TheKeatingFive · Today 09:21

TransParentlyAnnoyed · Today 09:12

Her sister celebrated the win, because her sister's a decent person who can cope with normal human difference.

You're online being abusive to a child.

Making the boy that he can't change his sex is not abusive.

Scientific reality is not abusive. If you think it is, you need help.

EvieBB · Today 09:22

GreyskySexRealistsky · Today 09:01

I would like to explore these ^ questions further too, @EvieBB

Also: where is the "right" body? Where does that go?
How is the decision between right and wrong made?
How does the right/wrong process actually happen and at what stage of life? At conception? At birth?

I've always wondered about these things and I'm glad you're here to answer these questions.

I don't know. I don't need to know. But if somebody is distressed as FEEL that their brain is female and yet their body is male (or vice versa) then who am I to judge them? Have some empathy for the love of God please.

GreyskySexRealistsky · Today 09:24

EvieBB · Today 09:22

I don't know. I don't need to know. But if somebody is distressed as FEEL that their brain is female and yet their body is male (or vice versa) then who am I to judge them? Have some empathy for the love of God please.

I have empathy. That's why I want to understand. That's why I asked you.

teawamutu · Today 09:25

TransParentlyAnnoyed · Today 09:05

Jesus. The article literally says that trans people in sport is something that can be debated without personal abuse...and you're personally abusive to her.

To a child.

I've posted on here a lot about the very real, very sexualised abuse trans children suffer, especially at school, because of adults indulging in online dehumanisation and hate speech. It is destroying young lives.

'Coddle his delusions' is hate speech, yeah. It's ignorant transphobia.

Just say you're angry this article humanised her, and you're afraid of that.

Oh, hello. You showed up later than expected. The 'unhinged accusations about prurient interest in children's genitalia' square on my TRA bingo card will not remain empty much longer then.

FTR I have not personally abused this boy; I have in fact expressed some sympathy for him growing up surrounded by lies. Seethlaw's very eloquent perspective has really brought it home afresh to me.

However, I think enabling his entitlement did him no favours and he's going to have a very difficult life if he thinks everyone who doesn't give him what he wants/play along with his delusions hates him and wants him dead. People like you reinforcing that belief will be particularly unhelpful.

I'm not going to engage with you further because we've done this several times before.

OP posts:
EvieBB · Today 09:25

EdithStourton · Today 09:01

I was of course suggest therapy to try to unpick things
@EvieBB if you suggested that you would be accused of being a bigot because you weren't immediately rushing to affirm the person's belief.

That's how it goes. I don't think you know all that much about this topic. Many of us began where you are, wanting to be kind, tolerant and accepting. We became aware of safeguarding issues, of vulnerable teenagers getting caught up in a group where they finally found friends and who drank the KoolAid to stay with them, of the undermining of women's sports, if the sexist BS that underlies all of this.

I obviously don't know much about this topic then.....I am just wanting to be kind and accepting but would never want to affirm anything as I realize that these things (for the vast majority) is just a phase or confusion and part of growing up for some ....but I do feel that there are genuine lifelong cases

TheKeatingFive · Today 09:26

EvieBB · Today 09:22

I don't know. I don't need to know. But if somebody is distressed as FEEL that their brain is female and yet their body is male (or vice versa) then who am I to judge them? Have some empathy for the love of God please.

It's not about 'judging'

Delusional thoughts are not a new thing for humans.

But we don't affirm these delusions. He's not a girl. He hasn't been born in the wrong body. He needs to accept his body as it is.

Just as we would say he isn't Napoleon, a dinosaur, an alien, etc, either

TheKeatingFive · Today 09:26

EvieBB · Today 09:25

I obviously don't know much about this topic then.....I am just wanting to be kind and accepting but would never want to affirm anything as I realize that these things (for the vast majority) is just a phase or confusion and part of growing up for some ....but I do feel that there are genuine lifelong cases

You can't be 'accepting' of a boy as a girl without negatively impacting girls though.

teawamutu · Today 09:27

EvieBB · Today 09:22

I don't know. I don't need to know. But if somebody is distressed as FEEL that their brain is female and yet their body is male (or vice versa) then who am I to judge them? Have some empathy for the love of God please.

Not judging, and 'playing along with the pretence to the disadvantage of every girl or woman in his radius' are two very different things, wouldn't you agree?

No argument with the former, not prepared to do the latter. Girls and women matter too.

OP posts:
SwirlyGates · Today 09:27

TheKeatingFive · Today 08:59

As for the 'born in the wrong body' discourse

Why is this only only ever presented as the brain (or 'soul') in opposition to the sex organs? What about all the other elements?

If the sex organs can be 'wrong', can anything else? Lungs? Kidneys? Big toe?

Well there is Body Dysmorphic Disorder, affecting your acceptance of your physical appearance, such as your face (Mayo Clinic has a wider range of examples). The NHS lists it as a mental health condition, and suggests drugs and therapy.

Body Identity Integrity Disorder is more serious, and can involve a wish for amputation, but is also listed as a mental health disorder, with preferred treatments being drugs and therapy. Apparently, as well as the well-known limb aversion, this can indeed focus on toes or fingers. No internal organs are listed.

nhs.uk

Body dysmorphic disorder (BDD)

NHS information and advice about body dysmorphic disorder (BDD or body dysmorphia), including what the symptoms are and what can help.

https://www.nhs.uk/mental-health/conditions/body-dysmorphia/

NotBadConsidering · Today 09:27

EvieBB · Today 09:25

I obviously don't know much about this topic then.....I am just wanting to be kind and accepting but would never want to affirm anything as I realize that these things (for the vast majority) is just a phase or confusion and part of growing up for some ....but I do feel that there are genuine lifelong cases

But what is in the wrong body? What part of someone? If you think it’s possible for this to be lifelong for some people, what is in the wrong body for their lifetime?

TheKeatingFive · Today 09:29

SwirlyGates · Today 09:27

Well there is Body Dysmorphic Disorder, affecting your acceptance of your physical appearance, such as your face (Mayo Clinic has a wider range of examples). The NHS lists it as a mental health condition, and suggests drugs and therapy.

Body Identity Integrity Disorder is more serious, and can involve a wish for amputation, but is also listed as a mental health disorder, with preferred treatments being drugs and therapy. Apparently, as well as the well-known limb aversion, this can indeed focus on toes or fingers. No internal organs are listed.

I agree body dismorphia exists. It is however a very serious and rare psychological disorder. It is not a metaphysical misalignment due to some sort of processing error.

EvieBB · Today 09:34

TheKeatingFive · Today 09:26

It's not about 'judging'

Delusional thoughts are not a new thing for humans.

But we don't affirm these delusions. He's not a girl. He hasn't been born in the wrong body. He needs to accept his body as it is.

Just as we would say he isn't Napoleon, a dinosaur, an alien, etc, either

I absolutely wholeheartedly disagree.
It's feasible that you could have been subjected to a glitch in the development process as an embryo which could cause this phenomenon.......you don't know how these things work or why they happen. Neither do I

Perhaps one day this will be explained scientifically.
.. but comparing it to feeling like a dinosaur etc isn't the same thing at all and a ludicrous analogy

SwirlyGates · Today 09:36

TheKeatingFive · Today 09:29

I agree body dismorphia exists. It is however a very serious and rare psychological disorder. It is not a metaphysical misalignment due to some sort of processing error.

I had a male relative who, over 30 years ago - so well before the trans tsunami - had a full "sex change" operation. At the time I felt sympathy for him as to do such a thing, in your 50s, suggested deep unhappiness. As time goes on and I know more about it I wonder what the hell? What was he really thinking, and why did anyone do this operation on him? He's long gone and I'll never know.

EvieBB · Today 09:38

Seethlaw · Today 08:56

If someone is going to commit suicide because they are denied to be who they feel they are then I'd say it's bloody real to them!

It's real to them, yes. Doesn't mean it's real period. And when someone believes something that's factually untrue, the right answer is not to affirm that delusion:

As explained in a previous post, perhaps it is factually true in that there was a glitch in the development process in the womb and their brain was flooded with the "wrong" hormones causing a disconnect between brain and body.
Perhaps one day scientists will be able to prove that these people aren't delusional but feel perfectly reasonable owing to a perfectly reasonable physiological phenomenon

TheywontletmehavethenameIwant · Today 09:39

SwirlyGates · Today 09:27

Well there is Body Dysmorphic Disorder, affecting your acceptance of your physical appearance, such as your face (Mayo Clinic has a wider range of examples). The NHS lists it as a mental health condition, and suggests drugs and therapy.

Body Identity Integrity Disorder is more serious, and can involve a wish for amputation, but is also listed as a mental health disorder, with preferred treatments being drugs and therapy. Apparently, as well as the well-known limb aversion, this can indeed focus on toes or fingers. No internal organs are listed.

Something genuine co-opted to support their fantasy like DSD conditions.

EvieBB · Today 09:39

Seethlaw · Today 09:00

You're talking about a scenario that doesn't happen. NO child goes on for years and years believing they are trans, to the point of feeling suicidal about it 10 years down the line, WITHOUT having been affirmed and encouraged to keep thinking they are trans. You don't need to worry about this happening.

Good

teawamutu · Today 09:40

EvieBB · Today 09:34

I absolutely wholeheartedly disagree.
It's feasible that you could have been subjected to a glitch in the development process as an embryo which could cause this phenomenon.......you don't know how these things work or why they happen. Neither do I

Perhaps one day this will be explained scientifically.
.. but comparing it to feeling like a dinosaur etc isn't the same thing at all and a ludicrous analogy

Perhaps one day some scientific cause will be found.

But right now, there's absolutely nothing. Would you agree that basing laws disadvantaging girls and women based on a male's unverifiable feelings is a bad idea? Because that is the logical conclusion of your understandable wish to be kind.

OP posts:
GreyskySexRealistsky · Today 09:40

EvieBB · Today 09:34

I absolutely wholeheartedly disagree.
It's feasible that you could have been subjected to a glitch in the development process as an embryo which could cause this phenomenon.......you don't know how these things work or why they happen. Neither do I

Perhaps one day this will be explained scientifically.
.. but comparing it to feeling like a dinosaur etc isn't the same thing at all and a ludicrous analogy

And until such day occurs in the future in the scientific world, society is expected to put girls and their achievements in second place to boys. Got it.

NotBadConsidering · Today 09:42

EvieBB · Today 09:34

I absolutely wholeheartedly disagree.
It's feasible that you could have been subjected to a glitch in the development process as an embryo which could cause this phenomenon.......you don't know how these things work or why they happen. Neither do I

Perhaps one day this will be explained scientifically.
.. but comparing it to feeling like a dinosaur etc isn't the same thing at all and a ludicrous analogy

This still doesn’t explain what is in the wrong body. Your theory: something goes wrong in the development process, so [mysterious thing X] is meant to match the body it’s in but is actually in the wrong body? The development of what leads to this?

Seethlaw · Today 09:45

EvieBB · Today 09:22

I don't know. I don't need to know. But if somebody is distressed as FEEL that their brain is female and yet their body is male (or vice versa) then who am I to judge them? Have some empathy for the love of God please.

It's not empathy to encourage delusions. It doesn't help anyone and certainly not the person suffering from the delusion. Having empathy is looking for a way to gently ease them out of it. It's not a matter of judging; it's a matter of helping people live in the one and only reality.

RedToothBrush · Today 09:46

EvieBB · Today 08:55

Utter bollocks. I wouldn't feed my child anything!. Ever! You absolutely don't know me! I wouldn't want my child to be trans and would discourage those feelings!!
BUT, BUT BUT if my child was feeling suicidal because they thought they'd been born in to the wrong body and were insistent on this after years and years and years (without any encouragement from me) then I would not deny them their feelings. THAT would be stupid and dangerous and abusive and could lead to suicide. I was of course suggest therapy to try to unpick things BUT if that didn't work then I would listen to my child and allow them to feel and live as they feel is true to them. It's called empathy. Perhaps you should try to develop some.....

The disproven emotional blackmail of suicide.

TheKeatingFive · Today 09:49

EvieBB · Today 09:34

I absolutely wholeheartedly disagree.
It's feasible that you could have been subjected to a glitch in the development process as an embryo which could cause this phenomenon.......you don't know how these things work or why they happen. Neither do I

Perhaps one day this will be explained scientifically.
.. but comparing it to feeling like a dinosaur etc isn't the same thing at all and a ludicrous analogy

But kind of glitch?

What you've says there is complete speculation. You have zero evidence to support it.

If you think you're a dinosaur, why couldn't that be a different kind of 'glitch'? If we're working in the realm of total speculation