Do you avoid the bathroom if there is a transwoman?

[PeachyDaisy]

I’m going to an industry event next week and I know there will be a transwoman attending. Should I use the disabled bathroom to avoid an awkward encounter or just continue to use the women’s and hope not to run into them?

Do you really think if he was a predator he’d choose to do predatory things at his own work event and risk his career? No. He’d choose to do it in a random public toilet where no one knew him. Mountain out of molehill

Gosh you're so right!! I mean no woman has ever been sexually harassed at work by men they've worked with closely and that everyone knows

I would expect the crime statistics would be the same as a woman as they are women.

As I have mentioned many times previously in this thread, that I do not agree with men masquerading as women and calling themselves trans. These men are extremely dangerous and damaging to the trans community, and this thread and particularly you, are prime examples of how confused your average Joe is, who has little understanding or experience in this area.

You seem incredibly angry and that’s justified if it is directed at the right people. However to direct it at everyone including the innocent, is extremely unfair. It’s like saying all men are rapists and hating all men on this basis.

Anyway, I won’t be responding to anymore messages on this thread. I’m saddened by mumsnet and will be taking a break. You can enjoy your echo chamber with your extreme views and hatred. Don’t let it eat you up now..

As a rule I wouldn't but I know one who I would purposely avoid because they are creepy.

I would expect the crime statistics would be the same as a woman as they are women.

Trans identified men have the same offending rate as men in general. Not unexpected as they are men

Yes. He would choose to things he thinks he will get away with at work. Of course he would. History has shown this time and time again.

Part of behaving in a predatory manner is to do things that because of a power imbalance, the male person can get away with.

This is also a situation in Australia where there are TV advertisements telling women it is transphobic and hateful to leave a situation with a male person with a transgender identity if the woman feels uncomfortable. The TV ad basically instructed women and girls to suck up their discomfort. Knowing this dynamic, and that currently the law is untested and even mentioning that a male person is a man can lead to negative ramifications, of course a male person might choose to act in a predatory way at work. Being able to do it without them having negative ramifications is part of motivation.

Here is the ad

https://www.vic.gov.au/theunsaid

Transgressing boundaries knowing that women are powerless to stop you due to policies is exactly the predatory behaviour that we are talking about.

@Plasticdreams I'm going to ask the same question I always ask.
At what point does a man become a woman?
( the correct answer is that they don't. Ever. )

So, no matter how much evidence people post for you, you choose to remain ignorant.

Good to know for next time. You aren’t interested in engaging with facts and discussion about facts.

Waitingforthesunnydays I don’t believe TW belong in women’s spaces either but seriously, what do you think is going to happen?! He’s just trying to live his life.

I have been out all day so only read this far this morning but can I ask, has logic left the building? What does this even mean? "No, he shouldn't be there, but hey no biggie". That's absolutely nuts. Which reminds me of Naomi Cunningham's wise words:

It’s like the “no peanuts” rule for a peanut-free dish. If you label a dish “peanut free”, you have to leave the peanuts out. All of them. The fact that lots of people like peanuts is no answer. Peanut-free dishes aren’t about those people: they’re about the people who may go into anaphylactic shock and die if they eat a peanut. It doesn’t matter if the peanut has been mashed to a paste, moulded into the shape of a walnut and scented with walnut oil, so that no-one looking at it, smelling it or eating it would dream that it might be a peanut. It doesn’t matter if it’s got a special certificate that says that for legal purposes it’s a walnut. It still needs to be left out of the peanut-free dish, or the peanut-free dish ain’t peanut-free.

https://www.legalfeminist.org.uk/2024/11/06/sex-peanuts-and-statutory-interpretation/

There was an Anaesthesiologist ( in Brazil I think) who sexually assaulted female patients during operations when other staff were present. Predatory men will do predatory acts in the workplace.

No

As I have mentioned many times previously in this thread, that I do not agree with men masquerading as women and calling themselves trans.

As has been asked innumerable times before, including on this thread, how does one tell the difference between "men masquerading as women and calling themselves trans" and "genuine transwomen"?

What, exactly, are the easily identifiable signs of a "genuine transwoman" as opposed to a "man masquerading as a woman and calling himself trans"? They need to be detectable at once when encountering a stranger.

”It’s like saying all men are rapists and hating all men on this basis.”

No. It isn’t like that at all.

Women on this thread had been very clearly saying some male people are rapists and safeguarding decisions are made in that basis and not one male person with a transgender identity has changed out of the male category for risk assessment for safeguarding. Therefore, while some male people are rapists, so too are some of those male people with transgender identities. Hence ALL male people are treated the same as per strong safeguarding principles.

In fact, it is you who is also arbitrating who is and isn’t transgender based on your personal criteria.

Oh Grow up.

I have trauma and part of that manifests as needing a single sex space where I am vulnerable in one way or another, as much as I can.

I can’t describe what led to it, as it gets deleted as being too upsetting for others to read. But I’m sure the regulars know.

Why are my rights less important than a man’s?

What if the lad puts a dress on? Is it OK then?
If not, why not? What's the difference between him and a full grown man in a dress?

Firstly I'm going to take the liberty of doubting that this is true. But secondly, and more importantly, how can you not see that, if it IS true, it's worse?
So now we are saying that men who are able to convincingly lie about their sex might well be lurking about in women's only spaces and we will never know if they're there or not.

No! Women who NEED single sex spaces to be single sex, for reasons of PTSD from sexual assault or religion as for example, should not have to worry that a man might be in there and they won't even know it.
That's horrifying! How can you not see that?

And ALL women deserve privacy and dignity from men in these situations where they are vulnerable. it's no less horrifying to place ANY woman in that position. It's removing her autonomy and her right to decide.
So no, they don't get to come in if they "pass" . They're still men.

Yes, men often DO do predatory things at work.

For all those saying that they are perfectly fine with it, nothing to see here!

What would you do if you were in a restaurant with your teenage daughter and you clocked a man following her into the ladies? Nothing? He's obviously fine? Of course not.

If the man was wearing a dress, though? Ah, leave DD to it. Best not be seen as a bigot.

If you would do something in the first case and nothing in the second, you might want to consider who might take advantage of your safeguarding brain falling out of your ears.

Quite frankly I don’t give a fuck who else is fine with it.

no one else gets to consent for me.

Why doesn't the TW need to grow up and go in the men's?

Given that... he's a fully grown adult man?

Quite agree.

It actually makes me feel sick how much of a consent violation it is and how dangerous it is in terms of the attitude and how much of a slippery slope I think it is.

anyone who doesn’t care that women don’t consent is on a dangerous road.

Not to mention all the teachers/priests/police officers/sports coaches/celebrities etc who use their position of trust to gain access to vulnerable positions.

that’s how most of them do it. Oh he’s a priest, he’s celibate, of course he’s not going to abuse little jimmy….

Nope it is not like saying 'all men are rapists' at all.

This has been explained repeatedly.

No not all men, including trans identifying men, are rapists. But some are.

And if you give special privileges to a certain group of men to come into female spaces by uttering magic words, you are likely to attract those with bad intentions.

So all men stay out. No exceptions.