Daughter in early 20s lonely due to GC views

[Currentquandry]

My daughter is in her early twenties. She is GC and is struggling because so few of her peers have similar opinions. She is very lonely because of this. Are there any online groups she could join to give her a sense of community? She is also ND. Thank you in advance for your advice…

I was told by a young woman doctor that she has absolutely no problem being in a changing room with a trans-identifying man. A psychiatrist friend responded ‘would she be ok with it if they had an erection?’, which gets to the nub of it, really.

'Terf ideology ' is simply a case of trying to reverse engineer 'trans ideology' - but without first understanding what is meant by an 'ideology' in the first instance.

If someone doesn't think things through critically ( which doesn't mean simply responding with an emotionally rooted 'opinion') then having a genuine discussion or debate is just not possible - because in order to do that you have to be able to effectively counter an idea or a view-point by challenging its very foundations. And you cannot do that unless you can understand what those foundations are.

This is where so many trans activists and allies go wrong......they've never really understood the opposing arguments; they've simply been trained to respond with emotion and false assertions.

Would you trust someone you didn’t know with thousands of pounds worth of AV equipment without supervising it? Why are the non white people not organising the events? So someone comes up with an event, does a lot of the work abd is then told to step back so someone else can take over? Is the person taking over more qualified? Do they have the same skills and connections? World they expect the person stepping back to support them or step back completely and let them get on with it?

“I was told by a young woman doctor that she has absolutely no problem being in a changing room with a trans-identifying man. A psychiatrist friend responded ‘would she be ok with it if they had an erection?’, which gets to the nub of it, really.”

This reminds me of the reaction of Laurie Penney about girls turning their head so they would not see evidence of a male person’s arousal as he got into a spa bath with her and her mother in what was advertised as a female only spa.

'Normalise the bulge'

And how are you defining feminism...what does it mean to you?

Lol this is the same shit she said. She can "supervise" her equipment. She just wouldnt be named as someone hosting the event.

The non-white people arent organising the event because they arent in any leading roles in the charity in the first place which they (eventually) understood was problematic if complex. A way that they could address this without just giving anyone a job in the charity based on their skin colour is to facilitate people who use the charity (ie women) in taking leading and organising roles in a voluntary capacity. It would be beneficial for many of them as something they could include in their CV, too.

The issue with "why don't disadvantaged people run their own stuff" is that said disadvantaged people are often too busy surviving to have the resources to do take that on without support. They often don't know how to navigate the red tape associated with these things and that is where someone with education, qualifications and money/funding can use their platform to raise others into these positions.

Really, this is an issue we should be teaching girls about. Risks, boundaries, red flags.

Instead they get the opposite 'be kind' and lots of flak for spoiling men's fun.

It may be relevant that her training will have required her to become familiar with examining both male and female bodies. She will, for example, have been expected to put on a glove and perform a prostate examination. She may well have examined testicles for signs of cancer. Most people don't have those experiences as part of their work life.

Yes I think its this age group in particular that were very much brainwashed with all the TRA stuff. The tide has turned now and my 16 year old dds friends are all gender critical.

What about insurance, though? She perhaps would need to be named on an event to ensure 3rd party, event, indemnity etc?

Speaking of which, I have (as I am sure you have too) seen that attempt too. Where we were told that a male person’s arousal reaction was simply uncontrollable and it was not meant to traumatise women and girls of a male person was in that female single sex provision with that reaction.

It was a few years ago, but I do think I remember seeing it either here or on twitter.

Content warning; Vague memories of Darren Merager explaining or excusing his semi while in that spa? Was it discussed in court?

Would she have been acknowledged officially as having provided the equipment and contributing? (Eg on a program or on a website?)

That could have been it. It sounds right.

I dont know. Probably not. Why does she need that acknowledgment.. surely the non-white women who face DV are the ones who are most important. Not even the ones who are leading, just generally, the people centred for this were meant to be BAME women at risk of DV.

Why is it important that she gets a thank you in writing? Shouldn't she be doing this because she cares about the issue?

No probably not. She can borrow this stuff to jazz up a BBQ at someone's house so I really doubt that is an issue. She just wanted to be known to be involved in the organising. Probably so she can point to it when arguing with a Black woman about her experiences: "look see i have as much insight as you, I organise events for Black women"

So people are expected to provide their Labour, skills and equipment with no acknowledgement. Ok. What are the others providing?

Don’t charities acknowledge the efforts of others when it is a specific effort?

I thought that was standard practice.

Sure, somenpeople are keen on virtue signalling. I dont like the phrase, but it does describe a thing.

Coming back to this specifically, because it was a decent question, politely framed.

For me, it's all about balancing different needs. It's pretty obvious that there isn't a ' perfect ' solution ie one that makes everyone happy. If there was, someone would have found it by now.

So we have to find the compromise that is most practical, most workable, satisfies the needs of the most people.

I've already said I think we should trans-specific prisons, and rape support groups that are either specifically trans-inclusive, or trans-exclusive. That way everyone is safe.

I've also already said that I think trans women should not be competing in women's elite sport.

Regarding bathrooms and changing rooms however, it's more complicated. Mixed facilities are fine - but difficult to retrofit where they don't already exist. But ultimately, I believe that the right of trans women to have a space to shower / pee / get changed is greater than the right of non-trans women to be protected from the occasional sight of a penis.

If the trans woman in those facilities is intimidating, masturbating, leering, or whatever - then call an attendant, or better still, a cop. Just like you would if it was anyone else behaving in a threatening way.

But if all they're doing is having a shower and getting dressed, then what's the damn problem?

'...ultimately, I believe that the right of trans women to have a space to shower / pee / get changed is greater than the right of non-trans women to be protected from the occasional sight of a penis.'

But ... they can do all that in the men's?

You've just repeated yourself there @IggyPopsPlasticTrousers - women, get over your hang ups and reframe your trauma. We heard and saw you the first time.

They might have included on some literature that she provided the equipment. That wasnt the issue though, she wanted to be involved in organising the event and named as a leader. Meaning she would attend meetings and be part of making decisions etc. That is what she expected to happen but no white people were included to that level. Even the person who had to be present at these because they are employed by the charity took a backseat and didn't contribute unless specifically asked something like "can we afford this thing we have decided we want?".

Interesting comment, thank you.

I don't think you have thought about this a lot more than I have, no. You wouldn't believe the many, many conversations I've had about this.

I've just reached a different conclusion to you, is all. As have many other people.

I still believe that the majority of people in the UK are generally welcoming of trans people. And that the opinions voiced here are - if not quite niche, certainly the minority.

Hence the difficulties experienced by the OP's daughter.

Enjoy your Easter Monday, all of you.