Page 17 | Daughter in early 20s lonely due to GC views

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 05/04/2026 18:01

Batties · 05/04/2026 13:29

The majority of young people in the U.K. are not “pro trans”. People in all ages groups are waking up to the damage that trans ideology is doing.

https://yougov.com/en-gb/articles/51545-where-does-the-british-public-stand-on-transgender-rights-in-202425

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Seems to me like most people - and especially young people - are pro trans.

From the study you linked:

" On the core question of whether Britons believe someone should be able to socially identify as a different gender, the public still tend to say that they should, by 49% to 35% who say they should not. "

Yes, the trend is reversing. But the majority view is still pro-trans.

AidaP · 05/04/2026 18:05

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 05/04/2026 18:01

Seems to me like most people - and especially young people - are pro trans.

From the study you linked:

" On the core question of whether Britons believe someone should be able to socially identify as a different gender, the public still tend to say that they should, by 49% to 35% who say they should not. "

Yes, the trend is reversing. But the majority view is still pro-trans.

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Not to mention that most of those questions are not set in neutral way, plus it's in era where for few years now, there are 10+ anti-trans pieces in press and tv every week.

And still that's the best of polling they can cook, and then be surprised where it doesn't relate to how things are IRL.

You can cook the books as much as you want, reality is that you lost still have to keep to hiding, and will continue to do so.

ArabellaScott · 05/04/2026 18:06

Yes, nobody cares how somebody describes themself. They can identify as a pygmy shrew for all it matters.

But nobody can change sex, that's all.

FlirtsWithRhinos · 05/04/2026 18:07

ScaryFaces · 05/04/2026 15:05

It’s true I could have added sexism to that list, and it’s an interesting example – I have read stories from extreme misogynists who were radicalised online and later broke away from the ideology describe how spending their time in online echo chambers affected their real life friendships and relationships. They would absorb all this rhetoric and misinformation and hate that was presented as fact in online spaces, and then encountered this dissonance where the views that were normalised and reinforced in their online life were of course seen as hateful and unacceptable in their real life interactions. Even people who might hold casual or unexamined sexist views themselves would find their extremism offputting. And of course anyone who attempted to question their views or push back or even say “can we not discuss that, it makes me uncomfortable” would just get these regurgitated little soundbites in return, about how they were obviously just a cuck or a beta or blue-pilled, because that’s how you learn to shut down conversations online. And it was all self-perpetuating, because they’d find themselves increasingly isolated and lonely but would respond by doubling down, telling themselves it was other people who were the problem, and spend more and more time in online spaces instead. It took great strength and self-awareness to finally be able recognise and unpick their behaviour, to start to think critically about the misinformation they were being fed, to recognise women in real life didn’t resemble the horrible caricatures they’d been led to believe in, and finally see that they had been the problem all along.

It is actually quite scary how easy and intoxicating it is to slip into extremist views when you’re surrounded by people normalising and reinforcing them and telling you that you’re right and everybody else is wrong.

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Oh I 100% agree. I constantly challenge myself and look for alternative ways to view the same data.

But I just keep coming back to : female people do exist and do suffer sexism. There have been, and in some places still are, laws that specifically forbade female people from owning property, or taking part in politics or professions. And one only has to look briefly at the front page of any mainstream porn site to see that society still has very different ideas for male and female bodies and male and female worth.

Any definition of "woman" that is based on a type of mind rather than body serves to obscure all this, to the detriment of female people.

Which means the "reasonable" position can't be one that agrees some men are objectively more like women than other men, or some men are women some of the time, because any step down that road is legitimising the "type of mind" view of women and therefore obscuring the reality of the body and its consequences.

The only way to a valid and reasonable compromise is to recognise that whatever trans people are labelling "man" or "woman" is fundamentally different to sex, and therefore can't be simply swapped into the place of sex in pre-existing norms and structures. If gender is to continue to be important, it has to be seen as separate from and independent of sex, leaving sex-based language and single sex provisions for women intact. If these things are different there is no logical or moral reason one has to replace the other.

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 05/04/2026 18:09

AidaP · 05/04/2026 18:05

Not to mention that most of those questions are not set in neutral way, plus it's in era where for few years now, there are 10+ anti-trans pieces in press and tv every week.

And still that's the best of polling they can cook, and then be surprised where it doesn't relate to how things are IRL.

You can cook the books as much as you want, reality is that you lost still have to keep to hiding, and will continue to do so.

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I tend to take the polls at face value. You can always make a case for the questions being asked in a certain way, and to be influenced by media etc etc - but I think the picture makes sense.

Yes, the pro trans lobby have lost ground in recent years - potentially by intially overreaching and provoking pushback? - but the majority of people in the UK are still relatively accepting of trans people.

I still like to think that this TERF hysteria will die down a bit and people will realise that you can't just wish trans people out of existence. Accommodations will have to be made, compromises will have to be found etc.

Next set of survey results will be key.

ArabellaScott · 05/04/2026 18:11

'Hysteria'

Whoopsy.

AidaP · 05/04/2026 18:13

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 05/04/2026 18:09

I tend to take the polls at face value. You can always make a case for the questions being asked in a certain way, and to be influenced by media etc etc - but I think the picture makes sense.

Yes, the pro trans lobby have lost ground in recent years - potentially by intially overreaching and provoking pushback? - but the majority of people in the UK are still relatively accepting of trans people.

I still like to think that this TERF hysteria will die down a bit and people will realise that you can't just wish trans people out of existence. Accommodations will have to be made, compromises will have to be found etc.

Next set of survey results will be key.

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I mean, the accommodations were already laid out in GRA 2004, that UK was forced to adopt after losing Goodwin 2002. And then the amendments in 2007 where UK decided to allow semi-self-id instead of fixing GRA 2004 to actually fit the EU legislature.

And no, trans people are not losing lobby by overreaching, if that was the case it would be global. The pushback happens in US, UK and countries that then follow, and is well linked to multiple, and extremely well funded, orthodox christian and far right groups.

That's why in many places you do not see reversal like that, as that funding is not there to push the narrative for years on end. And why ECtHR continues to keep ruling in ways that enforce and enhance protections for transgender people, without fail.

Helleofabore · 05/04/2026 18:15

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 05/04/2026 18:01

Seems to me like most people - and especially young people - are pro trans.

From the study you linked:

" On the core question of whether Britons believe someone should be able to socially identify as a different gender, the public still tend to say that they should, by 49% to 35% who say they should not. "

Yes, the trend is reversing. But the majority view is still pro-trans.

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This is where misunderstandings happen.

Yes, many people agree that someone should 'socially identify' as a different gender. That is 'gender' not sex by the way.

When those exact same group of people are asked specifically about single sex provisions and whether male people should access female single sex provisions, the answers change particularly if it is clarified in the next question as to whether that male person has had surgery.

You cannot just pick and choose your own interpretation of polls.

DialSquare · 05/04/2026 18:17

AidaP · 05/04/2026 18:13

I mean, the accommodations were already laid out in GRA 2004, that UK was forced to adopt after losing Goodwin 2002. And then the amendments in 2007 where UK decided to allow semi-self-id instead of fixing GRA 2004 to actually fit the EU legislature.

And no, trans people are not losing lobby by overreaching, if that was the case it would be global. The pushback happens in US, UK and countries that then follow, and is well linked to multiple, and extremely well funded, orthodox christian and far right groups.

That's why in many places you do not see reversal like that, as that funding is not there to push the narrative for years on end. And why ECtHR continues to keep ruling in ways that enforce and enhance protections for transgender people, without fail.

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LOL. Proven liar continues to lie, shocker!

Helleofabore · 05/04/2026 18:19

AidaP · 05/04/2026 18:05

Not to mention that most of those questions are not set in neutral way, plus it's in era where for few years now, there are 10+ anti-trans pieces in press and tv every week.

And still that's the best of polling they can cook, and then be surprised where it doesn't relate to how things are IRL.

You can cook the books as much as you want, reality is that you lost still have to keep to hiding, and will continue to do so.

Edited

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The polls are by a neutral pollster and are asked in a neutral way.

You don't seem to understand market research methodology very well.

Do you think transgender women should or should not be allowed to…

Take part in women's sporting events?2018 in italics, 2024 bold
Should be allowed 39 31% 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 8%
Should not be allowed 37 53% 2018 - 2024 this is increase by 16%
Don't know 25 15%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 10%

Is neutral and there is no leading information that would bias the answer. There is no 'cooking the books', you are just not understanding polling by professional pollsters.

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 05/04/2026 18:19

AidaP · 05/04/2026 18:13

I mean, the accommodations were already laid out in GRA 2004, that UK was forced to adopt after losing Goodwin 2002. And then the amendments in 2007 where UK decided to allow semi-self-id instead of fixing GRA 2004 to actually fit the EU legislature.

And no, trans people are not losing lobby by overreaching, if that was the case it would be global. The pushback happens in US, UK and countries that then follow, and is well linked to multiple, and extremely well funded, orthodox christian and far right groups.

That's why in many places you do not see reversal like that, as that funding is not there to push the narrative for years on end. And why ECtHR continues to keep ruling in ways that enforce and enhance protections for transgender people, without fail.

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I disagree. I do think the trans lobby have over-reached, and been too pushy.

I remember when trans people were a thing, but nobody really batted an eyelid ( remember Hayley in Coronation Street? )

Something must have happened to provoke the pushback we're now seeing.

SugarPuffSandwiches · 05/04/2026 18:22

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 05/04/2026 18:19

I disagree. I do think the trans lobby have over-reached, and been too pushy.

I remember when trans people were a thing, but nobody really batted an eyelid ( remember Hayley in Coronation Street? )

Something must have happened to provoke the pushback we're now seeing.

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Nadia in Big Brother too (think she won) but nobody seemed to really mind

Helleofabore · 05/04/2026 18:24

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 05/04/2026 18:09

I tend to take the polls at face value. You can always make a case for the questions being asked in a certain way, and to be influenced by media etc etc - but I think the picture makes sense.

Yes, the pro trans lobby have lost ground in recent years - potentially by intially overreaching and provoking pushback? - but the majority of people in the UK are still relatively accepting of trans people.

I still like to think that this TERF hysteria will die down a bit and people will realise that you can't just wish trans people out of existence. Accommodations will have to be made, compromises will have to be found etc.

Next set of survey results will be key.

Show quote history

Do you think transgender women should or should not be allowed to…
Take part in women's sporting events?2018 in italics, 2024 bold
Should be allowed 39 31% 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 8%
Should not be allowed 37 53% 2018 - 2024 this is increase by 16%
Don't know 25 15%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 10%

These questions are completely neutral and the polls are done by professional pollsters.

"Accommodations will have to be made, compromises will have to be found etc".

Feminists, particularly those on this board, have been suggesting accommodations for years.

Please explain what 'compromises' do you recommend for the following:

Where should a male prisoner with a transgender identity be housed in prison?

Do you believe that the IOC has made an error with the current change in policy? What compromise do you think the IOC should be making for male athletes with a transgender identity?

You might find that the women on this very thread have been suggesting accommodations that you would make yourself. Shall we start to discuss those accommodations?

Helleofabore · 05/04/2026 18:27

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 05/04/2026 18:19

I disagree. I do think the trans lobby have over-reached, and been too pushy.

I remember when trans people were a thing, but nobody really batted an eyelid ( remember Hayley in Coronation Street? )

Something must have happened to provoke the pushback we're now seeing.

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I have attended a meeting where I have had about 50 men yelling in my face that I am a fascist, a nazi and that I wish that trans people all just disappeared. I am or wish none of those things, yet you have told us on this thread that you believe that women who want to have single sex provisions are 'just as bad' as those male people in your 'both sides' rhetoric.

I have never seen a group of women protest a transgender meeting. Ever.

Can you explain just how 'both sides' are as bad as each other?

FlirtsWithRhinos · 05/04/2026 18:27

GlovedhandsCecilia · 05/04/2026 15:01

The fact you are talking about what someone posted in the past on a different matter is an example of the derailing. The fact you can't see that the thread is not about Aida, their sex, their gender or their twitter account is part of the problem.

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The thing is, whether you like it or not, this is the wider social context in which OP's daughter's experiences are happening. This is the reality where women with pretty moderate GC views are expelled from political parties, disciplined or sacked at work, face screaming mobs at feminist conferences, are denounced by senior politicians as bigots. Where young men feel entitled and justified to suggest rape with a splintery rolling pin is fair comeback for publicly voicing GC views.

You can't just pretend none of that is happening and look at this specific incidence in a vacuum. Assuming the young people's expectations of each other are not being influenced by this wider social context is far more biased than accepting they probably are.

Waitwhat23 · 05/04/2026 18:28

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 05/04/2026 18:19

I disagree. I do think the trans lobby have over-reached, and been too pushy.

I remember when trans people were a thing, but nobody really batted an eyelid ( remember Hayley in Coronation Street? )

Something must have happened to provoke the pushback we're now seeing.

Show quote history

It's interesting that you use Hayley Cropper as an example.

Why do you think they used a woman rather than a transwoman in that role?

ArabellaScott · 05/04/2026 18:28

AidaP · 05/04/2026 18:13

I mean, the accommodations were already laid out in GRA 2004, that UK was forced to adopt after losing Goodwin 2002. And then the amendments in 2007 where UK decided to allow semi-self-id instead of fixing GRA 2004 to actually fit the EU legislature.

And no, trans people are not losing lobby by overreaching, if that was the case it would be global. The pushback happens in US, UK and countries that then follow, and is well linked to multiple, and extremely well funded, orthodox christian and far right groups.

That's why in many places you do not see reversal like that, as that funding is not there to push the narrative for years on end. And why ECtHR continues to keep ruling in ways that enforce and enhance protections for transgender people, without fail.

Show quote history

Aye, India is well known as a Xtian rightwing hotbed?

Genderism is a self-limiting movement. It sows the seeds of its own destruction as it grows. Because the harms it does are quickly evident.

ArabellaScott · 05/04/2026 18:33

'Oh my gosh what ever could have happened to put women off supporting us?'

On the other channel: promotes: 'Fucking a children's author with a splintered rolling pin'

Helleofabore · 05/04/2026 18:35

Helleofabore · 05/04/2026 16:14

I do think that you are perhaps missing the trend that indicates that actually, the opinions of the age group you are referring to is also now changing with greater knowledge of what the issues are and how negatively female people are being impacted.

Here are two data sets asking the same question and it is broken down by age group for the UK. There is a stark difference between the answers from 2018 and 2024. I expect that the next tracker poll that YouGov will do, will show a significant change again in the direction of that acceptance that you are relying on from that age group.

https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/Transgenderdata2018.pdf

https://ygo-assets-websites-editorial-emea.yougov.net/documents/YouGov-Transgenderstudy2024.pdf

For instance just for the 18-24 age group:

Do you think transgender women should or should not be allowed to…

Take part in women's sporting events?2018 in italics, 2024 bold
Should be allowed 39 31% 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 8%
Should not be allowed 37 53% 2018 - 2024 this is increase by 16%
Don't know 25 15%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 10%

Use women's changing rooms? 2018 in italics, 2024 bold
Should be allowed 61 42%. 2018 - 2024* this is decrease by 19%
Should not be allowed 21 40%. 2018 - 2024 this is increase by 19%
Don't know 18 18%. 2018 - 2024 *no change %

Use women's toilets? 2018 in brackets vs 2024 bold
Should be allowed 66 47%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 19%
Should not be allowed 18 39%. 2018 - 2024* *this is increase by 21%
Don't know 16 14%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 2%

Use women's refuges? 2018 in brackets vs 2024 bold
Should be allowed 69 55%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 14%
Should not be allowed 15 31%. 2018 - 2024 this is increase by 16%
Don't know 16 14%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 2%

I really don't think that you are up to date with the general opinion of young people. I think those trends will be going the same direction with the next YouGov polling for this specific tracker, because we have seen it already with other organisations who have commissioned the same questions being asked by other professional polling organisations recently.

Here is one
https://sex-matters.org/wp-content/uploads/2026/03/Omni-Sex-Matters-polling-March-2026.pdf

The majority of 18-24 year olds don't believe that a person with a gender identity should use a single sex provision that is not for their sex but should either use a mixed sex provision or the single sex provision for their birth sex.

And for each question about whether they, personally, would prefer a mixed sex solution or a single sex provision just for their sex - every question that age group answered with a majority saying 'single sex'.

Anyone believing that young people are not in majority agreement with the much older generations when the discussion around single sex provisions is directly and specifically asked would be mistaken.

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Sorry the links seem corrupted.

d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/Transgender_data_2018.pdf

https://ygo-assets-websites-editorial-emea.yougov.net/documents/YouGov_-_Transgender_study_2024.pdf

Try these.

https://ygo-assets-websites-editorial-emea.yougov.net/documents/YouGov_-_Transgender_study_2024.pdf

ArabellaScott · 05/04/2026 18:36

Imagine women waking up to the fact that violent rapey men don't magically change by virtue of lipstick and a skirt?

SugarPuffSandwiches · 05/04/2026 18:36

ArabellaScott · 05/04/2026 18:33

'Oh my gosh what ever could have happened to put women off supporting us?'

On the other channel: promotes: 'Fucking a children's author with a splintered rolling pin'

WTF are you on about lol

Helleofabore · 05/04/2026 18:36

ArabellaScott · 05/04/2026 18:33

'Oh my gosh what ever could have happened to put women off supporting us?'

On the other channel: promotes: 'Fucking a children's author with a splintered rolling pin'

But both sides, eh?

EvieBB · 05/04/2026 18:41

Currentquandry · 05/04/2026 02:10

My daughter is in her early twenties. She is GC and is struggling because so few of her peers have similar opinions. She is very lonely because of this. Are there any online groups she could join to give her a sense of community? She is also ND. Thank you in advance for your advice…

What is GC?

SternJoyousBeev2 · 05/04/2026 18:42

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

SugarPuffSandwiches · 05/04/2026 18:44

EvieBB · 05/04/2026 18:41

What is GC?

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"gender critical"