Adult daughter dating trans-identified male, struggling to navigate family concerns

[BlueLegume]

Good morning all. I am normally rooted over on the Elderly parents threads. Just as I thought life couldn’t get more difficult it has. A week ago my adult daughter told us she was in a relationship with someone who identifies as male. This person was born female - daughter troped out the ‘gender assigned at birth’ nonsense. She has utterly ripped the family apart as she clearly has drunk the kool aid and cannot understand our concerns.

She has a great job, we are normal family where she says she has always felt safe and is loved.

Any advice welcome navigating this. Happy to answer questions but I will caveat this post with the following:

I am a sex realist. I hate the term gender critical.
I do not buy gender ideology. I think it is a term being used to expect society to accept trans etc off the back of the hard won rights for lesbians and gay men.

I do not believe anyone can change sex.

The ‘be kind’ mantra is a weaponised term to justify the nonsense.

Advice welcome.

‘Ripped the family apart’? How dramatic. Accept her choice of partner, and respect him, or you’ll lose your daughter. It’s that simple.

@WaitingForMojo not dramatic. My opinion. My family. You have literally responded with the utter nonsense promoted by the gender ideology speak. Accept what we say or you’ll lose them. I will not be threatened into a belief I do not hold based on my knowledge of reality.

It doesn’t have to rip the family apart. Just be there as usual but maintaining your beliefs. You can let your daughter know your realist beliefs remain the same, and be civil to her girlfriend. My beliefs are the same as yours btw.

I think you can be both a sex realist and supportive of your DDs relationship. You don’t have to agree that her partner is a man but you don’t have to make a big deal out of it. Treat them both with respect and just hope it fizzles out naturally like a lot of young people’s relationships.
The hardest thing for me would be using male pronouns- I don’t think I could do it anymore , I would just avoid using pronouns altogether if possible.

You cannot change sex - you can take hormones and have operations but you are one defined sex. I’m with you OP @BlueLegume

think best way round it is agree to disagree. She might not even be dating them in a months time but might revel if you make it all about the gender argument.

How has this utterly ripped your family apart? Your DD having different views to you does not mean she has "drunk the kool aid". She's an adult and will inevitably form her own opinions and act accordingly.

Does she know any other lesbians? If not I imagine it will take a while to accept herself and her girlfriend.

Oh come on what on earth is so terrible

Thanks @TheSlantedOwl my sensible head is saying that my heart says she has been swept up in the nonsense. She insists we say he about the person. That I won’t do and she says that is disrespectful not honouring their chosen pronouns. She is a she not a he.

I have always been accepting of her dating boys and girls in the past. This honestly feels like some daft rebellious fling that is intoxicating as all love affairs are at first. Yes it may fizzle out but not looking likely.

My main concerns are this person has had their healthy breasts removed already. Daughter insists on calling it ‘top surgery’ which is the term used I know. I call it mutilation of healthy limbs. I do not think this is someone in a healthy place. I also feel they have been let down by mental health/ health care professionals in ‘affirming’ a lie and proceeding with medical intervention in terms of surgery for a mental health issue.

You’re going to lose the relationship with her if you do this.

Chances are nothing you do will be good enough for this person so I'd be baseline polite but I probably wouldn't be using he or him unless I had I'd always use whatever name they've chosen but I just wouldn't engage with it any further. I'd shut down any sensitive or contentious topics with can we not talk politics or I'm not happy to talk politics. Plenty of that's nice and oh as responses you'll be amazed how effective oh is to finish dodge conversations. If your daughter really wants to get into deep discussions I'd say can we please not. I don't want to fall out I love you and respect your choices even if I don't always agree with them. Please give me the same courtesy.

It's just the same as if your DD brought home someone of a different religion. You might prefer she had chosen someone else, but it is what it is.
You could agree in advance that nobody will mention religion, and tell DD you won't be pretending to follow said religion just to please her new partner. But you'll be delighted to meet them of course.

I agree that apparent 'acceptance' is the smart move here.

But privately, as well as politically, anyone who claims men can have XX chromosomes and a uterus, are stupid, delusional or a liar. That's not a great basis to build anything worthwhile, whether romantically or on the world stage.

Was your daughter same-sex attracted before? If so, I'd be much less worried. She is still dating a biological woman, so at some level she knows the truth. And most youthful relationships, fizzle out quite quickly if left unchallenged

If not, this is very odd and worrying.

It’s actually very dramatic.

The thing is op, I completely agree with you on everything you say but if I were in your position, I'd welcome the new "boyfriend"( trans male) and in my head just know that my daughter was in a lesbian relationship,.no matter how she or her partner frame it.

I would privately be worried however that my daughters new partner had mental health problems and I would see it as an inability to accept their own homosexuality. I'd also worry for my daughter for similar reasons

I would however say absolutely none of this to my adult child or their partner. I would use all the pronouns requested and would be kind etc. As with many things as a parent of adult children, your job is to stand by, smile and let them do what they choose. Maybe be there if they ask for help but otherwise it is not wise to offer any sort of opinion on their choices.

If asked you can say you do find it hard to accept that peopl can change sex but you can also say that the sex someone is does not matter to you, so you are happy to treat her partner in the way she wants to be treated. As long as your dd's partner makes her happy, does it matter if (s)he is male or female?

I would treat it in the way I would if my son brought home a young conservative or an evangelical Christian as his girlfriend. I would not agree with her beliefs but I would treat her with kindness and judge whether I liked her from her behaviour and how she treated my DS, not on her beliefs

I dont see it as much different really

@KitWyn I’d just accepted she was gay honestly years ago. She had a few boyfriends but then it was girls and we are absolutely fine with it. TBH I’d even been relieved as the state of some men in the current climate….not all men but there are some toxic ones about. So I do agree I’m happy if she has found someone she is attracted to and they are same sex. Two of my closest friends are lesbians who have been in our lives for decades.

The trans identity is a tough one for me. If my daughter had come along with the trans ideology I would have been looking at her sexuality and advising she get some therapy to accept her same sex attraction. I agree that I do think some girls trans to male as they are afraid of both their sexuality-struggle to accept they are gay - which in my book is homophobia however internalised. I also think some girls trans out of womanhood because of the way women have been portrayed in both porn and the cosmetic industry.

But you truly don't have to be. I am a sex realist and one of my DC has had two long-term relationships with transmen (female to male). Honestly, I just look past that and focus on who they are to find common ground.

Focus on the individual. My philosophy is that being trans is by far the least interesting thing about a transperson. It is not a substitute for a personality. Trans rhetoric bores me, but neither of them were dying to spout it. And I bet neither of them had any interest in my explanations of why JKR isn't transphobic, so I didn't spout those at them. They were more interested in discussing books or gigs or wild swimming spots or good hikes or recipes or what their pets had been up to, like any other partner an adult child brings home. They were interesting people. Being trans was immaterial to this.

The person your DD is with is a woman and no amount of gender cultspeak or hormones make this otherwise. The more this person masculinises themselves the less physically attractive to your lesbian daughter they will become. I think it will sort itself out eventually and the relationship will end.

So you'd rather hold firm on your POV than have a relationship with your daughter?

Yet trans-supporters are the crazy ones?

Perhaps another way to look at it is, if your DD brought home someone with a severe lifelong or life limiting health disorder of some sort. Of course you would worry that they were making a big life altering choice if they made a long term commitment to that person. You would I hope still not make that person unwelcome

The "this isn't important, you are making a big deal out of nothing and you will lose your child if you don't comply" argument is straight out of the TRA playbook.

Of course it is important, of course it has the potential to really damage family relationships, and the threat that if you don't pretend to believe the gender ideology and use the language they insist upon and deny reality you will lose your child only emphasises that this is not 'being dramatic'.

A trans identified male is a man who thinks he is a woman though?

How about - I am pleased you have met and are dating someone you connect with and if that makes you happy, I’m happy.

i don’t hold the same set of beliefs with regards to gender, but they are most welcome in our home and I will always be polite to them and happy for you.

Then avoid pronouns, and hope it fizzles out.

@MyTrivia sorry I thought I had made it clear. This person is a biological female who identifies as male/non-binary/they them. Apparently depending on how they feel on any given day. They have had a double mastectomy and are apparently considering the next steps.

As previously said a healthy lesbian relationship is something I’d be thrilled for my daughter. There is no issue with that.

This dynamic just does not feel safe or healthy. It may fizzle out but at the moment it’s looking unlikely.