Adult daughter dating trans-identified male, struggling to navigate family concerns

[BlueLegume]

Good morning all. I am normally rooted over on the Elderly parents threads. Just as I thought life couldn’t get more difficult it has. A week ago my adult daughter told us she was in a relationship with someone who identifies as male. This person was born female - daughter troped out the ‘gender assigned at birth’ nonsense. She has utterly ripped the family apart as she clearly has drunk the kool aid and cannot understand our concerns.

She has a great job, we are normal family where she says she has always felt safe and is loved.

Any advice welcome navigating this. Happy to answer questions but I will caveat this post with the following:

I am a sex realist. I hate the term gender critical.
I do not buy gender ideology. I think it is a term being used to expect society to accept trans etc off the back of the hard won rights for lesbians and gay men.

I do not believe anyone can change sex.

The ‘be kind’ mantra is a weaponised term to justify the nonsense.

Advice welcome.

In as far as it's "just the same" as religion, it's already clear that OP not joining in is not acceptable: "She insists we say he about the person.". This religion requires affirmation, there is no agreeing to differ.

@NaiceBalonz what a ridiculous comment. I have no plans to lose my relationship so pop your popcorn away and I will listen to the sensible posters.

Your allowed to feel however you feel, but you also generally have to be respectful towards people. wouldnt you hate for someone to be horrible to your daughter cause they don't accept lesbians? Trans or not, not accepting your child's partner (unless they are criminal ect) is quickest way to lose your relationship

You can believe that - just don't tell your daughter.

Don't say he or she - refer to them by their name. It's not hard. Just be civil and accept that you and your daughter have a difference of opinion.

You say it's either 'him' or 'them' depending on the day anyway so surely just using their name is the safest option anyway.

I am an atheist but would always welcome and do any people of other religions. However if that persons religion impacts me then it is imposing a belief and that is not mine.

My son is in a relationship with a woman who think she's a man. The only thing I've ever said was that I knew she was autistic as soon as I might her, and that every trans person I know (which is a hell of a lot for someone like me, also autistic, with a small social circle) is autistic.
I try not use pronouns, if I do I use they/them, as i can't use he, it's a lie. I use their chosen name as it's how I was introduced.

They both seem happy, and basically if my son is happy, then i am happy.

My daughter is a lesbian and I'm fully prepared for her to date a woman who identifies as a man or non binary. She knows my opinions on gender (sex is real, gender is a misogynistic and homophobic idea which I personally think is a waste of everyone's time and as useful as segregation by star sign). However, I accept her right to have different opinions to mine and form relationships with people whose life choices I might feel are dumb. If I were in your situation I would keep my mouth shut and welcome my daughter's partner as best I could. Hope it works out for you and your daughter op.

@topsecretcyclist I really like your post so thank you. I agree that I think this person is autistic-also incredibly intelligent academically.

The part I am struggling with is my daughter has made it clear that unless we accept everything on her terms she is not happy with us. She is not even able to say she sees our point of view. I have literally had ever single bit of the gender identity dictionary chucked at me in the past week.

While I agree with you and would be highly uncomfortable, I do think you need to bear the relationship in mind. My mum as an adult has really struggled to accept some of my choices and my right to make them, and it has damaged our relationship. Despite lots of discussions and how it has made me feel, she can’t accept that what I want/need from her is the respect that I can live my life how I choose, she will never let go of the judgement and that hurts. Mainly about disagreement on religious views so it’s strongly held beliefs involved on both sides.

This is different in that it’s about both beliefs and you being expected to become involved in those beliefs by playing along. I think to respect your daughter you have to be supportive of her choices, but find ways to remain honest to yourself. Ie avoid pronouns and just use the name. Welcome this woman and get to know her. You don’t need to change your views at all but you need to behave decently.

I hold the same beliefs as you do. And I think I would be most concerned about the mental health of the person my DD was seeing the the potential impact of that. I think I would try to be welcoming the the individual and supportive of my DD (and hope to God that it would fizzle out).

If I was feeling really facetious I might leave out some condoms and a lecture about safe sex.

See, non-binary makes no sense to me at all - it’s the worst BS to come out of the trans movement. I agree with you that people are male or female and that’s it.

Basically, it’s the Emporer’s new clothes.

Sorry not to have better advice but I do empathise.

Does this person make your dd happy?

@SpringHasSprungTheGrassIsRiz you raised a smile in me re the condoms.

I must also thank you as I think my own opinions aside you have hit the nail on the head that I am concerned that she has got into a relationship with someone with existing and potentially ongoing mental health issues and dealing with them should not involve modifying healthy bodies.

OP - I learnt to keep quiet about my adult children's relationships and just to be welcoming - not matter what reservations I might have.
Yes, this young woman may be mentally very vulnerable and potentially very self absorbed - and we always hope that our children only get involved in emotionally healthy relationships. The evidence on Mumsnet says otherwise.

You've evidently got a lot on your plate with elderly parent care but this battle isn't one you have to fight. Take a deep breath - appreciate that she's an adult and maybe try to reassure her that your comments come only from love. You were a bit shocked at the announcement but you trust her to make the right decisions in her life. You're always on her side and of course you'll welcome anyone who's important to her.

Remember - there are a lot of people around who promote "parental alienation" and breaking family relationships who would revel in an opportunity to suggest to your daughter that you're "unsafe" and she should alienate you.

Our adult children have to forge their own paths and while we may disapprove of some of their choices, they are their choices. It doesn't stop us having our own informed views but we do need to tread carefully and allow adult children to make their own choices.

OP, I agree with you that sex cannot be changed. But the reality is that your daughter is an adult, so she can date who the hell she likes. I'm not sure how it "rips the family apart". You don't have to get involved. Just be polite to the partner if and when you meet them. Otherwise, back off and accept that you may not be seeing your daughter for some time. It's her life, not yours.

Thank you @MrsOvertonsWindow sound advice

There is no 'him' in this scenario.

This would be my nightmare and I honestly have zero helpful advice 😅
I couldn’t do it, I couldn’t call her a “he”. At most I’d refer to them by their name and leave it at that.

”Does Jeff want a sandwich?”
”Will Jeff be coming round on Saturday?”

I could also use a “they” where it seems normal.
DD: Jeff won a competition.
You: Oh did they? Say congratulations to Jeff for me.

I wouldn’t want to risk my relationship with my child but I also couldn’t tiptoe around the utter tripe of pretending she’s now a man.

OP the PP who said "I want you to be happy and respect your choices. Please respect my choice to have my own private views."

As a comparison, DSis lives in the States. She married a man who rapidly converted to a cult fairly extreme form of Christianity and has some repellant views. He is also a Trump voter.

DSis thinks he is wonderful. I don't remotely get it. But I want to keep "a line open" to her.

So, I keep in regular contact, keep it light and breezy, focus on her news and ask after her cat etc. When she starts with the Hilary Clinton is a paedo crap I take a deep breath and just leave it a little then send a text about something else. When nutso BIL appears in the conversation I am Really Polite And Cheerful. I ask him about work, has he been fishing recently. Lots "oh really", "oh that's great.... btw have you planted anything new in the garden this year?"

That is how I would play this.

@WaitingForMojo the partner is a woman, so the pronoun is her, not him.

• sorry, I agree with the PP who said

@xOlive yes I think you make excellent points. Clearly this person, oh for goodness sake, this woman, has had a ‘journey’ probably starting in teen years with anxiety now manifesting itself as thinking or feeling she is a man.

To some extent, and I have conveyed this to my daughter, I think the excitement of a new relationship that is intoxicating in the first months coupled with the ‘look at us aren’t we cool and edgy’ has swept her away.

Let it wash by. Do not discuss your views on gender. Just make them a cup of tea.

What is to be gained by pursuing your views out loud? Will it make you happy? Will it make your DD happy?

Just go with the flow and make no comment. She is an adult; she will do as she pleases.

I have a dearly loved young close relative who is on a similar path - in many ways I am sad that this is what they have chosen, but I simply tell them that it is hard for me to understand (I am grandparent generation!) but that I love them and always will.

The trouble is that the more you resist the more likely you will be the person your daughter will distance herself from.

It's a tricky one.

Yeah, it’ll be some untreated mental health issue. My female cousin was born a huge 12 weeks early and went through a whole host of non-binary, they/them now they’re a he/him with a new name. She went missing for ages. She’s just “lost” with developmental delays and mental health problems and found a group of unwell teenagers who all decided to “change” at the exact same time.
So now we all call her the new name and say “they” so as not to lose her again.