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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Why did MNHQ think it knew enough about feminism to split FWR into two

126 replies

IwantToRetire · 11/03/2026 21:16

Why did MNHQ decide that there are 2 types of feminism and that they should not be allowed to mix together so it split the Feminism and Women's Rights forum into 2. One for the nice girls who didn't want to discuss or even know that TW could be a threat to women's sex based rights, and one that tried to dumb down feminism into just discussing sex and gender but not related to feminism.

What was the point.

OP posts:
HopSpringsEternal · 12/03/2026 10:12

Shortshriftandlethal · 12/03/2026 09:52

This issue ( trans ideology) is what brought me to MN in the first place, and this is the only board I post on. For me, and many others here, it is the central issue of our time and the one that motivates us most, and to which we are most committed. In that respect this board has been a life saver and an incredibly useful resource.

This is an issue which transcends our daily lives and has wide reaching and fundamental impacts. In the attempt to erase 'sex' women's interests and concerns are existentially threatened. It has also cause many of us to fundamentally re-assess where we are now, how we got here, and has brought us to question all previous certainties. In that sense it is deeply political.

Edited

I get that. But it's a shame that the other issues just aren't as important or engaging. Its obviously important but in my life, domestic violence and rape have played major parts, whereas I have never had an issue from anyone who is trans directly. So those first two issues feel much more relevant to my life. I obviously know that they are also part of the trans debate. But the real issue has just been men in all their shapes and forms and the failure of society to deal with these issues.

ArabellaScott · 12/03/2026 10:16

Shortshriftandlethal · 12/03/2026 09:25

As I recall it was the self identified 'Intersectionalist' feminists versus everyone else.

The newly created 'chat' board was inactive to the point of death - because all of the really lively, invested and engaged discussion was on here.

Edited

The main board was Feminist Chat.

The fannies hived us off into this board, which was given a new name and positrd as a sort of subgroup.

I mean it clearly didnt work, but it was 100% an attempt.to shut us up.

TinselAngel · 12/03/2026 10:17

Originally the Sex and Gender board was going to be called “Sex and gender debate”, but we pointed out this would be unfair on trans widows on our thread and suggest that our position was up for debate. The lovely MichaelMumsnet then suggested if we weren’t happy with it we move the threads to “Relationships”, but eventually agreed to call the board “discussion” rather than “debate”.

Also those saying MNHQ were played by the TRA posters are correct. It was an attempted gotcha to try and prove we were a minority, which failed.

Helleofabore · 12/03/2026 10:18

ArabellaScott · 12/03/2026 10:09

Something to do with whether her dad could walk her down the aisle?

I remember that one. I was rather agog.

RareGoalsVerge · 12/03/2026 10:19

It had to be a separate board because of the mumsnet functionality to hide an entire topic. If any thread that mentions that men can't be women have to be on one specific board, then people who want to stick theur fingers in their ears and go LALALALALA can hide that board and live in peace and tranquility while also being able to join in chats about maternity rights, equal pay etc

Pingponghavoc · 12/03/2026 10:23

The problem with a lot of general feminist issues is that there is a lot of agreement, so not much need for discussion. Its difficult for these threads to run for a long time and can be a bit dull with lots of 'i concur'. Or one of the first posters gives good advice, and the thread is useful, but over.

There used to be posts about feminist theory, but they were always long running, slow threads because if we didnt read the book it is difficult to participate. So maybe women read, but not post.

As a result, before trans ideology, the board was quiet and threads didnt get lost. I remember i threads stayed on the first page for weeks.

The trans threads fillied up quicker, and often generated another follow up thread, and then multiple threads concurrently.

So it looked as if trans was stopping discussion about other feminist issues, when really all was happening is that older threads were being pushed down the page, and we'd have to have already posted on it to see it. So i can see why a place for these threads would be useful.

But i remember some feminist theory posters not liking discussion about TRA, they didnt see it as much of an issue. I also remember being shocked how they couldn't argue the TRA case very well while agreeing with it.

TRA obviously didnt like the discussion at all.

So MN had pressure from the women who liked to talk about theory, long established posters who thought the discussion was irrelevant and of course TRA.

The also wanted to move trans threads away from non feminist boards. If they moved AIBU threads to FWR, it would make the matter worse.

The gender board was always going to more active than the 'other' but i think the feminist misjudged the number of women willing to click onto two boards. I often forget that its there, ir assume its quiet without looking.

bozzabollix · 12/03/2026 10:24

As a person who’d describe themselves as a feminist but isn’t against trans people, I’ve avoided this section of Mumsnet. It seems to mostly be about the trans issue, whereas I’m interested in issues such as violence against women, unequal pay, lack of access of childcare, women putting up endlessly with shit partners etc. Are one of these boards for my stance?

I’d happily look at feminist influencers on Insta but on Mumsnet it seems to have been hijacked entirely into a single issue that I actually don’t agree with.

ArabellaScott · 12/03/2026 10:25

bozzabollix · 12/03/2026 10:24

As a person who’d describe themselves as a feminist but isn’t against trans people, I’ve avoided this section of Mumsnet. It seems to mostly be about the trans issue, whereas I’m interested in issues such as violence against women, unequal pay, lack of access of childcare, women putting up endlessly with shit partners etc. Are one of these boards for my stance?

I’d happily look at feminist influencers on Insta but on Mumsnet it seems to have been hijacked entirely into a single issue that I actually don’t agree with.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/feminism

Feminism chat | Mumsnet

Join our feminist chat forum and discuss everything related to women's rights.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/feminism

bozzabollix · 12/03/2026 10:25

Thank you.

Shedmistress · 12/03/2026 10:26

HopSpringsEternal · 12/03/2026 10:12

I get that. But it's a shame that the other issues just aren't as important or engaging. Its obviously important but in my life, domestic violence and rape have played major parts, whereas I have never had an issue from anyone who is trans directly. So those first two issues feel much more relevant to my life. I obviously know that they are also part of the trans debate. But the real issue has just been men in all their shapes and forms and the failure of society to deal with these issues.

Which of your threads about these things got no traction?

ArabellaScott · 12/03/2026 10:27

HopSpringsEternal · 12/03/2026 10:12

I get that. But it's a shame that the other issues just aren't as important or engaging. Its obviously important but in my life, domestic violence and rape have played major parts, whereas I have never had an issue from anyone who is trans directly. So those first two issues feel much more relevant to my life. I obviously know that they are also part of the trans debate. But the real issue has just been men in all their shapes and forms and the failure of society to deal with these issues.

100% and I assure you feminists here would fucking love to get back to the issues you mention.

The problem was the attempts to redefine men as 'women' and thereby remove our ability to discuss and define our rights.

If "women" includes men then there is no feminism.

Helleofabore · 12/03/2026 10:27

I think what happens now is that the many issues that some people declare are more important than 'trans issues' ARE discussed on this board in quite some depth, from all angles of the issue including the need for single sex provisions.

Domestic violence is discussed here, it might be a thread dedicated to domestic violence and how to deal with it, but it will also include aspects of what some people label 'trans issues'. There is a lot of discussion on this board about coercive control, DARVO and other aspects of domestic violence.

If someone wanted direct support for that issue though, they would not be posting on either of the feminist boards in any case. It is however, not accurate to say that the discussions don't happen, just as it is inaccurate to say that discussions about domestic violence won't include discussions about recognition of what is domestic abuse and what needs to be done to support women and children who are victims of this.

ArabellaScott · 12/03/2026 10:29

bozzabollix · 12/03/2026 10:25

Thank you.

You're welcome. I will warn you that several threads on there are still dealing with sex and gender.

Turns out those two issues seem to be quite important to feminism. Amazing.

Helleofabore · 12/03/2026 10:30

bozzabollix · 12/03/2026 10:24

As a person who’d describe themselves as a feminist but isn’t against trans people, I’ve avoided this section of Mumsnet. It seems to mostly be about the trans issue, whereas I’m interested in issues such as violence against women, unequal pay, lack of access of childcare, women putting up endlessly with shit partners etc. Are one of these boards for my stance?

I’d happily look at feminist influencers on Insta but on Mumsnet it seems to have been hijacked entirely into a single issue that I actually don’t agree with.

Have you even read this thread?

You are clearly posting on a thread about the fact that the feminist board was split and you are posting on the 'Sex and Gender' board while complaining that it is only about discussions about why female single sex provisions are important.

Helleofabore · 12/03/2026 10:31

RareGoalsVerge · 12/03/2026 10:19

It had to be a separate board because of the mumsnet functionality to hide an entire topic. If any thread that mentions that men can't be women have to be on one specific board, then people who want to stick theur fingers in their ears and go LALALALALA can hide that board and live in peace and tranquility while also being able to join in chats about maternity rights, equal pay etc

Prescient.

Pingponghavoc · 12/03/2026 10:35

I think it is difficult to talk about women rights and ignore the fact that the definition of women seems up for debate.

Any solution wouldnt work if we are imagining different definitions of woman.

Bagsintheboot · 12/03/2026 10:37

I feel like it was probably the best decision at the time. Things were very different not so long ago and they were walking a bit of a tightrope.

As valuable as MN is, I've always been conscious that it's someone else's sandbox at the end of the day, and if they want to sell up to someone tomorrow or decide to delete the entire site from the internet then that's their prerogative and there's bugger all I or anyone on here can do. So I just roll with it for the most part.

ArabellaScott · 12/03/2026 10:38

Well for example, females identifying as trans men risked losing maternity protections.

For some reason the feminists who cant abide the ''trans' board don't want to talk about that.

ArabellaScott · 12/03/2026 10:39

Bagsintheboot · 12/03/2026 10:37

I feel like it was probably the best decision at the time. Things were very different not so long ago and they were walking a bit of a tightrope.

As valuable as MN is, I've always been conscious that it's someone else's sandbox at the end of the day, and if they want to sell up to someone tomorrow or decide to delete the entire site from the internet then that's their prerogative and there's bugger all I or anyone on here can do. So I just roll with it for the most part.

How long would Mn last without users?

Bagsintheboot · 12/03/2026 10:58

ArabellaScott · 12/03/2026 10:39

How long would Mn last without users?

I think you'd be mistaken if you thought MN wouldn't have users if FWR went or if something else drastic happened to the moderation policy. And if it did fold, it wouldn't be quick.

They have 8-10 million unique visitors to the site each month. Let's be realistic, most of those aren't here for FWR. Some will be, sure, but it's the parenting topics, Chat, Relationships and of course AIBU that dominate the site.

MN is the site for pregnant women, women TTC, parents etc to come to in the UK. Netmums is much smaller. MN is well-established in the UK psyche as the parenting site and has a high profile in the media and social consciousness. As long as people are still having kids, MN is still going to have a well of new members joining.

Pingponghavoc · 12/03/2026 11:50

There used to be figures available about the number of eyeballs on FRW, and they weren't tiny.

I think MN had to balance the pressure, at the time, from some advertisers not wanting to be associated with terfs, and the possibility that stopping the conservation would lose them users and advertising revenue.

Datun · 12/03/2026 12:42

From what I remember FWR was the third most visited board on the entire site.

Bagsintheboot · 12/03/2026 12:51

Datun · 12/03/2026 12:42

From what I remember FWR was the third most visited board on the entire site.

I would be surprised if this was still the case. Just from glancing at AIBU, S&B, Chat, Relationships, Telly Addicts, and some of the Parenting boards, you can see immediately that they are much more active in terms of new and updating threads.

I wonder if MNHQ would agree to release the data - I'm sure someone asked previously.

Floisme · 12/03/2026 12:52

I can talk openly in real life about other feminist issues so I have less need of the Feminism Chat board and rarely use it. This board on the other hand has felt like a lifeline at times.

I remember a regular poster used to claim she was one of the people who had pushed for the split, and yet she never seemed to use the other board herself so I drew my own conclusions. I've not seen her around since the general election.

EasternStandard · 12/03/2026 13:01

ArabellaScott · 12/03/2026 10:16

The main board was Feminist Chat.

The fannies hived us off into this board, which was given a new name and positrd as a sort of subgroup.

I mean it clearly didnt work, but it was 100% an attempt.to shut us up.

It wasn’t mnhq so much as some posters wanting ti
shut down the sex and gender stuff. I recall various posters pushing for the split.

I don’t think it worked out as they wanted as we all kept talking anyway.

So yep it was more some posters than mn.