Has anyone left their spouse over GC views / pro-Islam stance

[PinkTreeFrog]

Husband and I could never find common ground on gender critical views and his blindness to the harms of Islam to women. He has an inability to take in information that contradicts his world view. Has anyone left a spouse over this?

Where was i being a homophobic? Ive just what I believe in. Have i mentioned anything derogatory or given the impression that i am a danger to homosexuals? No. I simply said I don't believe in it. If you do or are gay that's upto the individual. It doesn't bother me. What does bother me is when you accuse me of homophobia! Live and let live.

Sorry to step on your toes :-)

If you don't know, there are loads of vids online where folk are quizzed on the street. Is this verse from the Quaran or the Bible. The reactions are quite funny.

The Bible is a really horrific book. And amusingly, US Republicans get caught out when they make laws banning obscene material :-)

Bible removed from schools after new law banning 'sexually explicit' books 'backfires' - The Mirror

Of course, The Quaran aint great either, but I don't know it. I tried reading it a couple of times but just could not keep an interest.

I think that poster has taken you saying
As for being gay be it my brother or sister Muslims,Christians and other faiths do not allow gays. So why target Islam

as you yourself saying that you "don't allow gays" when I don't read it like that at all - more that you're saying Christianity amongst others say that, so why does everyone fixate on Muslims but not say Christians for example?
Can't see where you've expressed your personal opinion on being gay at all.

"Vance of the church that thinks women should not have the right to vote, to hold any public office, to a university education or to any professional career?"

Where does Vance say this?

It is not illegal to be homophobic. Any more than it is illegal to be Christophobic, Islamophobic, anti-atheist, anti-theist, antisemitic, anti-wicca, etc. You cannot legislate how people think. It is not illegal to have thoughts and beliefs. What is illegal, is to act on those beliefs ie where it is illegal to do such as the Racial Discrimination Acts.

NB: I myself am not at all homophobic, I am simply making the point that thoughts and beliefs are not illegal.

There are, sadly, very few female 'imams', and these are largely (all?) strictly limited to leading prayers for women, girls and very young children only. Women preaching to men is still verboten in Islam.

Women and girls are commonly banned from a Mosque's main prayer hall, and are instead relegated to small, airless rooms with a loudspeaker system. If both sexes are present in the same space, women will be required to pray some distance behind the men. Or even be encouraged to stay and pray at home.

All Abrahamic religions are misogynistic, that's agreed. But Islam is lagging far behind mainstream Christianity and Judaism in allowing women to take leadership roles with power and influence over men. Women vicars and women rabbi are much, much, more common, uncontroversial and widely accepted than women imams.

I do see a great deal of coercive control, violence, misogyny and homophobia, woven through all ancient religious texts. However, Christianity and Judaism, are, at least, open to change this. Islam appears much more stuck in its ways, seemingly fearful that the whole thing might unravel by pulling on any one thread.

Escaping religious indoctrination is very hard. Leaving Islam will, even in the developed world, likely mean the loss of many friends, family and status in the community. In other countries, apostasy is a serious crime punishable by prison or even a death sentence.

But if I were Muslim I would leave the religion if not for myself but for my daughters' well-being and happiness. They deserve to be able to study, work and earn the right to have power and influence over men at home, in business or when praying.

Often the smartest/bravest/most charismatic person in the home, workplace or prayer hall will be a woman. Any religion that can't accept that is not the religion for me.

Yes, that's what people struggle with understanding - that it's not illegal to be racist, homophobic, transphobic etc because as you say you cannot police people's thoughts and opinions.
It's when they act on those beliefs by discriminating etc that it becomes illegal.
Seen people on here totally not understand that when it's pointed out.

All but one are from St Paul who never met Jesus. He complains about women leading worship , which means women were leading worship. Elsewhere Jesus says the Law is replaced by a new commandment : Love one another as I have loved you.

Couple of things. It's a bit of a leap to say women were prohibited from preaching because they already were preaching. Nah.

And this - Quote: " Elsewhere Jesus says the Law is replaced by a new commandment : Love one another as I have loved you.".

Where in the Bible does it say this ? What verse of the Bible says Jesus replaced all 613 Mosaic commandments with that single line ? I know the Bible fairly well, and I have never seen that bit.

He did supposedly say this though. Mat 5:17-20 " Do not suppose that I came to throw down the Law or the ProphetsI did not come to throw down, but to fulfill; for truly I say to you, until the heaven and the earth may pass away, one iota or one tittle may not pass away from the Law, until all may come to pass. Therefore whoever may loose one of these commandsthe least--and may teach men so, he will be called least in the kingdom of the heavens, but whoever may do and may teach [them], he will be called great in the kingdom of the heavens. For I say to you that if your righteousness may not abound above that of the scribes and Pharisees, you may not enter into the kingdom of the heavens."(LSV)

"one iota or one tittle may not pass away from the Law, until all may come to pass."

All may come to pass ? I suspect that is the Rapture he described in Matt 24. The coming of the son of man. It's the same Gospel after all. The end of days. The Tribulation.

But there is a problem there, because earlier, in Mat 16:28 he said "Truly I say to you, there are certain of those standing here who will not taste of death until they may see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom." (LSV)

That was 2.5k years ago. So far as I know, the disciples are all dead.

So yup, where is this : Elsewhere Jesus says the Law is replaced by a new commandment : Love one another as I have loved you." ?

Edit: correct format error.

And this - Quote: " Elsewhere Jesus says the Law is replaced by a new commandment : Love one another as I have loved you.".

Where in the Bible does it say this ? What verse of the Bible says Jesus replaced all 613 Mosaic commandments with that single line ? I know the Bible fairly well, and I have never seen that bit.

@RedTagAlan
Jesus said it at the Last Supper.

John 13 KJV
A New Command I Give to You

34A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.

It is pretty clear in the New Testament that Jesus did not treat women in the ways that might have been expected according to the customs, laws and mores of those times.

They were also among the followers of Jesus, not just sequestered at home with their husband or male relatives.

Funny you say that a new mosque has opened today in our home town. Guess what there's a separate whole section dedicated to just women. Who can pray,get together and have a sense of community. Their very own safe space. It was alsl free for the public to come and visit. You wouldn't believe the amount of non Muslims came to attend. We got together had a great time. This shows diversity but we've still got the odd minority trying to create a divide. You talk of women having power and money. The quran that I have read states men should only marry women when they can look after them emotionally,physically and financially. Its going to be a shock but true Muslim men have to provide for their wives. The wives can earn but that's her money. But what man earns the wife has a right to that money. This is how my house works. Im free to work or dont work its not opposed on me. The husband and wife work as a team. Thats what a marriage is according to me and thats what I learnt from the quran. Like another poster said you will find extreme views from any religion be it Christianity or Islam. Im only saying what I have learnt.

Your claim was this : " All but one are from St Paul who never met Jesus. He complains about women leading worship , which means women were leading worship. Elsewhere Jesus says the Law is replaced by a new commandment : Love one another as I have loved you."

You said Jesus replaced the law.

That's not what he said. He did not say he replaced the law. And that would be Mosaic law. He said a new commandment. He did not say " forget all that other stuff, here is a new single commandment". The verse you quote does not back up your claim.

Joh 13:34 "A new command I give to you, that you love one another; according as I loved you, that you also love one another;" (LSV)

Nope, as I said in my previous post, what he did say was that not one iota of the law would change. Are you saying Matthew and Luke are wrong ? Both of which were written before John.

And note what John wrote just a few lines before your quote. Joh 10:35 "If He called them gods to whom the word of God came (and the Writing is not able to be broken)," (LSV)

It's a major theme of the Bible. That Gods law cannot be changed.

I was not the one making the original points/claim by the way.

I joined in where you asked where Jesus said he gave a new commandment. I told you where.

The Last Supper being the occasion, it seems likely it was a major, parting commandment.

So are all forms of discrimination bad? So if there was a group for non cis men only, and no cis men were allowed, would that be bad, or are non cis men allowed their own groups?

Tellingly, actual questions raised (can female imams preach to men?) are never answered, instead new information is provided to distract.

If the best available response is that some new Mosques have nicer facilities for women and girls, that's rather sad. How about allowing Muslim women to have some real power and influence, not just a bigger back room at the Mosque and a more expensive loudspeaker?

How about tackling the feminist issue of cousin marriage & high rates of child disabilities? Or ensuring all sharia marriages include a civil (legal) process so women and children are protected by UK divorce laws?

Most British women greatly value their education, career and financial success. They want a marriage of equals where both spouses share the financial and emotional responsibilities. Their husband might even be the one to stay home when the children are very young.

Requiring the husband to provide for his (up to 4) wife/wives, while letting them keep their income as 'pin money' is hugely insulting to everyone involved. It's very unattractive, shockingly sexist and extremely regressive. This is the 21st Century, marriages are very different now.

I’ve heard it all now. Disapproving of women being covered and controlled by a misogynistic custom that isn’t even in the Koran is now Islamophobia. Whatever.

I completely agree with you OP - I would have great difficulty bringing up a daughter with a partner with such views, not to mention the Gender Ideology aspect.

But the claim was that Jesus replaced all the laws with one. That was not the case.

Also, you quoted John. The gospel of John does not have the last supper.

John 13 is generally agreed to be in the setting of the Last Supper just before Jesus was crucified.

If it is a supper the day before the Last Supper, as a few argue , it was still evidently an extraordinarily important next to last meal with the disciples, just before he became the Passover lamb himself.

What he says is of enormous purport as being among his last words.

You have also been answered about where he says A new command I give to you ( love one another….)

I have never personally maintained that Jesus dismissed earlier laws. The Ten Commandments are at the core of Christianity. Then so are overriding ideas like he who is without sin throw the first stone, forgive, love one another, and the fact that Jesus himself broke laws about touching an unclean woman, doing work on a forbidden day etc

If you've already made your mind up of Islam being so backwards why ask me. Clearly I wasn't very clear about Muslim women imaams. No women imaams can't preach to muslim men as far as i know as we havent had that. I don't find that odd at all. Men for men and women for women thats how its been.If there is a facility being catered solely for the purpose of women then obviously there will be women imaams. You talk about disabilities. Why are there so many kids with disabilities in the other communities who are not related? I think what you've been fed for so many years is showing. So if an Asian family have a child with a disability you'll just assume they are related so its self inflicted but if its a white family its nothing to do with being related. You say women to have proper power. How would you define by having proper power? As for your comment about a back room. My friend its a whole building and not just a back room with speakers. As for sharia law. We have 1 ceremony with the nikkah that you call the sharia law and 1 thats registered in the country you're living. So the woman is protected. As mentioned before its up to the woman to work or not to work. Well thats how my family and relatives have been bought up. The way you have portrayed us all is all women are oppressed and we can't do anything for ourselves. We're all house slaves. Here's a shocker for you. You'll find extreme sides to alot of other faiths too. So just because you have heard about a few cases please don't label us all like that. As I mentioned before the woman has equal rights as her husband. If shes not getting all her rights or shes not being treated well she has a right to a divorce. Islam allows that. It even states in the quran. I know some cultures see this as a taboo and are against the idea of a divorce.
Have a good day.

😂😂 airless rooms. Why don't you just say we're locked away in a dungeon. I love it!!

With hijab superglue to our heads 😄 🤣

So why do you wear the hijab then? What’s in it for you and your daughters?

Or burkha? I’m not educated in these matters so I am keen to know the logic. What’s in it for the women?

That no man gets to enjoy my hair, hooray.