Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton, following Employment Tribunal judgment - thread #58

[nauticant]

Judgment was handed down on 8 December 2025:
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6936ce28a6fc97b81e57436a/S_Peggie_v_Fife_Health_Board__Dr_Upton.pdf

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence was 29 July 2025. It resumed again over 1 to 2 September for closing submissions.

The hearing was live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6.

Links to previous threads #1 to #50 can be found in this thread: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 51: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5402652-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-51 1 September 2025 to 2 September 2025
Thread 52: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5403218-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-52 2 September 2025 to 4 September 2025
Thread 53: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5404208-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-53 3 September 2025 to 1 October 2025
Thread 54: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5418690-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-54 28 September 2025 to 21 November 2025
Thread 55: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5447019-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-55 19 November 2025 to 8 December 2025
Thread 56: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5456749-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-56 8 December 2025 to 9 December 2025
Thread 57: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5457132-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-57 9 December 2025 to 11 December 2025

Some of them also think that because feminists have fought to end stigma around menstruation, there is no reason for a woman to want privacy to deal with menstrual flooding. Apparently this is very anti-feminist and we should be proud for male colleagues to see our blood-soaked trousers.

Very female perspectives, to be sure.

That would be such a brilliant watch, hope we can access the EAT

Don't think I haven't noticed how it goes all 'Naomi who?' once Ben steps into view. Fickle!
Or maybe just straight

Lol, I was wondering whether I needed a name change for the next thread. They are both great though.

New Telegraph piece, Foran speaks

archive.is/rNrzk

Even on Trans Reddit, they (or rather P-t-d) are realising that:

a) This correction should not have been allowed, and
b) It doesn't even amount to what the judge says it amounts to.

Very, very sad times.

Protect-the-dollz
• 36m ago • Edited 31m ago

Bad news, though I don't think they need him. Reading the rules on Correction Notices there is caselaw that they are not to be used to replace incorrect quotations of authorities, which must be left for the appellate courts to deal with.
Which is exactly what EJ Kemp has done here.
They could be represented by Mr Bean and they would still get permission to appeal on that point alone.

Can someone please explain to me who Ben Cooper is…. I’m new here, relatively, my interest started during this case.

As is Naomi!

Naomi's going to be on it too, though, right? I thought I heard that BC was joining the team in addition to NC, not replacing her?

If I'm right then it's going to be the absolute dream team. Have they worked directly together before, does anyone remember?

Well, they were always going to get a KC for this, so we're not completely without honour😇

He's (P-t-d) also realising that they're starting to tug on the end of the knitting:

Protect-the-dollz
• 2h ago • Edited 2h ago

The correction notice is up.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/693ac29933c7ace9c4a42024/4104864.2024PeggieFifeFH11.12.25corrected.pdf
Deletes 791 and substitutes it with a new quote from Forstater.
Tbh that is wooly as fuck- it doesn't really say what the original quote said and will give rise to a ground for appeal.
Other paragraphs which quote the original 791 also now no longer make sense.
No word on the other 4 'phantom' quotes.

Right, off out for a bit of pre-Christmas catching-up with people. (I hear there's an actual real world beyond the front door.)

Please would you sort out among yourselves not to fill this thread while I'm away. Thanks!

I hesitate to raise this, but there’s also the question of whether Jane Russell being aristocratically titled (by marriage) and then inexplicably becoming a KC is at play in any way in the class snobbery landscape.

Ladies now now, dont go all dreamy about BC. We are firmly in NC time here too.

Shes just too busy taking on the entire TRA army she needed some temporary reinforcements.

Yeah all right, spoilsport -a girl can dream😏

He's a barrister who has won other high profile cases in the field, notably the Forstater case.

https://oldsquare.co.uk/people/ben-cooper-kc/

I'm insanely in love with both of them.

Sandies speech made me cry what a shero

Is being in love with lawyers a literal gender identity?😄

God what a week and its only just Thursday.

I just cannot get over that they called a legal hallucination a clerical error and didn't actually pick up some majorly critical typos or you know actual massive fuck ups.

We now know BIg Sond is an ass, but now the law is an ass.

Oh well we might get some sense by thread 109 or something.

Off to donate to the Darlington Nurses - I think they should do a private prosecution under the Workplace Regulations 1992 - way easier to do in England.

Well done Sandie. You are a strong woman.

Come on, Michael my lad, I don't pay my £5 a month to sit around just twiddling my thumbs, waiting for you to give us more than a tiny little teaser... 🤣

I love Naomi but Ben was my first love.

It is fanbloodytastic that they are doing the appeal together.

I am utterly delighted. 😁

point of law that hasn't been argued before, or a matter of real significance to the whole of the UK

It should be able to meet those tests, if necessary, surely?

That's OK Boiled, we're not gerbilphobes on this thread.

I found this from a discussion elsewhere when the Census results were released a couple of years ago: it appears that up to 118,000 of that count could be false positives (I'm sure it's substantially less than that, but it just shows what a stupid question it was).

"262k answered "No" to the question of whether their sex and GI were the same.

Of those, 118k gave no further information, and AFAIK no link to other census information (that might give information on birth sex) has been made - or at least published.

Of the remaining 144k who did give further information, 48k said TM, 48k said TW, and the remaining 48k said either NB or another neogender.

So we don't know what the split is of the 118k. It's likely that a proportion of them didn't understand the question as per newspaper reports, but not all. All I think we can say is that of those prepared to give further information, it's a tidy 3 way split between TM, TW and other including NB."