Europe must not erase sex - We must resist the imposition of activist fantasies

[IwantToRetire]

When, in mid-October, MPs from the broad left-wing bloc Nouveau Front Populaire tabled a proposal in the French Parliament to remove sex from national identity cards, they prefaced it with an explanation: having one’s sex recorded on identity documents, they claimed, is bad for equality, bad for women, and especially bad for those who identify as transgender. “It is common for an individual’s appearance not to correspond to the stereotypes associated with the sex recorded on their official papers,” they argued, followed by a non sequitur of the highest order: that sex itself is an outdated stereotype.

Feminist discussion groups exploded. One woman asked, “What happened to the French? Have they gone mad?” Truth be told, the same question could be asked of many nations today: have the Irish, Portuguese, Belgians, Germans and others gone mad? And if they have not, what explains why legislators across so many states are suddenly deciding that biological sex — not only a basic fact of human reproduction but a cornerstone of equality and non-discrimination law — is a relic of the past to be discarded like phrenology or geocentrism?

The almost 70 left-wing MPs who backed the proposal in the French National Assembly also claimed that, unlike a person’s height — also recorded on ID cards — recording a person’s sex is not in line with international human rights standards set by the United Nations, the Council of Europe and the European Union. Considering recent developments in these institutions, it seems, at least on the surface, difficult to argue against that claim.

Article continues at https://thecritic.co.uk/europe-must-not-erase-sex/

Children lacking the cognitive maturity, life experience, and legal knowledge to understand the complex concepts, consequences, and long-term implications involved isn't quite the same as childish inclinations.

"What are these associations with the opposite sex in terms of gendered inclinations?"

You tell me? Just how do you distinguish men from women in practice IE in social situations when you don't know a person's sex? Do you reserve judgment until the gametal test results come in? Xray vision or…….?

Could somebody please provide a comprehensive list of these gendered social categorisations? And the inclinations? I need to know all the ways I'm womaning incorrectly....

So according to you, men are only attracted to women who perform femininity. Women know this so they perform femininity in order to attract men. Sometimes this is wholly or partly unconscious behaviour.

If your description of behaviour is correct, lesbians and gender nonconforming women don't exist. Men who are attracted to women who don't perform femininity don't exist either.

You're denying my existence.

Err didn't most if not all major women's sporting organisations change or are in the process of changing eligibility criteria?

Aren't there laws that exist with exceptions for services?

Don't prisons have risk management policies for dangerous prisoners?

Isn't the Uk in the process of implementing practical policy?

If you are expecting perfection in implementation of any safety initiative you have the wrong species…

Again, you tell us how you do it in practice…

Denying the existence of many many women.

Once you see it you cannot unsee it.

Just how do you distinguish men from women in practice IE in social situations when you don't know a person's sex?

When you meet someone, their sex is normally obvious if you have reasonably good eyesight and hearing.

If you struggle with this it might be because you're male (women tend to be better at discerning sex even in a androgynous individuals).

And yet, full exclusion based on sex provides the mechanism for as full protection as we can expect.

Full exclusion with no ‘case by case’ evaluations at all is the only way to attain that level of protection.

And if a male person is not considered a female person for even one instance in life, then there is no possible consistency to that claim that the male person is in any way female. Because female people are always female and cannot be excluded on the basis that they are not a female person.

"Even if he likes dresses. And it's quite OK for him to like dresses."

I agree. The thing is trans people aren't denying the biological reality of sex. And they also aren't denying the socially gendered reality.

But trans people have associations to their opposite sex in terms of inclinations that when expressed are aligned with gendered social categorisations.

They have “feelz” that they think trump reality.

socially gendered reality
😂😂😂😂

It would be so distressing for you to discover that large numbers of women really aren't interested in performing femininity and think that regressive gender stereotypes should be binned, wouldn't it?

I wonder if it is helpful to remind a group of male people that they need to take responsibility for their decisions.

https://x.com/knownheretic/status/1983627278715437473?s=46

Amy Sousa posted this video as a timely reminder.

"So according to you, men are only attracted to women who perform femininity. Women know this so they perform femininity in order to attract men. Sometimes this is wholly or partly unconscious behaviour."

Nope. Not all men. Not all women. Just most. And both know this & both are inclined to accentuate sexual attractiveness.

"If your description of behaviour is correct, lesbians and gender nonconforming women don't exist. Men who are attracted to women who don't perform femininity don't exist either."

Nope. Non normative 'variation' clearly exists that's built into the system due to a combination of genetic factors like mutations, sexual reproduction, and the shuffling of genes, and environmental factors such as diet, climate, and lifestyle.

The reasons this happens is due to 'natural selection' IE a trait provides a survival or reproductive advantage in a specific environment, the genes for that trait are more likely to be passed on to the next generation. Or 'genetic drift' where random changes in the frequency of alleles in a population, especially significant in small groups or in a 'founder effect' when a new population is established by a small number of individuals.

Men who say they think they're women are actually just performing a parody of how they think a woman would behave.

It keeps coming back to this amorphous concept of femininity. Femininity doesn’t mean ‘female sex’ unless it reflects someone’s rank sexism.

Gender stereotypes aren't biological. They're culturally constructed.

So you don't go by gametes. Thankyou for your honesty.

It seems we need a reminder on every thread of this topic :

No male can ever experience life as a woman. They can only ever experience life as a male person who believes they are a woman.

Even when they 'act' like a woman, they are acting as they believe a 'woman' should act. Which is fucking misogynistic!

Even if they are treated 'as a woman' by some people, they are being treated as a 'male who presents as a woman and believes they are a woman'. Because their every reaction is based on that. Not on them being female in any way.

Even when they have extreme body modifications, it is to be their own concept of what a female looks like to them. It is not what a female is.

How can it be?

The only way a person can experience life as a woman, is to have a female body, formed around the production of large gametes, (regardless of if that body produces those gametes) even if it doesn't produce those and to navigate their life based on the decisions they and society makes that revolve around them having that body.

A male can conceptualise what it might be like to be a female, but that is all it ever is - their concept of being female.

They may do it because they don't feel they fit into how they conceptualise how a male person interacts with the world (ie. their own stereotypes around being male) or they do it because they want to be seen as a female (using their own stereotypes of how a female navigates life). It really doesn't matter though. Their motivation is irrelevant to the outcome.

Which is that they will always be just a male who believes they are something they are objectively not.

How can the material reality be any different? This is why someone's gender is only based on someone's philosophical belief. And philosophical beliefs are fine for people to hold, but not one person in the UK has to comply with another's philosophical belief.

The logic cannot be any different than that I am afraid.

The thing is trans people aren't denying the biological reality of sex. And they also aren't denying the socially gendered reality.
If they are not denying the biological reality of sex (and actually lots of them are) what's the problem with having correct sex markers on ID?

Might just keep reposting this over and over.

You made the claim lesbians don't exist because of evolutionary biology, I clarified why they do because of it.

Typical associations & stereotypes are socially constructed as a result of biological inclinations being expressed.

The sexes sharing personality traits means they can share more common gendered inclinations hence they can have similar or same experiences.

Thanks for your post @IwantToRetire

I found it an interesting read, before the inevitable happened

Because sex is also a proxy to identity of which they don't identify with.

That's the whole point. I can't tell you how I'm womaning in practice as I don't need to do anything other than be: I am a human, female, aged 39. None of these things are the result of any action of mine. They still make me a woman. There's no "practice" Of woman