Kelly v Leonardo Employment Tribunal Thread 2

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Ms BM Kelly v Leonardo UK Limited Employment Tribunal – hearing Case number: 8001497/2024

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Abbreviations:
C or MK - Claimant, Maria Kelly
NC - Naomi Cunningham, barrister for C
KW - Katy Wedderburn, solicitor for C
R or L - Respondent. Leonardo UK
ST - Susanne Tanner KC, barrister for R
J - Judge
P - Panel member
GC - gender critical
GI - gender identity
AL - Andrew R Letton VP People Shared Services Leonardo - respondent witness

Tribunal Tweets coverage here

https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/kelly-vs-leonardo-uk-ltd

Thread 1

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5416903-kelly-v-leonardo-employment-tribunal-29th-september-10am?page=1

I wouldn't be surprised if he does. He doesn't think women are human or should be protected under the law, clearly as he thinks woman = idea in a man's head.

Probably earns a fortune, throws women under the bus. L is acting completely illegally. Sex discrimination runs through them like rock.

I wonder how many women have been scared in the women's toilets but felt they couldn't speak up? There will be many. What about any religious women - they simply can't work there as there are no single sex facilities and they can't trust the employer to even tell the truth about who'll be in the loos.

His ignorance about NC about the bundle is a marker of his disrespect for his female employees. And isn't he supposed to be 'Head of People' or some such bullshit. Only the male people apparently.

Has the judge not seen the SP case?

Half a day. Ha ha ha.

I was just going to say the same thing
I'll post tomorrow AM to say if I'm free or not - in fact I should be able to do so tonight cos I'll know if my friends are staying over or not, but it's best to confirm tomorrow AM.
So watch this space tomorrow AM, hopefully I'll be able to deputise for M.

The thread reader app does not appear to be working at the moment but hopefully this afternoons tweets will appear here later.

tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/kelly-vs-leonardo-uk-ltd

When men are asked to visualise "people", it's usually men they see.

Plenty of research to show that a crowd scene in a film with 18% women is considered half women and a crowd with 35% women is seen as women dominating.

Yes I think so. Have a look here for more links to what had gone on that year: uk.leonardo.com/en/media/review-of-the-year-2020/february

Thank you, and @ThatPithySheep .

I've clearly been watching too many episodes of Law and Order, where the witnesses are very thoroughly prepared, some might think coached in what to say. I'd imagined ST being happy for him to stop now, and then explaining things to him tonight.

But that's criminal law, and the US. Not at all the same.

Thanks to you and @Boiledbeetle I find I have accidentally ordered a box of Tunnocks dark chocolate caramel wafers from Amazon. i can't think how that happened....

This applies to 90% of GI supporters.

Interesting.

AL 'correcting' NC when she said 'men using the women's toilets' and he said 'transgender females using..'
is significant because he said it after that onslaught of questioning which we perceived as crushing, there were even a few glimmers of sympathy -
'Leave it, Nay, he's 'ad enough, it's not worf it'

So at the end of the exchanges he still had enough arrogance in the tank to 'correct' NC, on a point that is central to the case: that transgender females are actually men, and that's what the law says.

She'll just have to try harder in the next session😁

Yes, true. I was trying to work out what the other matters were, especially as they seem to have been unpredictable.

There must have been a predictable reason why the hearing was only scheduled to start at 12 noon, but what was going on that meant the public weren't admitted at all that day - especially as the clerk kindly sent the potential observers an email to say there was a delay?

(If a significant player had a medical emergency so things had to wait, fair enough. We don't need to know.)

Dark chocolate, you say?

That seems to be Naomi’s destiny.

I for one am glad she accepts her destiny.

Do we know what time they are starting tomorrow?

The arrogance of the man is quite something.

transgender identified men are not only men under the law they're also men in reality and pose the same risks and harms to women as other men in women's spaces.

Hoping that Pete gets an airing tomorrow. If he does I'm wondering at what point the penny will drop with Mr 'Head of People but seemingly only the male ones' that what he's been doing breaks the law.

And it’s such a blink-and-you’ll miss-it burn, too!

I hate it when men refer to women as "females". Female what? Toilets? It's dehumanising.

And in any case trans identifying men have said they are women but male. Then they came for female. Now they are coming for biological.

This is why language matters.

Pete is sad that he didn't get to play today.

Virtually all their Trustpilot reviews (mostly positive) are for important health and safety courses.

They throw themselves in your basket whilst you are busy picking which new bathroom towels to buy.

Sadly, I don't think we will see Pete this time. The Judge seemed put off by a hypothetical question earlier.

TT Tweets from this afternoon.

1st https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1973720294209774048.html

2nd https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1973755727450935341.html

Are the links in the Februar post redirecting because it would go to their intranet or because there was a big clean up session?