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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Women’s privacy and dignity

1000 replies

Mrspenguinsschoolforfreaks · 07/09/2025 13:43

I’ve just been to my local leisure centre swimming pool and while I was in the changing rooms a woman walked in from the showers, fully naked. I averted my eyes, and she walked quite close past me in a way which to me (and I fully accept I may well have imagined it) felt a bit pointed. I felt vaguely uncomfortable and embarrassed in the same way I would have if a man had walked in naked.

My impression is that the vast majority of people on this forum believe that it is a fundamental breach of women’s privacy and dignity if people with male biology (whether cisgender men or trans women) share changing facilities with women. Yet they do not consider that it undermines a woman’s privacy or dignity to have to get changed in front of other women, or to see other women naked.

I understand that many women have had experiences with men’s exhibitionist or voyeuristic behaviour which makes them specifically uncomfortable being undressed around men, or being around men who are undressed. But I’ve often seen the argument on here that it equally undermines men’s privacy and dignity to have to share changing facilities with women.

So my question is, do you think privacy and dignity are not infringed by having to get changed in front of people of the same sex? If not, why not?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
56
Helleofabore · 09/09/2025 10:50

Howseitgoin · 09/09/2025 10:19

"whoring' around,"

You say that like it's a bad thing…..😂

You don't seem to be with the times where ironically taking ownership of derogatory terms like black people do for the 'n' word or women do for 'bitch'.

Or maybe you do & this is another cheap attempt at discrediting.

Using MRA arguments and links = anything that threatens my worldview

"All while telling women how much they much hate trans people because they don't want to share single sex spaces with male people."

When on the ropes? Strawman…

"But again, posted with the question of why should women have single sex spaces as if this scenario will surely convince others that we may as well get rid of any female single sex spaces and just have uni sex spaces from now."

The sound of someone who doesn't understand that the consequences of women's choices aren't always a zero sum gain…or doesn't care.

Edited

Imagine thinking using the term ‘whoring’ around on a feminist board and thinking there is anyway to excuse.

And no, I don’t need to ‘discredit’ your points and links. You do it all by yourself by posting them and not being able to defend those points and links with consistency, logic or coherence. Your points don’t ’threaten’ my world view at all. They do however reinforce that arguments like your own are not defensible by anything else but dishonest tactics, theories and emotional manipulation.

AnSolas · 09/09/2025 10:51

So it one believes that there are 4 sex class can one /should one call oneself bi?

Should it not be quadsexual 👀 ?

SoManyTshirts · 09/09/2025 11:17

feministmom4ever · 07/09/2025 15:36

But you don’t have to get changed in front of anyone. You can wait until you get home to change/shower, get changed in the toilet stall (cramped, but doable), or just avoid public changing areas altogether.

Please don’t use the toilet stalls for changing. As one gets older, the need to pee after exercise can be very strong and there are rarely enough loos at busy times. Use a towel as you would on the beach, if you must. Invest in a dry-robe, invented for this very purpose.

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 09/09/2025 11:56

ArabellaSaurus · 09/09/2025 09:38

Women not performing to your requirements? Shame.

Women are just SO disappointing aren’t they? If only they would sit and be patronised and then meekly accept that they are always wrong.

Keeptoiletssafe · 09/09/2025 11:59

Howseitgoin · 09/09/2025 08:44

There's no theory. Attempts at smearing innuendo at commenters that raise contradictions in gender critical ideology are part of the MO here & its done by an organised mob. It's designed to discredit views that threaten their world view. Nothing personal here, they just don't see this forum as a place for discussion, rather a propaganda vehicle & anyone 'questioning' inconsistencies are the enemy to be driven out lest they should persuade the unsuspecting of their flaws in rationale.

What's particularly ironical is it's all done under the guise of 'feminism' & yet women who don't toe the GC line are slurred as predatory men whose main purpose is only access to abuse women.

The 'anti stereotype' people it appears think that women are or should be a monolith. They are effectively as authoritarian as the Patriarchy in terms of a woman's right to think for herself & as such a threat to the principles of feminism & social cohesion.

I will tell you exactly and truthfully why I post.

Because of the experiences I have gone through, I was trying to keep toilets safe so fewer people are harmed by not being attended to quickly enough if they collapse in a toilet.

I wrote at length to a government consultation on toilets and months later, in the analysis published, my comments and concerns and those of a charity that I knew had written in, were ignored. So I looked and found a consultation document from a company that had been employed to advise government on design for people with long term health conditions and they had recommended fully enclosed toilets. I read all the references in their report and the relevant one to enclose toilets is a paper from American transactivists. I read the work of the transactivists which has a lot of phallic imagery and was influenced a lot by the male gaze in public toilets in terms of cruising. It had nothing to do with the focusing on the practical design safety for people with long term health conditions. I watched YouTube videos by the architect who discussed last year his life’s work to Harvard students and how he has not analysed the designs. A safety analysis, to my knowledge, has still not been done.

Back to the company’s consultation to the government. Rather than even mention most of the common long term health conditions (their remit) the report discussed such things as the correct urinal heights for non-binary people and rather than endometriosis for example, which can cause collapse in toilets, periods were only referenced at the back in terms of sanitary bins for transmen. There was no mention of cardiac arrests which are more likely to happen in toilets and need a quick response. I looked into the company and found they had been awarded a Stonewall Gold Award.

I then looked at the analysis results. There was a Stonewall report that was mentioned thousands of times in the majority of the total replies to the government. This skewed the data to the point that the results ‘showed’ only 2% of people supported disabled (accessible) toilets. I looked and found Stonewall had put a campaign together that said to write in to promote gender-neutral toilets (which are enclosed) and a specific report of theirs. I looked at this Stonewall report which had a section on discrimination in facilities. There was one account of a trans person being pushed by 2 women when shouting didn’t work to get them out of the toilet. They were two other mentions of people telling people to get out of the facilities. This was called verbal abuse so I don’t know what words were used. Of course this will be upsetting for everyone.

This is contrast with me demonstrating how a door gap has saved lives and its role in preventing assaults, neither of which were mentioned in the government report.

According to that Stonewall report 48% of the 733 trans people surveyed, don’t feel uncomfortable using public toilets. So I looked to see how many people feel uncomfortable using public toilets. According to a poll of 2000 British people, done by Bloo, 80% Brits would only venture into a public toilet if it was completely unavoidable.

Along the way, I tried to find other statistics about what happened in toilets and the huge amount of sexual assaults that happen in toilets and other completely private spaces in public areas became apparent. I made the link between privacy and risk of attack because of the patterns I saw with unisex toilets and that one woman on video pleading with officials at her child’s school, nicknaming them rape cubicles.

I focused a lot on schools due to my experience and the fact there was lots of data coming out of schools as some schools had designed all their toilets to be fully enclosed and mixed sex. It quickly came apparent that this leads all the problems I thought it would, and discriminates against those pupils with long term health conditions and girls. One thing I have had a running discussion with the Department of Education is that they don’t hold an equality and impact statement for their guidance on toilet designs, which are all ‘for privacy’ now (5mm from floor to door). This is despite at least a dozen pupils in an average school having conditions such as epilepsy and diabetes. There are children that have had seizures in school due to illness and smoking spiked vapes. There are defibrillators in every school but the common place where pupils go when they feel ill is hidden from view. The ‘gender-neutral’ design affects vulnerable people more. It is the very opposite of inclusive. I have noticed the last deaths in uk school toilets have all been in cubicles with private design.

This is not a conspiracy. All of it was from following the trail from that government toilet consultation. It’s still all on-line if you want to check.

In the final Document T you will also see door gaps aren’t mentioned in the single sex toilets designs (C and D). The universal designs (A and B) have to be fully private and can be used as single sex designs too.

I have corresponded with the HSE/BSR and they say single sex toilets can have door gaps they are just not mentioned. It used to say in the documents leading to BS6465 (which is where Doc T originated from) there should be a floor to door gap of not more than 150mm for supervision, cleaning, ventilation and prevention of wilful misuse and a gap above the door to the ceiling. From my research I think the focus had been on enclosing all toilets because of the push to make toilets open to both sexes and that this reduces the threat of voyeurism. However technology has moved on and now the greater threat of voyeurism is from hidden cameras. Private toilets offer the design that enables the set up of these tiny hidden cameras without anyone suspecting. Because of all the extra gadgets you have to have in a unisex toilet (extra mechanical ventilation, sink, dryer, hopefully a fire alarm) I think the hidden cameras are more difficult to spot.

The best designed toilets are the safest and healthiest. They should be as simply designed as possible with gaps above and under the doors and partitions. The floor to door gap should be 150mm to allow people to recognise threats to occupant safety. They should ideally have gaps above a standard door to the ceiling to enable air circulation. They should be single sex and have a single sex area in front which commonly has the sinks in. The door should rest in the open position. There should be an ambulant design following the above principal and the option of an accessible (disabled) toilet within single sex toilets too. This extra space toilet would also be useful for mothers with buggies/small children of either sex, and give disabled people the advantages of single sex design, so that if they collapse they don’t have to rely on being conscious enough to pull a cord which is often not reachable/non-existent/not working. It is also a preventative measure for possible assaults.

Any private toilet, especially if it’s unisex, should be monitored extra carefully. The numbers of unisex toilets should be reduced as much as possible. In Document T is does makes allowances for this, for example in a cafe where there’s one toilet as it would be more noticeable if something was wrong inside. All toilets need to be openable from the outside, even if the person has locked themselves in, for safety reasons. The measure of a civilised society is how it treats its vulnerable.

The Good Law Project has got hundreds of thousands of pounds in donations to argue for more dangerous toilets designs for us all. As soon as the area in front of toilet cubicles is mixed sex, the cubicle housing the toilets are private. From my research, the people that are least at risk from physical harm due to these designs, the designs the Good Law Project will have to argue for, are healthy, heterosexual, adult men.

Now I doubt you’ll read all that and you have never responded but you may scroll down to the last sentence so…

The Supreme Court ruling allows the safest and healthiest designs to be at the forefront again.

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 09/09/2025 12:00

Howseitgoin · 09/09/2025 08:44

There's no theory. Attempts at smearing innuendo at commenters that raise contradictions in gender critical ideology are part of the MO here & its done by an organised mob. It's designed to discredit views that threaten their world view. Nothing personal here, they just don't see this forum as a place for discussion, rather a propaganda vehicle & anyone 'questioning' inconsistencies are the enemy to be driven out lest they should persuade the unsuspecting of their flaws in rationale.

What's particularly ironical is it's all done under the guise of 'feminism' & yet women who don't toe the GC line are slurred as predatory men whose main purpose is only access to abuse women.

The 'anti stereotype' people it appears think that women are or should be a monolith. They are effectively as authoritarian as the Patriarchy in terms of a woman's right to think for herself & as such a threat to the principles of feminism & social cohesion.

That’s an awful lot of words to say that ‘men can be women whether you accept it or not’.

Keeptoiletssafe · 09/09/2025 12:07

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 09/09/2025 12:00

That’s an awful lot of words to say that ‘men can be women whether you accept it or not’.

Now if you want lots of words to say why single sex toilet designs are best, I am always here!

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 09/09/2025 12:08

Keeptoiletssafe · 09/09/2025 12:07

Now if you want lots of words to say why single sex toilet designs are best, I am always here!

I love your posts @Keeptoiletssafe 💐

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2025 12:10

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 09/09/2025 12:00

That’s an awful lot of words to say that ‘men can be women whether you accept it or not’.

The inconvenient thing is, they can’t 🤷‍♀️ the end.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 09/09/2025 12:11

What do you think is going to happen to you if you see a naked woman?

Helleofabore · 09/09/2025 12:12

Keeptoiletssafe

Your posts do get read though. Even though not necessarily by the posters who you are replying to at the time. Thank you.

Howseitgoin · 09/09/2025 12:13

Keeptoiletssafe · 09/09/2025 11:59

I will tell you exactly and truthfully why I post.

Because of the experiences I have gone through, I was trying to keep toilets safe so fewer people are harmed by not being attended to quickly enough if they collapse in a toilet.

I wrote at length to a government consultation on toilets and months later, in the analysis published, my comments and concerns and those of a charity that I knew had written in, were ignored. So I looked and found a consultation document from a company that had been employed to advise government on design for people with long term health conditions and they had recommended fully enclosed toilets. I read all the references in their report and the relevant one to enclose toilets is a paper from American transactivists. I read the work of the transactivists which has a lot of phallic imagery and was influenced a lot by the male gaze in public toilets in terms of cruising. It had nothing to do with the focusing on the practical design safety for people with long term health conditions. I watched YouTube videos by the architect who discussed last year his life’s work to Harvard students and how he has not analysed the designs. A safety analysis, to my knowledge, has still not been done.

Back to the company’s consultation to the government. Rather than even mention most of the common long term health conditions (their remit) the report discussed such things as the correct urinal heights for non-binary people and rather than endometriosis for example, which can cause collapse in toilets, periods were only referenced at the back in terms of sanitary bins for transmen. There was no mention of cardiac arrests which are more likely to happen in toilets and need a quick response. I looked into the company and found they had been awarded a Stonewall Gold Award.

I then looked at the analysis results. There was a Stonewall report that was mentioned thousands of times in the majority of the total replies to the government. This skewed the data to the point that the results ‘showed’ only 2% of people supported disabled (accessible) toilets. I looked and found Stonewall had put a campaign together that said to write in to promote gender-neutral toilets (which are enclosed) and a specific report of theirs. I looked at this Stonewall report which had a section on discrimination in facilities. There was one account of a trans person being pushed by 2 women when shouting didn’t work to get them out of the toilet. They were two other mentions of people telling people to get out of the facilities. This was called verbal abuse so I don’t know what words were used. Of course this will be upsetting for everyone.

This is contrast with me demonstrating how a door gap has saved lives and its role in preventing assaults, neither of which were mentioned in the government report.

According to that Stonewall report 48% of the 733 trans people surveyed, don’t feel uncomfortable using public toilets. So I looked to see how many people feel uncomfortable using public toilets. According to a poll of 2000 British people, done by Bloo, 80% Brits would only venture into a public toilet if it was completely unavoidable.

Along the way, I tried to find other statistics about what happened in toilets and the huge amount of sexual assaults that happen in toilets and other completely private spaces in public areas became apparent. I made the link between privacy and risk of attack because of the patterns I saw with unisex toilets and that one woman on video pleading with officials at her child’s school, nicknaming them rape cubicles.

I focused a lot on schools due to my experience and the fact there was lots of data coming out of schools as some schools had designed all their toilets to be fully enclosed and mixed sex. It quickly came apparent that this leads all the problems I thought it would, and discriminates against those pupils with long term health conditions and girls. One thing I have had a running discussion with the Department of Education is that they don’t hold an equality and impact statement for their guidance on toilet designs, which are all ‘for privacy’ now (5mm from floor to door). This is despite at least a dozen pupils in an average school having conditions such as epilepsy and diabetes. There are children that have had seizures in school due to illness and smoking spiked vapes. There are defibrillators in every school but the common place where pupils go when they feel ill is hidden from view. The ‘gender-neutral’ design affects vulnerable people more. It is the very opposite of inclusive. I have noticed the last deaths in uk school toilets have all been in cubicles with private design.

This is not a conspiracy. All of it was from following the trail from that government toilet consultation. It’s still all on-line if you want to check.

In the final Document T you will also see door gaps aren’t mentioned in the single sex toilets designs (C and D). The universal designs (A and B) have to be fully private and can be used as single sex designs too.

I have corresponded with the HSE/BSR and they say single sex toilets can have door gaps they are just not mentioned. It used to say in the documents leading to BS6465 (which is where Doc T originated from) there should be a floor to door gap of not more than 150mm for supervision, cleaning, ventilation and prevention of wilful misuse and a gap above the door to the ceiling. From my research I think the focus had been on enclosing all toilets because of the push to make toilets open to both sexes and that this reduces the threat of voyeurism. However technology has moved on and now the greater threat of voyeurism is from hidden cameras. Private toilets offer the design that enables the set up of these tiny hidden cameras without anyone suspecting. Because of all the extra gadgets you have to have in a unisex toilet (extra mechanical ventilation, sink, dryer, hopefully a fire alarm) I think the hidden cameras are more difficult to spot.

The best designed toilets are the safest and healthiest. They should be as simply designed as possible with gaps above and under the doors and partitions. The floor to door gap should be 150mm to allow people to recognise threats to occupant safety. They should ideally have gaps above a standard door to the ceiling to enable air circulation. They should be single sex and have a single sex area in front which commonly has the sinks in. The door should rest in the open position. There should be an ambulant design following the above principal and the option of an accessible (disabled) toilet within single sex toilets too. This extra space toilet would also be useful for mothers with buggies/small children of either sex, and give disabled people the advantages of single sex design, so that if they collapse they don’t have to rely on being conscious enough to pull a cord which is often not reachable/non-existent/not working. It is also a preventative measure for possible assaults.

Any private toilet, especially if it’s unisex, should be monitored extra carefully. The numbers of unisex toilets should be reduced as much as possible. In Document T is does makes allowances for this, for example in a cafe where there’s one toilet as it would be more noticeable if something was wrong inside. All toilets need to be openable from the outside, even if the person has locked themselves in, for safety reasons. The measure of a civilised society is how it treats its vulnerable.

The Good Law Project has got hundreds of thousands of pounds in donations to argue for more dangerous toilets designs for us all. As soon as the area in front of toilet cubicles is mixed sex, the cubicle housing the toilets are private. From my research, the people that are least at risk from physical harm due to these designs, the designs the Good Law Project will have to argue for, are healthy, heterosexual, adult men.

Now I doubt you’ll read all that and you have never responded but you may scroll down to the last sentence so…

The Supreme Court ruling allows the safest and healthiest designs to be at the forefront again.

I don't respond because my issue isn't with toilet design rather the pros & cons of trans people being unable to use the toilet of their gender given that they are of a substantially increased risk of abuse by men & research of public toilets where laws allow them shows that they aren't a risk to women.

I note you suggest unisex toilets are problematic but with the new UK ruling that kind of puts trans people at an increased risk if they can't even have access to those.

childofthe607080s · 09/09/2025 12:18

Dignity and privacy are balanced against other things - like costs which relate to more general inclusiveness

so it’s cheapest to have one general changing area

the sexual relationship between male and female mean that’s not really acceptable as it places women at substantial higher risk - so that’s a male and female area

some may also find nakedness in front of other women difficult - but without the risks there is no justification to spend more to make all facilities fully private

is that really that complicated to understand?

TheKeatingFive · 09/09/2025 12:18

Howseitgoin · 09/09/2025 12:13

I don't respond because my issue isn't with toilet design rather the pros & cons of trans people being unable to use the toilet of their gender given that they are of a substantially increased risk of abuse by men & research of public toilets where laws allow them shows that they aren't a risk to women.

I note you suggest unisex toilets are problematic but with the new UK ruling that kind of puts trans people at an increased risk if they can't even have access to those.

If men are at risk from other men, in men's spaces, why would this be a woman's problem to solve?

We aren't shields or human support animals.

And what about other groups of men who many be at risk? Kids, older men? Why no focus on them?

RedToothBrush · 09/09/2025 12:18

Helleofabore · 09/09/2025 12:12

Keeptoiletssafe

Your posts do get read though. Even though not necessarily by the posters who you are replying to at the time. Thank you.

This.

Its getting read and processed.

childofthe607080s · 09/09/2025 12:22

All men are at risk form other men though
the transgender woman has a similar risk AND a similar offend rate to other men

that’s why they are considered to be men

you know it looks like a man and acts like a man- hey it’s a man

you could argue that all men might be safer in the ladies than in the men’s
possibly true
but the risk to women becomes much higher

so no thanks I don’t want unisex facilities that harm more women to protect some men

Helleofabore · 09/09/2025 12:22

Howseitgoin · 09/09/2025 12:13

I don't respond because my issue isn't with toilet design rather the pros & cons of trans people being unable to use the toilet of their gender given that they are of a substantially increased risk of abuse by men & research of public toilets where laws allow them shows that they aren't a risk to women.

I note you suggest unisex toilets are problematic but with the new UK ruling that kind of puts trans people at an increased risk if they can't even have access to those.

There is no onus on organisations to make special accommodations for those people who reject using the space that has been created for their sex. Of course, they can if they wish to.

However, the ruling by the SC clearly states that if something has been designated as being single sex then it is for people of that sex only. Sex. Not gender.

Have you got new evidence then that in the UK, under UK laws, that male people with transgender identities are at increased risk of abuse by other male people? If so, let's see it.

ArabellaSaurus · 09/09/2025 12:25

RedToothBrush · 09/09/2025 12:18

This.

Its getting read and processed.

Absolutely. You're doing such important work, Keeptoiletssafe. Lots of readers are able to see the clarity and import of the points youre making, and appreciate all the research and time.spent on trying to communicate it to the right people.

It's stark when one looks at statistics and evidence how safety, privacy, and dignity have all been tossed aside in the service of a tiny minority of people who dont want to use the services provided for their sex.

As far as I can see it only makes sense if one sees the 'trans' movement as a men's movement. Prioritising the wants and wishes of a small group of men over the safety and wellbeing of everyone else.

childofthe607080s · 09/09/2025 12:25

No risk to women? Pull the other one

Helleofabore · 09/09/2025 12:28

If there is a issue of male people being abused and attacked by other male people in male single sex provisions, a campaign is needed urgently to address this very issue.

Because there are many other vulnerable groups of male people who are still having to use male single sex provisions.

And yet, there is no campaign. It was never appropriate for any male group to be accommodated in female single sex spaces. Because by the very same argument that if male people will simply enter a female single sex space to attack their victims is considered to be a major compelling argument to not have single sex spaces in the first place, this simply means that that group of male people are not 100% safe in the female single sex spaces they have just coercively accessed.

Which also then significantly also undermines the argument that unless it can be 100% safe, why bother.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 09/09/2025 12:29

Howseitgoin · 09/09/2025 12:13

I don't respond because my issue isn't with toilet design rather the pros & cons of trans people being unable to use the toilet of their gender given that they are of a substantially increased risk of abuse by men & research of public toilets where laws allow them shows that they aren't a risk to women.

I note you suggest unisex toilets are problematic but with the new UK ruling that kind of puts trans people at an increased risk if they can't even have access to those.

I don't think anybody objects to unisex toilets being provided as an additional alternative to traditional single sex ones.

Please provide evidence that trans people are at risk of abuse by men when using the correct toilets for their sex.

There is no such thing as a "toilet of their gender".

Howseitgoin · 09/09/2025 12:30

TheKeatingFive · 09/09/2025 12:18

If men are at risk from other men, in men's spaces, why would this be a woman's problem to solve?

We aren't shields or human support animals.

And what about other groups of men who many be at risk? Kids, older men? Why no focus on them?

'If male children are a risk from other men, in men's spaces, why would this be a woman's problem to solve?'

I'f disabled/old/autistic people are at risk why would this be a woman's problem to solve?'

'If black/jewish/arab people are a risk, why would this be a woman's problem to solve?'

'If nothing affects my identity group why should I do anything?'

There's this thing called a 'social contract'. It's where we agree to cooperate in a community so we get cooperation back.

No person or identity group is an island & if you think women can do without the 'help' of men or vice versa I have a very nice bridge to sell you…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_contract

AnSolas · 09/09/2025 12:31

@Keeptoiletssafe just a FYI if you had seen this FOI which has I think criminal offences aa per police computer code.

https://www.met.police.uk/foi-ai/metropolitan-police/disclosure-2023/november-2023/sexual-offences-recorded-schools-january2017-september2023/

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 09/09/2025 12:33

Howseitgoin · 09/09/2025 12:30

'If male children are a risk from other men, in men's spaces, why would this be a woman's problem to solve?'

I'f disabled/old/autistic people are at risk why would this be a woman's problem to solve?'

'If black/jewish/arab people are a risk, why would this be a woman's problem to solve?'

'If nothing affects my identity group why should I do anything?'

There's this thing called a 'social contract'. It's where we agree to cooperate in a community so we get cooperation back.

No person or identity group is an island & if you think women can do without the 'help' of men or vice versa I have a very nice bridge to sell you…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_contract

Edited

It seems rather convenient that this social contract you speak of appears to require women to compromise their own safety, dignity and comfort for you, but doesn't require you to do anything in return.

What are women getting out of this deal, exactly?

TheKeatingFive · 09/09/2025 12:33

Howseitgoin · 09/09/2025 12:30

'If male children are a risk from other men, in men's spaces, why would this be a woman's problem to solve?'

I'f disabled/old/autistic people are at risk why would this be a woman's problem to solve?'

'If black/jewish/arab people are a risk, why would this be a woman's problem to solve?'

'If nothing affects my identity group why should I do anything?'

There's this thing called a 'social contract'. It's where we agree to cooperate in a community so we get cooperation back.

No person or identity group is an island & if you think women can do without the 'help' of men or vice versa I have a very nice bridge to sell you…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_contract

Edited

I am not here to mop up problems caused by men, towards other men. Women do enough of that already. It's not our job.

Go deal with men's bad behaviour if it's causing so many issues. Leave us out of it.

If I were to act as a shield to vulnerable men, 'transwomen' would not be top of my list, let me tell you. I'd be much more worried about little boys and older men's safety in the toilets than a great big man in a dress.

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