NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #46

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence had been intended to be 28 July with 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing was to have ended on 30 July. However, it became apparent as the hearing progressed that this schedule wouldn't be followed. (Considerable understatement.)

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #40 can be found in this thread: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 41: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379334-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-41 24 July 2025 to 25 July 2025
Thread 42: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379820-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-42 25 July 2025 to 25 July 2025
Thread 43: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379979-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-43 25 July 2025 to 27 July 2025
Thread 44: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5380196-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-44 25 July 2025 to 28 July 2025
Thread 45: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5381518-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-45 28 July 2025 to 28 July 2025

As for the vetting post. Surely it's not up to Fife to open it. Surely it would be better to forward it all to the solicitors for someone impartial to go through.

I wouldn't want the employers who have suspended me going through anything of mine (in the name of protection).

JR Thesis is being T is just a sex fetish?
EM For some, yes
JR SM have been supportive of this litigation
Yes
JR Yr evidence is no more than saying what someone reported. Its just anonymous
Yes
JR A post room worker or just happened to be in there
EM I dont know. We're notsure of the job
JR This work is needed as both ppl have received unpleasant notes. Is right and positive that the trust protects from alll this unpleasantness
EM Yes, is approp J
R Nothing untoward
EM Not as far as aware
JR Said is a mix of +ve and -ve and ppl scared to speak

I apologise, my autistic/dyslexic brain was writing a quick comment on Mums Net. Not writing a well researched academic paper. I was merely commenting no one human e.g., Sandie Peggie in this case is perfect.

I mistakenly used a tiny aspect of Feminism to try and underpin my point. That there is always negatives and positives in every movement and one cannot comment or research every aspect of the subject/topic. This is one of the first taught to new PGRs embarking on doctoral study.

See this is my issue with it. It's not the opening per se (unless marked P+C), it's the "vetting".

She is desperate. Everything she has done with this tribunal has been desperate. She resorts to smear campaigns because that is all she has. Desperate and deluded. Kinda sad really. It isn't a good look on her or NHS Fife.

I’d say they have a duty of care to filter out potential hate mail. Doesn’t strike me as unreasonable for the hospital to check mail sent to its employees; it’s not offering a postal drop service to them.

Yes this, not a group chat but my uncle once forwarded me a racist joke that was obviously doing the rounds. I just responded with 'Don't ever send me messages like this again'. Which shut it down. My Dh also tells me the disgusting messages he receives from some of his acquaintances.. like awful derogatory porn stuff, he tells them not to send him it. Its not his good friends - he would def rethink the friendship! For example he was getting them from our mild mannered 'professional' neighbour. Scary how many people think its completely acceptable.

She has form in previous tribunals. Also, in this one I think she called Sandie ‘Ms Piggy’.

FFS JR say her surname properly

I thought of anthrax at first too but rejected for same reason - perhaps the intention was to pre-sift any hate mail?

Don't know what JR wants from this witness. Witness is playing a straight bat.

I’ve seen a few of these tribunals where they like to take their own notes.

They are high profile though. There don't seem to be many out black TIMs in the UK? Not active on social media, anyway. And the marches are always very white.

From observing in NW London hospitals there are numerous Philippino trans medical staff

Munroe is British.

Shall I google as black trans British people for you, or can you manage that yourself?

aYou didn’t specify British in your original question.

I’m not sure what EM adds in terms of evidence to be fair

Media hysteria!!

JR finished

NC asking a quick Q

JR has also notably referred to S as Mrs Peggie not Miss Peggie/Piggie this time. What is she playing at?

out. Not mentioned fear in yr notes. Of pple being scared to speak out
EM Correct
JR Women arent safe anywhere any more- you embellished w the any more. U added this?
Coorect
JR Doesnt incl the post worker saying not getting post and about funeral. None in yr note
EM No
JR Wldnt be better to signpost to her LM?
EM She didnt seem to want to do that
JR But that;s what u do. She cld have raised a Gx or spoken to her union. Correct
JR U cld also advised re [miised Champions?]
EM I listened to what she said, she clearly wanted to say it and

I thought of anthrax at first too but rejected for same reason

Tempers rise this morning on MN...

its like the family witches in Bewtiched always disrespectfully misnaming Darren, as Darwin, Dolphin etc

I don't see the point of any of this. The anonymous caller could have been anyone. I don't think it proves anyone from Fife was fearful

long history of cross dressing in Asia, I think. But I was asking specifically about black trans-identifying people.

It's a bit of a sore point for them that they're so white in the UK and they like to run a narrative that they're super diverse. It really cast them in a bad light when they tried to co-opt BLM by trying to change the slogan to "black trans lives matter" and led to many people losing sympathy.

I'm assuming we're going to get to the real point of this witness once NC is doing the questioning.

At the moment it seems an odd witness to call.