NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #43

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence had been intended to be 28 July with 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing was to have ended on 30 July. However, it became apparent as the hearing progressed that this schedule wouldn't be followed.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:
drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #40 can be found in this thread: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 41: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379334-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-41 24 July 2025 to 25 July 2025
Thread 42: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379820-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-42 25 July 2025 to 25 July 2025

I wish I had time to read these threads! I stand behind SP & hope for a successful outcome & the case tears NHSF to shreds ..
if anyone wants to read most of the newspapers for free(!) sign up to Perth & Kinross library & log in to pressreader with your library details … I haven’t bought a newspaper (except times sometimes) in years…

Love it! Pete is really embracing his role! Very upbeat, feels like a 70s vibe, I expect him to be going down the disco tonight to do his best moves.

I want Pete the Plumber outside the tribunal on Monday singing that

😘

If anyone is looking for a weekend read about a witch hunt I can recommend The Franchise Affair by Josephine Tey.

I thought, I don't know that one, must look it out. Guess what, there it is on my bookshelves and I must have read it albeit probably ten or more years ago.

My copy of Terf Island has also been despatched. That should come in the next day or two, so I will have some (re) reading to do when this Tribunal is finished.

This has happened to me as well. Stood up for myself and the next thing, all hell let loose. Thank god my union was better than the chocolate teapot that NMU has turned out to be for Sandie.

That is good to read.

It was interesting to see that MC could not recall why she’d suggested reporting SP to the NMC.

SP’s action against her RCN union will be quite eye opening.

Absolutely there was something about her on TV about a month ago and that was my first thought, she looked so much less stressed.

She must be feeling great watching these muppets who tried to screw her up sit in the hot seat making pure fools of themselves, Doctors not knowing what sex they are. Seriously WTF?

Aww thank you for checking! Mine is the same, not least because my prof reg number is also my pension scheme number. I'd be scared of losing part of my pension into the ether!

Me too with the ❤️s. I’d be lost without the TTs

Im also loving the links to relevant X posts by Maya and others. I don’t do X so getting the facts straight from those bundles is crucial.

It seems most of our journalists aren’t bothered with facts unfortunately

Her clothes are even brighter @ickky. She’s really embraced pink!

It was interesting to see that MC could not recall why she’d suggested reporting SP to the NMC.

Have we heard (yet) who, if anyone, did report her? Because I don't think "I don't like the cut of this nurse's jib." would make a convincing case.

I thought they were being sued because of their lack of support for Sandie.

I hope the RCN are following this and noticing the shit hot legal team Sandie has and deep deep pockets and extensive resources behind her and thinking SHIT!!!!

If they have any sense, they'll fold before they get anywhere near a courtroom and pay her off. I think MG has already written to them, so they might be in negotiations already.

The RCN (Royal College of Nursing) - her union - are being sued I think. NMC (Nursing and Midwifery Council) is nurses' regulatory body and as far as I know, mention was made of referring SP to them but it didn't actually happen?

Which it clearly should have done if they genuinely believed these allegations against her.

instead got a witless who clearly hadnt been forewarned

I don’t know whether that was intentional but I like it 😜

FINALLY caught up with everything after missing two entire threads thanks to pesky life getting in the way.

I’ve been pondering on this a lot, the difference between the organisational decision and the personal behaviour of DU. It seems that IB said it could be discriminatory if wasn’t allowed to used the female changing room, and KS checked DU was okay to use the female CR. However, I don’t think any one has suggested that DU was excluded from the male changing room. It would only be if Fife had excluded DU from the male changing room that DU could claim a need to be in the female CR. It would also be very clear that if a male staff member had told DU to leave the male CR that would be harassment. So both Fife and DU are culpable.

I expect we picked this up at the time, but with all the kerfuffle about pronouns the past couple of days it's especially ally glaring.

Later session 13/02:
NC You had already provided BMA 2 days before mtg with B&H policy and EDI policy. On blink?
DU Not if not at work. Wife may have helped.They are better at this than I am

'Beth' must be a she, but his wife is relegated to a mere they. A less womany woman than the true stunning and brave type.

Honorary women have it conferred on them and are held in high esteem. Pete the Plumber should probably also have honorary womanhood conferred (but could cause issues with his excellent court appearances).

@KnottyAuty The media reporting doesnt really seem to give a good feel for how devastating this IT evidence is for Fife & Upton.

The BBC article from yesterday is titled, "Trans tribunal phone notes were not checked in person." Strange... because for me the big takeway is buried half way down the article: "Asked to explain screenshots highlighting the disparity between dates Mr Borwick said the "version history" of the phone notes appeared to have been superimposed." A much better and more striking heading would be something like, "Expert claims trans tribunal phone notes were doctored."

It's not just newspapers - you can get a lot of national and international magazines for free via Pressreader courtesy of your library too. Great for language learning. ( Apologies for the derail)

I think there is an element of truth in this. In his evidence he said he wanted respect/to be respected.
In short, he wanted that uppity bitch to be put firmly back in her place.

I dont know whether to be encouraged by this other ET which was successful for a GC claimant. Not sure if it has made an impact on employers and I dont remember it being covered in the media. There is a link to the 2024 ET judgement which shows how a panel approaches the case.

Plenty parallels with Sandies case. Astonishing.

The article is by the redoubtable Dr (soon to be Professor ) Foran.😎

https://thecritic.co.uk/the-right-to-be-gender-critical/

I'm glad you knew the union I meant! Think I invented a new one there...

Which it clearly should have done if they genuinely believed these allegations against her.

Thanks for clearing up the confusion that I had between NMC and RCN. Now that Sandie has been (grudgingly) cleared, I imagine that idea is dead in the water.

I got 'witlesses' from ErrolTheDragon's post

I'd be interested to hear the BBC's response to Helen Joyce's complaint about Woman's Hour.