NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #35

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.
Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #29 can be found in the header of thread #30.

Thread 30: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375337-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-30
Thread 31: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375819-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-31
Thread 32: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5376072-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-32
Thread 33: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5376608-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-33
Thread 34: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5377387-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-34

That’s a scenario that is included in our GDPR training.
Clear desk rule.
Basic stuff that was drummed into me a long time ago when working for a financial institution (in a break from the NHS).

It reminds me of churches called 'St Thingamajig's Without' [the city limits/walls presumably]

Catching up from earlier, after being out part of the afternoon.

So, the hospital should find a little room where people who are trans can get changed alone.

Since it was established today that there were other options for where Sandie Peggie or any other women not wanting to change with men could be offered, will Naomi Cunningham be asking why Upton wasn't told of the alternatives?

(Except KS & Co really seem to have convinced themselves that he's a laydee.)

They have brushed off my complaint as well saying they acted impartially. I'm going to take it further too.

Whilst I agree - within your employer, are data breaches like that actually taken seriously?

Be honest, because at my government employer, such GDPR breaches are not.

Internally it is recognised are aware that if such a breach was referred to the Information Commissioner’s office, it likely would have zero to little impact if the complaint was upheld. The ICO rarely punishes employers, they only act on the most serious of cases.

It may be that individuals still alive are mentioned in the thesis. Not necessarily anything to do with the library.

It was available online in February - I recall on a different website and not the uni? No sign of that site anymore... So I think they have been cleaning up their digital footprint since Part 1

Definitely very integral to this issue.

@SwivelEyedAndProud
Was your patient Nordic? Some Scandi/ Icelandic surnames change depending on sex e.g. Someonesson and Someonesdottir for a brother and sister, respectively. (My theory only works if your surname ends in -son, of course).

I mean dr uptons upbringing in that environment.

I agree with observations that junior doctors, whatever their sex, parentage or perceived level of poshness, are not generally accorded higher status at the coal face than experienced nurses. With the story unfolding about how everyone seemed committed to tiptoeing on eggshells around him, I'll be interested to discover whether Dr Upton arrived having already earned a reputation for being a challenging person to have in the workplace, above and beyond the issues raised by his transgender status.

Yes. But not really? Because this issue is about a woman/women being entitled to a separate space from men to get changed in and go to the loo in. Let's not get away from that.

Although on balance of probability he probably just has a fetish and is misogynistic.

Same with Irish/Scottish Gaelic names, different prefixes for men/women.

Those emails from KS are really something. Is Upton a person of great personal charm and charisma? He certainly seems to have people (well, mostly women, it seems) falling over themselves to accommodate him in a quite extraordinary way. I think the old Scottish meaning of “glamour” sums it up - a magical attractive quality.
Such people can be very dangerous. Perhaps Sandie’s original fault in his eyes was being oblivious to this and seeing right through him.

Yep. We've had the same training. So sad to see that so many others just don't get it. And the law = the law! The law is everything. The training course your employer got you to complete won't save you if it doesn't comply with the law.

Yes, given how atrociously she expected it to go, she was taking her responsibilities seriously in making sure she told him herself!

Not sure if I'm just being very unsympathetic, but the more I hear of Upton's histrionics and tears, the more I'm reminded of men who are abusive in relationships, then pull the "devastated/tearful/emotional" card when the woman objects.

One of my many theories is that he has been using his transness to appropriate power. I don’t think he likes being down the food change as a newly qualified doctor and he certainly won’t like the tude he’ll often get from nurses with way more experience.

Given the timing of his transing it wouldn’t be out of the realm of possibilities that he’s not the most gifted Dr, unlikely to move up the ranks at a pace, so corralling a special caste all of his own, where he is King, is part of the appeal.

Shortest Judgment ever! No nitty gritty required: short and to the point. 🤣🤣

As someone else posted, and with which I agree, it is not plausible. More plausible is that the summary provided in the document needed to be destroyed and removed from all possibilities of it being used against them in the ET.

I saw this earlier on Twitter which explores that idea -

https://x.com/Nichivo_/status/1947278412218810452

Forget the laughing face, I need a 'WTAF' reaction

Haha, nice theory but no and no. My surname is very unisex!

For quite some time before 2018, psychology theses have needed written consent to include potentially identifying info, precisely because it's impossible to publish without that. But this wasn't a thesis that would significantly have involved participant testimonies.

“There were a few tears, it was a difficult conversation” is going to be a memorable moment in the netflix retelling of this story. That's a wonderful line. So much potential.