NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #32

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #29 can be found in the header of thread #30.

Thread 30: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375337-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-30
Thread 31: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375819-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-31

Totally agree with this. Best to keep amateur sleuthing off here. Taking the piss out of IBs actually really awesome name and trying to dig into her background is not cool. Over paid and over promoted yes, some share of culpability, yes, but she is not the villain of the piece.

@borntobequiet thank you.

They have not called Jamie Doyle and there is no witness statement from him as far as I understand it. Michael Foran’s Substack review of day 2 pointed out that the panel can make their own inference from that.

if he had submitted a witness statement I think NC would have used it when questioning witnesses who had had dealings with him.

She asked GM twice if she was the most senior member of NHS Fife in that sort of way that implies surprise that JB has not been called.

The inference I draw from this is that NHS Fife tried to pretend the initial ‘investigation’ led by ED hadn’t happened and since he was the one that recommended the initial special leave, was on speakerphone when LC informed SP of that SP and according to SP evidence never advised she ask SP for her version of events before that decision he might land them in worse doo doo - if that was possible.

The only reason for not calling him would be preventing him admit some sort of guilt.

Gillian Bowditch comment in the Times:

https://www.thetimes.com/article/d9e73eb9-8e35-4999-8581-0a4b588a3316?shareToken=aabfc8ffaea8d2d77647c3684fe076d9

Upton is most unlikely to be able to afford his own legal team. I very much doubt that if NHS Fife want to sever their defences, there is any policy reason why they would be able in law (or wish) to pay for his legal team, that would (presumably) be running a defence that would counter their own.

I cannot see the Judge permitting another two month adjournment for Upton to assemble and instruct his own legal team, either.

The Times article is a delight. "The contradictions in the evidence are so glaring, it’s a wonder those at the hearing haven’t resorted to wearing dark glasses." being my favourite.

I've worked with dozens of amazing women who have been assaulted and injured at work. Sometimes they've gone off for a cry, invariably in private. Then they come back and get on with the job. Because 💪.

This 'performance womaning' is so insulting and infuriating.

Mr McLeod is probably Isla’s mother’s husband (not necessarily Isla’s father).

His name is MacLeod, not McLeod. They are different names, so they are unrelated.

@TriesNotToBeCynical yes I did follow at the time (although the access cut).

It appears plausible, on a charitable interpretation, that after the changing room discussion, Dr. Upton recalled/ included two prior instances where Sandie had acted maybe oddly in A&E, that might or might not have been an unwillingness to work together and wanted them investigated.

This is to some degree dubious partly because for one there was no date despite apparently having recorded something on his mobile phone. That's why NC, Sandie's lawyer suggested it was made up, as she is right to do for her client, and requested Dr. Upton's phone records as part of this continuation. We shall see.

In addition to this, owing to the mad bureaucracy these "potential" incidents ended up being circulated with something along the lines of "Sandy will walk out if Dr. Upton is in the same room", showing how utterly awful the management was, rumour mill galore.

From this there was very little grounds for suspension from DU's testimony, combined with Sandie's long flawless service record...as eventually pointed out by HR...

Just copying relevant bits

NC. Turning to 'formal complaint' - drafted around 3rd Jan, sent to BMA as draft then. This is first mention of refusal to engage re 'missing patient'?
DU: no, contemporaneous mention in my phone notes
NC: And first mention of 'resus' patient?
DU: First explicit mention yes

NC: [page ref] this is part of ED i/x with AG. If you look at the answer to Q9. She says she had statement from Beth that if SP with a patient and BU walks in SP walks out. She says this is from you. Must be referring to 'formal complaint'?

They are 2 peas on a pod

They are not related. He's a MacLeod. She's a McLeod. They are not the same name.

Sit-com with Pete the Plumber!
There are just so many WTF moments and everyone likes seeing the underdog win.

I've just realised I'm hours and pages behind!

It’s nigh on impossible to stay caught up. I have so many things I wanted to say to individuals as the thread went on, but there’s no cohesion to the conversation when we do that! So I’m buttoning my lip mainly!

Ah, that makes sense. Thanks for the clarification. I'm jealous you got a front row seat to seeing this all unfold!

Thanks @borntobequiet and @Lins

On the contemporaneous note point, DU had just finished his shift. SP still had work to do and more important things going on. Why would she take a break in the middle of a night shift to write a note about a non-confrontational conversation. Fife have not looked at things from her POV at all.

I am re-reading Dr U's testimony from Feb, and it's an eye watering read. I had forgotten all the twists and turns.

All the discussion about missing information came up around that time. So on reflection, I think the Information Security witness from Fife must be coming to defend/reassure the panel that the searches were definitely comprehensive this time. NC will have fun with him then.

I agree - it's getting a bit much and while speculation might be entertaining and fill numerous threads, I'd prefer to read established facts that are directly relevant to SP's case.

Having spent the entire day trying to catch up....

Agreed.

I've had colleagues who have had (very credible) death threats, threats towards their families and threats of violence said directly to their faces who've had to just get on with the rest of their day at work.

And sometimes they actually did need escorted to their car at the end of their shift, for their own safety.

Upton's 'upset' is performative nonsense.

That's remarkably well put.

On a previous thread someone pointed out that the BMA was closed for Christmas on the initial days that BU said they contacted them - so either BU was mistaken on the timeline or BU had access to a special VIP contact number