Should trans people have fewer rights? ‘Not in our name’, say over 35,000 women

[BeeSouriante]

https://yorkshirebylines.co.uk/society/should-trans-people-have-fewer-rights-not-in-our-name-say-over-35000-women/

Actually 36,000 now. Heartening to see in these horrible times. It's always wonderful when you see people come out to stand in solidarity against the manufactured anti-trans panic.

"Anti trans rally"

I know operation let them speak has been coined because of the relentless foot shooting, showing themselves up, lying, and insane ramblings from transactivists.

But judging by Bee's feverish contributions, it should be operation let them shout it from the rooftops, using a megaphone turned up to 11.

@BeeSouriante You know, if you actually were a woman, you would be horrified about a group of violent men assaulting unarmed women exercising their right to peaceful protest, even if you agreed with the political position of the violent men and disagreed with the political position of the women peacefully protesting.

With every single post, you show us why you are not a woman and never will be.

With every single post, you show us why you are not a woman and never will be.

and should be absolutely nowhere near their private spaces.

So please keep out.

This ^^ 👏👏👏

Well yeah. You think the word woman also means some men and that woman saying no means they’re rightwing nazis. You’re not someone who should talk about the meaning of words really are you?

I thought that was what the Webberleys and the Greens of this world were into actually.

I don't recall KJK calling for the government to sanction mass castrations for children and young people.

Have you ever been?

I have. You are again posting falsehoods and misinformation. Unless of course, you mean the large number of male protestors who used to turn up that did nearly out number the women who just wanted to listen to other women speak. Did you mean those men?

That would be strange considering you have stated that you don't see yourself as a man, but correctly identify the sex of the protestors?

Otherwise, no. A small number of men attend. Most female people don't want to appear on videos, so are not seen on line.

And if you have attended, I consider that a declaration that you were there to intimidate and silence women as you were likely there in a protestor capacity. Which does indeed seem to be consistent to your posting here.

So, which is it?

Have you attended the events? Or have you just made up this accusation of half of the attendees being male?

oh.... so you have never been. You just assume that women who don't want to be videoed are non-existent.

Fuck. The misogyny continues to come. Post upon upon.

You are comparing an online protest, where you just have to sign your name, to actually turning up in person.

In fact, 3 years ago, there was an online GC campaign which attracted over 100,000 signatures, which resulted in a parliamentary debate on the subject.

Oh come on, Arran, 36,000 men have typed their name on a screen. Let them strip off in your changing rooms immediately!

"Should transpeople have fewer rights"

Ah, this is taking me back to some training years ago, and I've just remembered the term "unspecified referential index"

i.e. whenever you hear a comparator used like this, ask yourself

"Fewer than what?"

Fewer than an absolute monarch?

Transpeople are protected at least twice under the 2020 Equality Act by virtue of their trans status: under the protected characteristics of 'gender reassignment' and 'sex.' Also 'sexual orientation' if relevant, age etc as are all UK citizens.

As they should be protected.

What I object to is that they claim more rights, or that their rights under the PC of 'gender reassignment' trump my rights under the PC of 'sex.'

There is no hierarchy of protected characteristics.

And transwomen are not "the most vulnerable."

On average, two women/girls are murdered every three days, mostly because they're female. There are more transwomen who are murderes in the UK than there are transwomen murder victims ...

There is still a sex-pay gap of between 15 - 20%

98% of sexual crime is committed by men (including transwomen); 85 % of victims of sexual assault/crimes are women and girls.

I don't judge an argument by its popularity, but if we're going to talk numbers who support the positions of women on this board, you'll lose, Bee.

'...most Britons (55%) say they believe that allowing transgender women to use spaces reserved for women, such as women's toilets or changing rooms, “presents a genuine risk of harm to women”.'

https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/51545-where-does-the-british-public-stand-on-transgender-rights-in-202425

A petition to stand in solidarity with JK Rowling gathered 33088 signatures.

https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/in-solidarity-with-jk-rowling

And a large majority of the UK population support the Supreme Court's ruling.

'The Supreme Court confirmed that when the Equality Act refers to men and women it means biological sex. 63% of respondents thought that was the right decision, 18% thought it was wrong, and 19% did not know.'

https://sex-matters.org/posts/single-sex-services/poll-shows-public-support-for-the-supreme-court-decision/

Game, set, match!

have not RTFT or the article.

Based on the question in the thread title? Everyone should have the same rights as everyone else.

Nobody's rights should impinge on other people's rights. HTH

Let's give Bee credit where credit is due: he did say 'fewer' rights rather than 'less' rights.

Sadly, it went a bit downhill after that, but never let it be said that nobody acknowledged the things he got right... kudos, Bee.

I’ve mentioned my best friend before. He’s a man. A fifty-something, six foot odd, big built chap with long hair and a beard. Picture Sabretooth from X-Men if he’d given up the mutant life and taken up beer festivals.

He’s honestly one of the loveliest people I’ve ever known. He’s a supportive husband, stepdad and grampa. He’s always got on with women because he sees us as equals but is considerate of how there are times we are more vulnerable than him as a bloody big bloke.

I know he doesn’t have a right to be in women’s single sex spaces, more importantly he knows he doesn’t. He knows it would upset women to walk into a gym changing room and start getting changed next to a woman who is also changing. He gets why women feel uncomfortable and all the unspoken rules we’ve argued for apply to him just as they apply to the dodgy, or dangerous men. And it’s probably shit that many women wouldn’t get in a lift alone with him, or would cross the street if he was walking behind them. It probably doesn’t feel very good to know you’re perceived as a threat- even if there’s no way you are.

I remember back in the 90s when there were men arguing that women shouldn’t just mistrust them, it was offensive to not want to be alone with a strange man, that they shouldn’t think the worst- what terrible women these man hating feminists were! But now the majority of men seem to get it. Don’t intimidate women with your presence. If you can’t accept that you’re not the “nice guy” you claim you are.

It’s the same exact argument, but with a different presentation. once we were called man haters, now we’re called anti-trans or TERFs.

You don’t get a pass because you don’t see yourself as a man. If there’s women happy to share facilities with you USE THOSE MIXED FACILITIES. Don’t try tired old sexist arguments about how awful women are for needing to be away from men. Have a bit of empathy. If “cis” men (to use the language the TRAs understand) get it, why don’t you?

I also want to remind @BeeSouriante that in the learned (immensely learned) opinion of Karon Monaghan KC, an expert in employment & equality law, that had the Supreme Court decided for gender identity belief instead of scientific reality that sex means biological, transmen (FtM trans) would have been wiped of ANY rights according to their sex. So that if a transman became pregnant she ["he"] would not be entitled to maternity leave, or even leave pertaining to maternity-related medical appointments. She would have no recourse, because of course she is "really" a he, and therefore not eligible for maternity leave.

Tras didnt really care about that. For one thing that affects women, and we all know how women's rights are regarded. But also, they said that no employer would be mean enough not to offer maternity leave etc to a trans man.

If my teenage son understands that women may be distressed by him walking behind them at night, and so knows to cross the road, go another route, etc, then actual grown ass men should be quite capable of the same level of self awareness and consideration.

Just stay out of women's spaces. That's all.

“Just a bunch of women….”

🙄

But, yes, keep it up, fella. Operation Let Them Speak will continue to peak more and more people.

Let's give Bee credit where credit is due: he did say 'fewer' rights rather than 'less' rights.

I would be very surprised if that wasn’t just luck!

But also, they said that no employer would be mean enough not to offer maternity leave etc to a trans man.

But if an employer were "mean" (maybe a small business, or a school or university that's really strapped for cash) the transman would have no legal recourse had the SC ruled for the TRAs.

But who cares - it's just the icky end of women's business, not the sparkly glitter bit.