House of Commons apologises after RMW permitted to use ladies' loos

[SidewaysOtter]

https://www.thetimes.com/article/e3c3967f-8712-4591-9897-fe04588000ca?shareToken=5ffa7fb5239ea83f779908352e494c14

RMW claims he had never been challenged on his use of women's loos before - well, now he has, and the HoC has acknowledged it was wrong to allow him into those facilities.

Being pro-women is not bigotry, nobody's stopping anyone one from pissing, we're just asking for people to piss in the right facility, men in the men's and women in the women's. It really is that simples.

It's solely because they've heard women pointing out the male supremacism underlying the thinking that men's feelings, safety, wishes, dignity and privacy is important but not those of women.

Two seconds reflection would suggest that men's needs for those things can easily be met by third spaces. They have no intention of meeting those women's needs with anything more than derision, abuse and exclusion. And that would be the fundamental belief that men matter and women don't, and it's the job of women to serve men. Women don't want to be served by men with trans identities, they don't want dominance, they just want to be left alone.

So as usual it's a lot of crazy nonsense because it sounds good, and is not comprehended beyond Mummy Says It. You can feed certain online sections of this movement a word and count the days before you see it pop up. It has been done. The word 'coy' was a game played in just that way, and whoops there it was very quickly. I often repress the urge to do it with a made up word and wait to see it appear.

No one is stopping males from pissing.

It's not about rape. It's about privacy and dignity away from the male gaze.

Yours is just misogynistic anti-women bigotry.

The reaching now is getting ridiculous.

Let men abuse you or Trump! Or Something!

So which toilet would you have the rapist Isla Bryson use?

No ones stopping trans identifying men pissing, we just want them to stop pissing everywhere.

I work in the HoC and this doesn't surprise me at all.

Years ago I raised the points that their gender ID policies were going beyond the scope of the law and basically got told it wasn't going to change.

Their workplace equality networks were allowed to actively promote Stonewalls position despite the requirement that the institution of parliament and employees need to remain politically neutral.

Their inclusion and diversity training (which all staff were required to take) incorrectly listed gender as a protected characteristic and gave an example of challenging a transwoman in a toilet as discrimination.

I raised this with the union but, whilst I think the training is now correct, I'm not under the illusion it was done to ensure women's rights were protected.

So we have a culture where for the last decade the policy of self-id has ruled and the silencing of staff when this was objected to.

Senior leaders are now tying themselves in knots and are terrified of making a decision (hence referral to EHRC guidance).

It really is going to take massed deprogramming.

Seriously?? This really is the most desperate of ‘arguments’.

Exactly. The gaslighty DARVO reversals are a hallmark of this movement. These men get a kick out of it.

I increasingly think there's a capacity issue, and a belief that you just say anything in the moment that might successfully manipulate others so you get your own way. If it's worked for someone else, grab it and give it a try, and it goes with grabbing any successful organisation that might be a useful vehicle, turning it upside down and shaking it to rid it of everyone and everything of its original purpose and riding it to personal agenda until it breaks, and then finding the next one. There's never any evidence of self awareness of how this looks or how this kind of behaviour is perceived, or the impact on the bigger picture, it's just 'did it work in the moment to get me what I wanted'. Rather like playing manipulative games with toilets in the HoC.

Thank you for posting. I have come to this conclusion of various departments.

Stonewall’s campaigning led to some direct and indirect problems right from the start with toilet building regs (Document T) in the consultation. It led to some bizarre results, which at least were acknowledged to be bizarre. But what was unforgivable was the missed opportunities eg. putting design features in place for people with invisible disabilities. Instead we got discussion about non-binary crotch heights for urinals etc. and a Stonewall Award for a company who was commissioned for the government consultation.

And why, after years and standard terminology of providing a ‘unisex’ toilet, do we have added in the 2023 DfE school design brief that secondary schools have an additional private toilet that is ‘identified as’ ‘gender-neutral’?!

There is a government report from 2008 called The Provision of Public Toilets. It’s a cross party report with academic input and analysis from the BTA and other relevant organisations, including LGB input. It’s got nothing on transgender wants and gender-neutral isn’t a thing. That was only 13 years before the toilet consultation.

How is that different from men pretending to be men pretending to be women?Like this man.
Man who said he identified as female sexually assaulted woman in Birmingham New Street toilet | ITV News Central

And most of the trans crowd are women hating misogynistic men like RMW, monroe bergdorf, Jane fae, India willoubhy, Beth Upton, Stephanie Hayton….. and the list goes on… what’s your point?

It’s all they’ve got. That‘s why justice isn’t in their favour.

Snug cat has a point, something is stopping post genital surgery males from pissing, but it’s not the sign on a toilet door - it’s the effect of the surgery which means many of these men have to self catheterise or manage incontinence.

Firstly no-one is "stopping people pissing" - by and large trans people can use the loo for their biological sex, or they can find a unisex/gender neutral facility.

And secondly, keeping men - biological men, which includes transwomen - out of women's spaces DOES help to stop rape, if only just because it reduces the number of times and places where a man has access to a woman in a vulnerable situation (i.e. behind a closed door, able to push her into a cubicle etc).

But then you knew that, didn't you? Or you would have done if you'd applied a little bit of critical thinking.

If you want to see some of the trans-identifying men women need protecting from, have a look here: transcrimeuk.com

No way! Men will claim to be trans to access women's facilities?

That is brand new information.

I think it would be harder for a man to pretend to be a trans-identifying woman than it would for him to pretend to be a trans-identifying man.

For fairly obvious reasons.

What ‘cis’ women are being forced to use the male single sex spaces?

What are you referring to here. because this seems like misinformation to me. Please link us up with where this is being forced?

Those who plop down this about predatory men never quite realise just how illogical their point is. They think it is a great gotcha.

But it really isn’t the gotcha that they think it is.

Clearly you are American. We use the word toilet here in the U.K.

And if you think that women and girls use toilets only for urination you cannot be a woman. " Pissing" is also only a term that I've ever really heard men use in relation to toilets.

Facilities designated as being for women or females are exactly that.

'Cis' is a just a made up term to suggest that are different categories of woman - and that one of them includes male people...otherwise known as men.

Seriously, where the fuck are cis women being forced to use male single sex toilets?

That claim seems very concerning . And yet the poster doubled down on it!

You sound so confused your post makes no sense. It must be very difficult trying to maintain this nonsense.

Your posts betray an embarrasssing lack of understanding. They may find favour with your in- crowd in the U.S, but in the U.K we've never really fallen for this nonsense....thank goodness. I'm so pleased we live in a far more rational culture which isn't beholden to to the forces of big pharma nd marketisation quite so much as in your homeland.