Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

SC-Fuelled Bathroom Aggression

853 replies

BisiBodi · 15/05/2025 06:38

Firstly, this thread is for open discussion on a specific topic, stated at the end. It is not a thread that sits in judgement, or calls for people to sit in judgement, of the Supreme Court finding.

Now, read that first sentence again before proceeding.

So, I am posting this with the full permission of the individual concerned, whose photograph - again posted with their permission - is on the thread. The reason for that photograph will become evident soon.

Caz is a cis woman and a very, very successful music producer and DJ in London. She has recently been very vocal online about a recent incident that was almost certainly created as a result of the SC ruling and the subsequent interpretation by certain members of society. Here is her original post:

"This photo of me was taken a few days ago. This is what I look like, not that it matters, but to set the scene…
I was at the Festival Hall. Toilets on either side of two lifts - men’s on one side, women’s on the other. I was in the queue for the women’s. Men were queueing across from me.
I was facing into the bathroom, so from behind, you couldn’t see my face. I was just standing there, minding my business, when I heard someone shout,
“The men’s toilets are over here!”
I ignored it at first thinking someone was letting their mate know. But he kept shouting it "The men's toilet are this side!". Then I felt a tap on my shoulder, (meaning he came into the corridor of the women's toilets), he poked me and said
“Do you realise this is the women’s toilet?!”
Up to that point, he hadn’t seen my face. So what was he judging me on? My haircut? My hoodie?
Also, I was surrounded by women. It was pretty obvious I knew which toilet it was.
His energy was aggressive. I was shocked. I looked him straight in the face and asked: “What sex do you think I am?” Affronted he said: “I don’t know!”
Here’s where I wish I’d said, “If you don’t know, then shut the f**k up!”
But instead, I said: “Would you like to see my tits?”
I started unzipping my hoodie. He panicked: “No no no, don’t do that!”
His wife came out of the loo and saw what was going down and said with urgency, “Let’s go now!.”
She rushed him away before all the ladies around me could properly react. They were horrified by what they saw. One lovely lady said to me, "I can’t believe what I just saw!" Another one said, “I am so, so sorry you had to experience that. I held back from speaking up till it was too late because when he came and touched you, I thought he must have known you.” Another woman said, "You are welcome here!" and yet another said, "You must report him and get him kicked out!" I stood there, shocked, and unfortunately didn’t react quickly enough.
What’s interesting is that he wasn’t a staff member. He was just a random member of the public.
Also, my attire was more on the masculine side. So if he thought I was a trans woman, why would I be dressing like a man? If he thought I was a trans man, then under the new rules, I was in the right toilet!
His policing was based on my hair? My clothes? Maybe I had cancer? Or maybe I just like my hair that way. What makes him think any of that gives him the right to behave like that?!
It is fair to say also that I could have been a butch trans women but that is the whole point, you can't judge from a hair cut several meters away and its not anyone's place to.
For the record, I’m not offended by being thought to be a man. I have a strong male energy, (female too sometimes!). However I often feel if I could press a button and turn into a man I might, I don’t feel like I’ve earned the right to call myself trans, given the immense things people go through to be right in their body… but in spirit perhaps I am. Asides this I am a 100% biological born unchanged female.
What was offensive was his assumption that this kind of behaviour is OK.
This is what these new laws and rules are doing — they’re not making it safer for everyone. They’re fuelling public entitlement and policing of gender expression.
Afterwards, I tried to find them. I thought maybe it would help to have a conversation. To understand. Did he think he was protecting his wife? What made him do that?
I’ve been meaning to speak out on this issue for a while. But I’ve had a lot going on, it’s been a difficult time and I haven’t felt I had the head space.
In a strange way, I’m grateful for this moment. It gave me the push I needed to finally say something.
I genuinely believe there’s misunderstanding from a few of the much older cis community about what it means to be trans. I mean this compassionately, It is just something they do not understand and it frightens them. I wish I’d got to talk to that guy… open conversations are needed to understand what fears are fuelling their prejudice."

Again, the purpose of this thread is not to pass judgement on whether the SC ruling was right or wrong, everybody has their own opinions on that, but rather to open a dialogue on - and raise awareness of - the effect that that ruling is having on the small but disproportionately loud and aggressive members of society, and the fear being generated as a result.

Speaking personally, I am hearing many reports of bathroom aggression - perpetrated by both men and women - against anyone who doesn't 'look right', regardless of the facts or a sense of common respect for others.
Now that the ruling has passed, I think that as women the best we can do here - the absolute bare minimum if we want to consider ourselves reasonable, respectful members of society - is to be aware that this kind of horror does happen and is happening, and to call out that bullshit if we encounter it.

I'd be interested in your thoughts...

SC-Fuelled Bathroom Aggression
OP posts:
Thread gallery
7
Kucinghitam · 17/05/2025 05:05

Brigitte33 · 16/05/2025 23:10

What about when she’s in the changing room or toilets with your husbands ?
Hoping you won’t have an issue with that

Loooooolooloooooooloooool

Annoyedone · 17/05/2025 05:12

BetterWithPockets · 16/05/2025 22:40

Doesn’t feel as though I’ve been heard! Feels as though I’ve been shouted down, TBH.

Facts don’t care about your feelings

Igneococcus · 17/05/2025 07:02

Brigitte33 · 16/05/2025 23:10

What about when she’s in the changing room or toilets with your husbands ?
Hoping you won’t have an issue with that

What a depressing view of men this is.

BetterWithPockets · 17/05/2025 07:14

Annoyedone · 17/05/2025 05:12

Facts don’t care about your feelings

What a bizarre comment. Facts don’t care about anything. They’re not sentient beings.

ArabellaScott · 17/05/2025 07:34

Brigitte33 · 16/05/2025 23:10

What about when she’s in the changing room or toilets with your husbands ?
Hoping you won’t have an issue with that

Is this the latest argument?! Honestly?

'If we don't let men onto the ladies, well look out, girls, because they'll be trying to shag your husbands!'

I am not sure how effective it's going to be, tbh, but you go for it. How about a poster campaign!

I suggest a more recognisable transwoman, otherwise the point will be lost.

Eddie Izzard?

Igneococcus · 17/05/2025 07:36

ArabellaScott · 17/05/2025 07:34

Is this the latest argument?! Honestly?

'If we don't let men onto the ladies, well look out, girls, because they'll be trying to shag your husbands!'

I am not sure how effective it's going to be, tbh, but you go for it. How about a poster campaign!

I suggest a more recognisable transwoman, otherwise the point will be lost.

Eddie Izzard?

"'If we don't let men onto the ladies, well look out, girls, because they'll be trying to shag your husbands!'"

I think the suggestion is more that our husbands will be desperate to shag those ladies.

Kucinghitam · 17/05/2025 07:37

Igneococcus · 17/05/2025 07:02

What a depressing view of men this is.

I'm not even sure what "point" is being made.

The usual claim is that male-persons-of-gender are vulnerable and sad and afraid that other male people will attack them in male spaces -> therefore male-persons-of-gender deserve access to female spaces.

That particular post, however, seems to suggest that the problem is that male-persons-of-gender are so much better at womanning, that other male people will be overcome with lustful adoration and abandon their inferior female companions -> therefore male-persons-of-gender are doing female people a massive favour by eschewing male spaces?

Edit: Hah, crossed posts!

ArabellaScott · 17/05/2025 07:41

Igneococcus · 17/05/2025 07:36

"'If we don't let men onto the ladies, well look out, girls, because they'll be trying to shag your husbands!'"

I think the suggestion is more that our husbands will be desperate to shag those ladies.

Oh. I see. Right-o.

'Men overcome with uncontrollable lust when confronted with transwomen' in toilets?

I look forward to trans activists rolling this one out more widely. Very happy to amplify. 😁

Igneococcus · 17/05/2025 07:45

Kucinghitam · 17/05/2025 07:37

I'm not even sure what "point" is being made.

The usual claim is that male-persons-of-gender are vulnerable and sad and afraid that other male people will attack them in male spaces -> therefore male-persons-of-gender deserve access to female spaces.

That particular post, however, seems to suggest that the problem is that male-persons-of-gender are so much better at womanning, that other male people will be overcome with lustful adoration and abandon their inferior female companions -> therefore male-persons-of-gender are doing female people a massive favour by eschewing male spaces?

Edit: Hah, crossed posts!

Edited

That is certainly how I read Brigitte's post.
I shall tell dp and ds once they are up, their faces when I tell them will totally cheer me up.

HardyCrow · 17/05/2025 07:48

BetterWithPockets · 16/05/2025 19:42

I’m not saying it’s new! I’m JUST SAYING WE JUDGE BY APPEARANCE. And sometimes, appearance doesn’t make it easy to judge. That’s ALL I’m saying

So you’re upset about what exactly? Seems to me you’re just pissed off that women can have their spaces back.

ArabellaScott · 17/05/2025 07:55

I'm trying to think of the most well known transwomen to front the poster campaign warning women that these irresistible sirens will be tempting their husbands at the urinals.

It can't be some unknown, it has to be a recognisable face.

There is Eddie, of course. Caitlyn Jenner? Grayson Perry?

RedToothBrush · 17/05/2025 07:58

Brigitte33 · 16/05/2025 23:10

What about when she’s in the changing room or toilets with your husbands ?
Hoping you won’t have an issue with that

Are you trying to suggest that a) my husband is incapable of controlling himself b) is going to run off with a strange man having suddenly become gay

Strangely enough, I'm going to use the 'the man I know is a nice man' trope that's trotted out to get us to allow men into female spaces. Except I'm not going to use it blackmail you.

Also I'm going to take a line from you about saggy tits and change that to 'well that man really isn't his type so why would he be interested anyway'.

Please don't try and use shit arguments.

Sortumn · 17/05/2025 08:02

I asked my husband what he would do.
"Dunno <shrug> nothing. Men just stare at the wall when they're using the urinal"

So as long as any guy in a dress follows the toilet etiquette I'm sure they'll be quite unbothered.

NeverOneBiscuit · 17/05/2025 08:04

How about Lia Thomas to front the poster campaign? He’s already got the swimwear to pose in!

RedToothBrush · 17/05/2025 08:06

Helleofabore · 16/05/2025 22:22

My argument (and it’s not really an argument as such) is simply that we all, inevitably, judge whether or not someone should be in a female only space according to how they look and that that is not ever going to be 100% accurate.

Great. You believe that some rare male person will access the space undetected.

Got it. What of it?

Even if they go undetected there is still the safety of if something does go wrong if a male person is identified then more can be done to address that because their mere presence raises questions about their intent now.

Previously we weren't allowed to say that. It's clear now that it's a transgression of boundaries and a disrespect for women's privacy. Thus action can be taken in those situations.

That is a protection. That makes a difference to women.

illinivich · 17/05/2025 08:07

Funny that Brigitte33 isnt the first to suggest public toilets are a good pick up place. A man wrote recently about tim being at risk of being chatted up in male toilets, too.

Is it a thing? Im told that theres an unwritten laws about not getting eye contact at the urinals, so id love to know how it happens.

RareGoalsVerge · 17/05/2025 08:07

Brigitte33 · 16/05/2025 23:10

What about when she’s in the changing room or toilets with your husbands ?
Hoping you won’t have an issue with that

People who aren't fetishists are only in the lavatory to pee, and are only in the changing rooms to change. They respect the privacy and dignity of other users. This question demonstrates that you don't share the same understanding, but rather regard these spaces as a place for exhibitionism and titillation. Which we knew, of course.

RedToothBrush · 17/05/2025 08:09

illinivich · 17/05/2025 08:07

Funny that Brigitte33 isnt the first to suggest public toilets are a good pick up place. A man wrote recently about tim being at risk of being chatted up in male toilets, too.

Is it a thing? Im told that theres an unwritten laws about not getting eye contact at the urinals, so id love to know how it happens.

We are supposed to believe that men don't see the women's toilets as somewhere to pull by someone suggesting that men see the men's toilets as somewhere to pull.

Hmm ok. I think that might be why women don't want men in the women's

Alucard55 · 17/05/2025 08:14

ArabellaScott · 17/05/2025 07:55

I'm trying to think of the most well known transwomen to front the poster campaign warning women that these irresistible sirens will be tempting their husbands at the urinals.

It can't be some unknown, it has to be a recognisable face.

There is Eddie, of course. Caitlyn Jenner? Grayson Perry?

If go with IW.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 17/05/2025 08:15

Brigitte33 · 16/05/2025 23:10

What about when she’s in the changing room or toilets with your husbands ?
Hoping you won’t have an issue with that

Lol!

I'd be delighted to hear that a trans woman was using the same toilet as my husband.

Because it would mean that the trans woman was respecting women and using the correct toilet in accordance with the law.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 17/05/2025 08:15

ArabellaScott · 17/05/2025 07:41

Oh. I see. Right-o.

'Men overcome with uncontrollable lust when confronted with transwomen' in toilets?

I look forward to trans activists rolling this one out more widely. Very happy to amplify. 😁

So according to this thread their arguments are:

Some women may be misgendered by men so no more women only spaces
Man will be overcome with desire when they see trans identified males in their loos so no more women only spaces
Middle aged trans Identified males must be allowed in all women's changing rooms etc because women take their toddler sons in with them
and
Some men pass as women so........ (never saw the conclusion to that one 😄)

Not sure I'm convinced........

Datun · 17/05/2025 08:16

I have to admit claiming that men are actually doing us a favour by infiltrating our spaces, because otherwise our husbands will start shagging men in toilets, is an absolute cracker.

In fact, I think we should start a campaign to make sure the EHRC are fully aware.

I shall start my 'Take My Spaces', Save Our Husbands' posters this afternoon.

Alucard55 · 17/05/2025 08:20

Trans woman, trans woman, trans woman, trans woman, please don't take my man from me.

Datun · 17/05/2025 08:28

RedToothBrush · 17/05/2025 08:09

We are supposed to believe that men don't see the women's toilets as somewhere to pull by someone suggesting that men see the men's toilets as somewhere to pull.

Hmm ok. I think that might be why women don't want men in the women's

Edited

It's a bit of a giveaway.

Women need toilets not just for the obvious, but to throw up due to morning sickness, rinse out their clothing, due to menstruation, sorting out breastfeeding issues, to escape from predatory men, etc, most miscarriages happen on the toilet.

Briggitte: but what about all the sex!!

Sorry, gay sex

It would be amusing if it wasn't so tragic

AccidentallyWesAnderson · 17/05/2025 08:32

Oh my giddy aunt, have we really reached ‘well they’ll start shagging your husbands now that you’ve insisted of them using the correct space’?!?!?!?.

SUPERB 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Swipe left for the next trending thread