Amendment to Data Bill to revert all gender markers and out all trans people

[bluegoldflow]

Hoping this passes, it shouldn't be possible to change your sex (a biological impossibility) on legal documents. This would prevent men using this loop hole to erase their past identities and stop male crimes being recorded as female crimes.

I can recognise how it becomes difficult for people. One family member manipulates a whole family, who bendover backwards
to make them happy. Because thats what families do for a whole range of issues.

Its easier for the whole family to be vegetarian if their children are, for example. But what people do is the equivalent of promising their child that the whole street or world will be vegetarian too.

Its an unrealistic demand and an unrealistic promise. Now the trans person is sad because their expectations arent met and the family are angry because their child is not happy anymore, the world doesn't revolve around their family and its dawning on them that their promises were never possible.

But the world cant be run by dysfunctional family dynamics. If your family member is upset, you have to have realistic solutions that dont negatively impact everyone else and every law passed.

Yes I remember that too. It was all terribly unfortunate but the protest was just so valid and important!

Give it a rest with ‘cis women’. There is no such thing.

Mine equally always responds to any mention of women with a stern reminder that the most important thing is to 'respect' men. I'm not sure why he doesn't feel women deserve respect too, but his sexism is a depressingly common problem.

Done and sent. He cannot say that no woman in his constituency said anything.

In this instance your support for a family member amounted to reinforcing the myth that the SC ruling was some swingeing attack on ‘trans rights’. That’s what the protest was about. Maybe you could have taken this as an opportunity to talk about what it really meant. Or why women felt the need to go to the Supreme Court. Or why support doesn’t always mean blanket approval and indulgence.

“Stop judging me”

Maybe you needed to take your own advice and not have judged the women on this forum.

@TruthInTransition

No male gets to tell women how to define OUR word. Eff off.

Thank you. Have sent it too.

Perfectly put.

So much fucking waffle.

I'm done with 'be kind' and with mangling the very meaning of words to try and validate someone else.

If you were born with a penis, you're a man. A man. He/him/male/man. That's it. Wear what you want but stay out of female spaces and stop expecting people to play along with your delusion.

Do you know how many people say how angry they are with transactivists for making trans people look bad, and then blame US for it??

Do you know what that looks like? Misogyny.

We are not to blame for the actions of these men threatening us.

if they have led to you being upset, take it up with them.

We're busy protecting our spaces and children from those very same men.

Absolutely take that point. It was hastily organised and I made the decision to be on the green but not march to it. I judged that one extra person wouldn’t necessarily mean wholehearted and unconditional support. And perhaps I was wrong on that day? But I also read as much as I could before and after. And have talked to the people I know. I didn’t feel (and they know this) that it amounted to blanket approval and indulgence.

I’m just a mum. You know when you support and love your children? Remember that?

Very emotive. Surprisingly children are not always right and it's up to parents to guide them through life. Ask yourself this question. Why were you on a protest march about a legal judgement that clarified a long standing law? The judgement didn't change the law, so what were you protesting?

You appear to have left, which is a shame.

I'm sure you care very deeply for your family member. I understand.

Transactivism, as well as the well funded lobbying organisations like Stonewall and Mermaids, includes some highly dangerous and unstable people.

These activists have attacked, vilified, threatened and abused women for many years. Many women here have first hand experience of their aggressive and violent tactics.

I suggest you look into them a bit. Try Sarah Jane Baker for a start. Imprisoned for kidnap and torture and attempted murder.

The movement includes a risky mix of young and vulnerable people and ... others.

Wishing you all the best and I hope your young person comes through okay.

Indeed, it's the first rule listed in the Rules of Misogyny -

'Women are responsible for what men do'

Thank you, I’m aware and will continue to be.
I’m leaving just to get on with my day really!

Also @IleftmybaginNewportPagnell, it's one thing not seeing these displays of violence and threats on the day, maybe you were in a different street.

It's quite another not seeing all the news reporting splashed across the papers and social media over the following week.

Ministers were having to answer questions about it! Arrests were made.

If this completely passed you by, might I suggest that you are in the very definition of an echo chamber?

You didn't appear to believe the women on here either!

Information isn't getting through to you, I'm afraid. I would check what you are filtering out.

Quite.

It was a protest solely and explicitly against women's rights.

I think what we are seeing, and I have now come across more than one poster who claims to have been at that protest who declared it was so enriching and positive, is disconnect. And I have seen numerous posters use the word chalk to describe the damage to the statues as if that makes a difference.

Firstly, maybe those people were in a section of the protest that was parents protesting. I have yet to see a good account of exactly what outcome those parents were chasing in the protest. It seems like it was just a general support effort by the parents which then has inadvertently added to the initial protest.

Then, there is then the dismissal of the violent and intimidatory tactics of that male centred group. The, ‘I didn’t see it’ or the ‘that is terrible… but look at your disgusting words on this thread!’ dismissal.

I think that some people are not able to acknowledge the disconnect between their beloved family member and the behaviour of other activists. And so they demand that we dismiss the extreme activists and only think about the lovely people while also still often demanding that their loved one receives special privileges to use provisions not meant for them.

I am still in two minds about this. On one hand, I suspect some of those who come to censure and shame want their loved one to have the benefits gained by those using extremist, and violent and intimidatory tactics. So they will make a declaration of renouncement while continuing to use softer tactics to achieve the end goal.

Or else, there might be people out there who really have no idea about the violent and intimidatory tactics being used because they are truly isolating themselves off from any negative news.

I suspect what the answer is, but I am open to the second.

I would definitely try to keep your family member away from violent men like Sarah Jane Baker, @IleftmybaginNewportPagnell

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12299927/amp/Man-tortured-trans-activist-brands-dangerous-violent-individual.html

As well as taking on board @ArabellaScott ‘s excellent post, I’d suggest looking at Bayswater Support for a different perspective.

Trans-identifying people, or trans-privileges advocates, don't need to be individually harmful. The entire ideology is dangerous.

It is mentally and physically harmful to children and vulnerable adults to convince them that they can change sex.

It is dangerous at a sociatel level to encourage belief in falsehoods, both in the form of un-verifiable metaphysical concepts, but also directly falsifiable lies.

It damages trust in institutions, in data integrity, in the very language we use to communicate. It breaks freedom of speech, thought and expression.

These are all separate harms to the ones that are committed by individuals as a result of the ideology.

Plus @IleftmybaginNewportPagnell this isn't just about the different tactics, of women and TRAs, violent or otherwise. There is that, of course. And if anything proved our point, it has to be that these men are violent and are campaigning for access to unconsenting women.

But the issue is, we don't have to prove our point. Our point is, and always has been completely legal.

Men do not have the right to access women only spaces, and they never have. If you find that upsetting then you are supporting the loss of women's rights.

Because, they are pie. Men are either in, or they're out.

A lesbian is either a woman, or both sexes. Women's sport is either for women, or both sexes. And the same goes for changing rooms where women are taking their clothes off, and toilets, where they are specifically quite vulnerable.

Please, try and understand, women are not therapy for men. We are not here to fulfil their requirements. We're not their shield, we're not their comfort blanket, and we're not their mum.

it's completely unacceptable misogynistic, and bloody regressive to expect all women and girls to compromise their safety for the sake of a handful of demanding men.

"I think that some people are not able to acknowledge the disconnect between their beloved family member and the behaviour of other activists."

I did that myself. I'm a peaceful trans person, and I know other peaceful trans people, so it was easier to dismiss the not so peaceful ones, than to consider that maybe there were activists being truly horrible in my name.

So I'm not surprised that close ones of trans people, who usually don't even get to witness that terrible behaviour in person, would not be able to properly engage with it on the rare occasion they do see it.

Yes, I can understand the human nature behind that.

But the bit I wish people would grasp is that it doesn't really matter whose name they're doing it in, those are the people who want access.

The Sarah Jane Bakers of this world may not be speaking on behalf of decent trans people, but it's the Sarah Jane Bakers who want the access.

And galling tho that might be for people who don't want access, and don't want him speaking on their behalf, it's irrelevant to those women who are protecting their spaces.

I appreciate your contributions to these threads. My stance is that the very concept of transgenderism is sexist, but I also know that we live in a sexist world.