Disability Rights: 50% of trans people are disabled

[Pluvia]

The full statement is here:
https://www.disabilityrightsuk.org/news/disability-rights-uk-opposes-uk-supreme-court-ruling-‘biological-sex’?srsltid=AfmBOooL_DLt2ICsIzkNI8RfYmVptrvAcV4Z6sTZCnqR3o97kzFnwEFH

The opening paragraph is this:
Disability Rights UK is deeply saddened by the UK Supreme Court’s ruling that declares trans women are not 'biological women'. As part of a movement that has always called for ‘nothing about us without us’ – we’re particularly concerned by the court’s exclusion of Trans voices in their decision, and their failure to be led by the lived experience of one of society’s most silenced groups. Decisions about any group’s rights should never be made without the involvement of those most impacted.

Later it says:
Around half of Trans people are also Disabled. Government policies already place disproportionate barriers on accessing vital healthcare, and now this ruling also erodes their protections against discrimination.

Can it really be true that half the T population is disabled? All those strapping young men and women who've turned out to hiss and spit and threaten over the years would suggest otherwise. So would the huge, angry TW who has cut a decimating swathe through every woman-only service in my area, or the men in pink at last week's trans rights march moaning about the loos at Waterloo.

Is this lining up disabled loos for TWs?

Sadly I’ve not had your luck with the lack of wait! I can only use wheelchair accessible facilities. On 3 occasions this year a queue to use has resulted in my clothes being soiled (two concerts, one National Trust property), I’ve come close to doing so on many more!

100% of trans people have a serious mental illness (gender dysphoria and/or delusional beliefs and/or narcissism). There is no reason for a mentally healthy person to identify as trans.

Or it could be the well documented damage done to bone health caused by puberty blockers and wrong sex hormones

Well thats good to know that Keeptoiletssafe description was spot on

a pull cord

Now lets do how that works when the child is passed out on the floor?

My mind still boggles that trans women can actually think they are biological women. To believe something so patently absurd must mean serious mental illness. Woman in your imagination fine but actual biological woman....no.

There is a trans man on YouTube who is quite open that the reason people feel the need to transition has nothing to do with them being born in the wrong body and also admits that years of hormones have caused her kidney damage.

@WhitWhoop Yes I know. I don’t use disabled toilets because I leave them for those who need them. I did use them when caring for a relative who was in a wheelchair. They are often left in a horrible state.

I know all about their design. I know that because they are private like all mixed sex designs there are a lot of things that happen in them that shouldn’t. I also have statistics on sexual assaults that happen in public toilets, including some of the worst cases in disabled toilets.

I also know that there are people who don’t, for whatever reason, pull the cord. I know that sometimes the cord is bunched up high from reach. I know that because people don’t realise someone has collapsed then they are not rescued in time. There was a lady who was left for 3 days in one. I have heard of one case where someone misused the cord.

I have lots of statistics on why I believe people are safer in single sex toilets with door gaps, particularly with an emphasis on children and those with invisible disabilities such as diabetes, epilepsy, heart conditions and asthma. If you have experience you will know people who are having a medical emergency don’t have the ability or awareness to pull a chord.

If you collapse, you are more likely to survive, or avoid suffering long-term damage, if someone notices and rescues you.

I want every toilet to be safe. Mixed sex, private cubicles in public spaces are the least safe design. As such, disabled people who need the space and aids (shelf, hand rails) already get dealt a bad deal with their toilets. But those toilets should be left for people with disabilities who need them.

So, that’s why single sex toilets, that are the only designs with door gaps, are the safest designs for everyone but particularly those with invisible disabilities.

That’s why single sex toilets are best.

i was just thinking the same. Very disappointing to read from Disability Rights UK who are well respected generally. They are wading in on the debate with ideological statements on a very flimsy justification.

I don’t think you CAN be trans and fully mentally healthy, in the same way that I don’t think you can be anorexic and fully mentally healthy, so this stat doesn’t surprise me. I assume this organisation has been infiltrated by several trans people who identify as disabled and who are determined to grab every megaphone they can find. It will harm disabled people’s voices longer term but I don’t think these activists genuinely care about anything except their own particular axe to grind.

Whatever the reason, diluting disabled people’s access to their own safe, clean, fit for purpose toilets is not even remotely the answer to the trans toilet issue. Disabled people are already so often at the bottom of the pile when rights are being considered.

Yes, exactly. This perfectly illustrates the antisocial narcissism at the heart of transgenderism: “I’ll take what I want. To hell with anyone who actually needs it.”

This is a good, clear explanation of why single-sex toilets are essential. Sadly, angry men get more attention than people with genuine disabilities.

I agree that trans-identifying people who harm themselves with drugs or
surgery are likely to have mental-health problems. But I’d like to know what percentage of trans people have the kind of disability, not self-diagnosed, that requires a special toilet space.

Well said and argued.

The disabled toilet at my David Lloyd gym, which has recently been refurbished, DOES have a gap at the bottom. This is new.

This is brilliant!!! Someone thinking of safety!
More of this!

Let's accept that 50% of trans people are disabled, for the sake of argument.

Do they all have disabilities of the kind that require adapted toilets? There are many disabilities which seriously impact people's lives, but that doesn't mean that they can't use ordinary toilets - many mental health conditions, or being deaf for instance, are serious disabilities, but do not in and of themselves normally require the use of an adapted toilet.

The point has also been made that in the case of some disabilities which do not physically require using an adapted toilet, the non-adapted toilets are safer because not enclosed.

[Note to able-bodied people who use the disabled toilet - that red cord is not there for you to practise your nautical knots on while you sit on the toilet, so please don't leave it so elaborately knotted that it is out of reach of a disabled person who has collapsed on the floor😡]

So even if 50% of trans people are disabled, I hope they will be thoughtful and only use the adapted toilets if they can't use the ordinary toilet because of their disability, not because of their trans-ness.

As long as disabled people have been involved in the decision.
Rather than a decision taken by abled people because it fits their own agendas.

Yes agree. From when I have discussed toilet cubicles with designers, it’s always been men. There needs to be more women in design too. Even the basics of not having the cubicle built with the toilet centred then trying to shove a sanitary bin into one side.

I'm sorry to hear that. Our household is neurodiverse and most of the trans stuff wasn't that visible on my social media via the autistic groups I follow, but it has ramped up a lot lately. I have unfollowed people. You aren't on your own and there are most definitely autists who are opposed to gender identity so I hope you can find your tribe soon xx

There was a Scottish Trans survey from last year which said that 67% of respondents were disabled. It wasn't split out into any useful figures so there wasn't any indication of the proportion of mental health/neurodiversity issues versus mobility problems. I expect that a high number of these people claim PIP.

I saw a video of someone on the post SC-ruling rallies who gave a rousing 15 minute speech into a megaphone with great vigour with no sign that they should be entitled to the PIP they claim. [ETA they were making horrible hateful comments and inciting violence against women] It seemed like they were taking benefits to fund a campaigning lifestyle - I thought that was wrong and that they could channel their energy into just getting a job like everyone else. I don't understand why someone isn't investigating these cheats?

The law hasn’t changed. People just lied and got it wrong for years.

I saw a video of someone on the post SC-ruling rallies who gave a rousing 15 minute speech into a megaphone with great vigour with no sign that they should be entitled to the PIP they claim.

Were they wearing a badge saying "PIP claimant"? And as it happens, I can do a lot more than 15 minutes rabble rousing into a megaphone. Provided I can don't have to stand for more than 3 minutes. Do you know what they claim PIP for? Do you know what their claim was based on? Have you read their claim?

I am bloody fed up of saying this. There are many different types of disabilities. Very few of them make people stupid, incompetant or incapable. It makes them different. And it neither makes them trans nor anti-trans. If you want to agree, disagree, or don't have any opinion at all on the trans issue, have at it. But stop hunting down "disabled frauds". You don't have a clue about disability, and even less about PIP. I do not understand what makes someone of one sex think they are another. I am not going to get dragged into something that I do not understand. That doesn't mean that I don't have opinions about the amount of hate the debate generates - on both sides. But being trans does not make someone disabled. Nor does being disabled make someone trans. And the vast majority of us people with disabilities have quite enough to contend with without you dragging us into your respective witchhunts.

oh no, politicans recommend using loos for the disabled as cop-out:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/04/28/badenoch-trans-people-can-use-disabled-toilets/

If that becomes an established interim solution (I can understand the thinking, as it is an "available" extra space), there is less pressure on establishments to add more gender-neutral spaces or on men to welcome TW to theirs. Or, novel idea, people go into the loo according to their biological sex.

I agree that being disabled 'neither makes them trans nor anti-trans', and that, as I said in a previous post, there are different kinds of disabilities, visible and invisible, and not all of them need adapted toilets.

I'm sure you will agree, PhilippaGeorgiou, that it is shocking to see the speed with which adapted/accessible toilets, which disabled people fought so hard for, and for so long, being handed over on a silver platter to able-bodied trans people as compromise 'third spaces', just because they choose not to use the non-adapted toilets appropriate to their sex.

Hence the suspicion that TRAs - a group not renowned for respect for others' boundaries - may find ways to justify encroaching on disabled people's spaces, just as they have on women's spaces. I'd love to think that able-bodied trans activists are above claiming to be disabled in order to use the adapted toilets, but their track record suggests that they will do anything, and trample over anybody's rights, to get their own way.

Women should be able to trust men not to use the women's toilets, and disabled people should be able to trust able-bodied people not to use the accessible toilets, but that kind of trust has been eroded.

@MarieDeGournay even better is to avoid ASSUMING that if person is xyz then they also do abc.

Because if you translate your posts about trans people wrongly claiming benefits etc…. and make it about disabled people, you have ‘oh person is able to xyz therefore they aren’t disabled/dont need to disabled loo’ etc….

The reality is that, the way the issue of trans and toilets have been dealt with has created some of the issues we have now.
Because let’s be honest, transmen in women toilet? It still means women will have no idea who is going in and women will be excluding other women (the more ‘masculine’ ones, like some lesbians) because of it.
And the solution will be a third space = disabled loos. Because there is no way governments are going to create another space for trans people. Not enough of them to put it simply.

Imo that’s what happens when people create rules and solutions wo ever consulting the people involved. It would have been very easy to involve the ‘old tranny’, those who have been going through proper gender dysphorie clinic, got gender réassignèrent surgery 30 years ago, lesbian and gay groups etc…. before deciding what was or wasn’t possible as well as exploring the potential pitfalls.
Instead both sides have fallen into extreme positions, pushed each other in a corner and the ones who will suffer? Still the same ones. Disabled and (lesbian) women.

With respect - and as I said, I am not getting dragged into the trans politics of this site, which I find almost as depressing as the ableism - I have so far not noticed any TRA saying they want to encroach on disabled people's spaces (unless of course, they have a disability, in which case it is not an encroachment, it is their right). All the people suggesting that trans people should encroach on our spaces (and a lot of them are on this thread) are able bodied. As are the parents who get to use our spaces as baby changing spaces simply because nobody could be arsed to install the facilities anywhere else. I should be able to trust ALL able bodied people not to use accessible toilets - to date I have been sorely disappointed in that expectation, as I am sorely disappointed that so many able-bodied people on this site have been happy to throw us under the bus again. And I quote from one:

There’s nothing wrong with TW using disabled loos. I use them personally. Hundreds of thousands of parents up and down the country use them as they are often the location of the baby change (even if according to Part M they shouldn’t be!)
Our main objective should be keeping them out of women’s.
The rest is not our problem (ie. Whether they use accessible or men’s) and considering the conversation we just had and you now immediately start this thread against TW using disabled loos; it is seriously making me question your motives and whether you are who you say you are.

I apologise for the DM link in advance, but it was the the easiest access - here is that famous disability rights activist announcing that our spaces are now trans spaces....https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14655233/Kemi-Badenoch-trans-staff-use-disabled-toilets.html. I was not aware that the leader of the Conservative party was either disabled (and entitled to speak on our behalf) or had the right to give away our spaces, so I guess she must be another of those TRA's???