Disability Rights: 50% of trans people are disabled

[Pluvia]

The full statement is here:
https://www.disabilityrightsuk.org/news/disability-rights-uk-opposes-uk-supreme-court-ruling-‘biological-sex’?srsltid=AfmBOooL_DLt2ICsIzkNI8RfYmVptrvAcV4Z6sTZCnqR3o97kzFnwEFH

The opening paragraph is this:
Disability Rights UK is deeply saddened by the UK Supreme Court’s ruling that declares trans women are not 'biological women'. As part of a movement that has always called for ‘nothing about us without us’ – we’re particularly concerned by the court’s exclusion of Trans voices in their decision, and their failure to be led by the lived experience of one of society’s most silenced groups. Decisions about any group’s rights should never be made without the involvement of those most impacted.

Later it says:
Around half of Trans people are also Disabled. Government policies already place disproportionate barriers on accessing vital healthcare, and now this ruling also erodes their protections against discrimination.

Can it really be true that half the T population is disabled? All those strapping young men and women who've turned out to hiss and spit and threaten over the years would suggest otherwise. So would the huge, angry TW who has cut a decimating swathe through every woman-only service in my area, or the men in pink at last week's trans rights march moaning about the loos at Waterloo.

Is this lining up disabled loos for TWs?

Aren’t they already thus though? I queue up outside the disabled toilet at work and wait for whichever able bodied colleague needed to poo in privacy to come out.
I don’t have a choice about which toilet I use. 😡

This is true. However in my experience able bodily people tend not to queue up at the disabled toilet, instead there are a lot of people who will use it if they can see it’s free.

Make them gender-neutral and there will be a queue of people who think they have as much right to that toilet as a disabled person.

I work with autistic young people, most of them are trans. Make of that what you will! Seems most of these trans have a mental illness. We definitely shouldn't be listening to them regarding "rights".

There is one trans activist (a fat bloke with a beard and wears a pink hoodie or pink headphones and calls himself a trans woman) who makes a career out of doing TV appearances.

Before he discovered he was trans he was a disability campaigner and forever in the local press about how he had been discriminated as a disabled person.

Since his trans discovery he now goes on about how discriminated he is as a trans woman. Oh and likes to use the "insersectional" word a lot.

Now I'm a bit sceptical over all of this, but it does follow a pattern of other 20-somethings who've never had a job, seem to live on benefits due to a self-diagnosed mental health condition, self identify as trans and offer to sell their furry drawings to media organisations who want to represent the marginalised.

There are genuine disabled people worried about PIP changes, and it's these people who have caused the problems.

Yeah, your main object is keeping them out of women's loos, while you yourself abuse the privilege of disabled - oh terribly sorry accessable - loos. Missing the point if course, that unless an individual has a disability then you shouldn't be using them.

The irony of this 🙄

we’re particularly concerned by the court’s exclusion of Trans voices in their decision, and their failure to be led by the lived experience of one of society’s most silenced groups.

Two shocking lies in one sentence. Trans voices were represented from the start by the full weight of government, and before the start by activists who demanded that women must not speak. Trans voices are represented in the decision by the reaffirmation of rights under the gender recognition act.
Trans activists are absolutely not one of society’s most silenced groups. They have managed to get unreality passed into law (in Ireland without it even being discussed in the Dáil), they have infiltrated and weaponised all sorts of organizations and governments bodies.
Appalling.

I wonder how much the tax payer is paying for these disabled transwomen (men with mental health issues). I accept that’s likely to be a contentious question but there’s a truth at its root.

Fantastic effort at ableist benefits bashing whilst on a trans thread. It's not "contentious" - it's offensive. Many, many people with disabilities neither identify as trans, nor does the taxpayer support them - many of them ARE taxpayers.

Immediately after the SC verdict, I saw a post on Xitter of trans rights activists protesting. Someone had commented on the number of trans men using wheelchairs or walking sticks, and I haven't been able to unsee it since.

Anecdotally my sibling transitioned about 15 years ago and began using cross sex hormones. They can no longer walk unaided.

That is brand new information.

Not that surprising for all the reasons stated by PPs (autism, etc).

BUT , doesn't this lend weight to the argument that transness is Indeed a mental health issue?

You know, just as it was before the publishing franchise otherwise known as DSM unilaterally 'changed' that?

@Unitarily There’s nothing wrong with TW using disabled loos. I use them personally. Hundreds of thousands of parents up and down the country use them as they are often the location of the baby change (even if according to Part M they shouldn’t be!)
Our main objective should be keeping them out of women’s.

Yes there is. It is bad enough that people who need the facilities of disabled toilets can't get in the one or two "generously" provided (because they have to be) because of the hundreds of thousands of parents using them for baby change (which could go pretty much anywhere), but now you want them to also be the trans toilets (there are transmen as well as transwomen, but perhaps they also don't count). As per usual, the rights to equality for people with disabilities are bottom of the pile. God forbid that people who need the toilets that are provided for people with disabilities because they have a disability should expect to use them when the entire of the rest of the population thinkl they have more rights to them than they do.

I can fully believe that around 50% of trans-identifying people are also disabled and/or identify as disabled. Neurodiversity is covered under disability and some (though not all) ND people identify as disabled.

However, more importantly, I am sure that 50% of disabled people are not trans. That is the more relevant % that this charity ought to be focusing on.

Cross sex hormones will do that to you. There’s always loads of people with walking sticks at trans rights marches.

Disability Rights UK really needs to develop a better understanding of equality legislation.

The Supreme Court is not a focus group!

How do they not know this?

I have a (usually invisible) disability which affects me occasionally. It means that I sometimes have an extremely urgent need for a toilet. On those occasions, if no Gents toilet is available, I will use a disabled one. I have never had to wait for another person. If disabled people having to wait is a widespread problem, the solution would be to either increase the number of disabled toilets, or to increase toilet provision open to everyone (in addition to disabled and single sex toilets).

There's another thread which poses the question 'if Stonewall goes down the tubes, which cause will trans latch itself onto next?'. I reckon we might have an answer here.

It would actually be interesting to see what it does to the movement, if is this is where the focus goes. It's certainly not going to satisfy the fetishist and gender-theoretician quadrants among them.

Many (most?) trans people have serious mental illnesses. I’ve read some research that found an extremely high incidence of cluster b personality disorders (antisocial personality disorder, borderline personality disorder, histrionic personality disorder, and narcissistic personality disorder) among trans people. If they’re including those diagnoses, I would actually expect the disabled percentage to be much higher than half.

I work with children and without fail every single child that says they are trans/non binary/gender fluid is diagnosed ASD or on a pathway for assessment. So that would be 100% of that cohort with a disability

The irony of the 'concern' that disabled people, within this cohort, being discriminated against or receiving barriers to health care is that the health care they need is to be treated for the MH condition that they have that causes them such a disconnect with their own bodies and identity.

Instead, as another poster points out, the DSM changed this to make trans an actual thing rather than a MH condition in the same way anorexia is. We dont shout about the rights for people to starve themselves and identify as fat do we? We recognise that they need treatment for this.

Sorry I don't know but I could not get past this line:
"Disability Rights UK is deeply saddened by the UK Supreme Court’s ruling that declares trans women are not 'biological women'."
The very definition of a trans women is they are someone who was born male - its common sense they are not biological women?

Munchausen’s most likely. Maximum attention seeking.

Huge connection between eds and autism and a massive portion of trans are on the spectrum somewhere.

It is strongly linked with being GC in this family. Please don't generalise

It's lucky that you have never had to wait. But as you say - it's occasionally. For me and many others like me it is always, and I frequently find them taken up with the parent with four children all in there, the baby changing (which heh, just to be helpful, is often place in a position where we can't move around it easily), and not infrequently by the person holding a phone conversation (loudly) with their mum/granny/best friend. And those are the "savoury" users. Don't get me started on the others who use them for private space. I don't have any choices. other people do.

I agree that it's lucky that I have never had to wait. I should add that there has never been anyone waiting for me to come out. I would prefer to always have a toilet available that doesn't have the equipment and space that I don't need, but someone else does.

My preferred solution to all the current debate about toilets is for "third space" (actually fourth space) provision to be made in addition to single sex and disabled toilets. And I completely agree with @Keeptoiletssafe about the safety aspects of public toilet provision.