Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Is anyone worried about pressure now to change the Equality legislation?

271 replies

Unbeleevable · 26/04/2025 01:27

There's a lot of wisdom in this forum - I wondered in the happy afterglow of the very clear-cut SC and EHCR pronouncements on biological sex … is there a risk that behind this, someone is pulling strings to publish strong statements hoping this will to trigger a surge of pro-trans-rights sentiment leading to a widespread acceptance the EA must change to encompass rights based on declared gender identity? And eventually a political mandate for the same?

In other words - we can’t expect the TRAs will give up. Have we won the battle but not the war?

I have long felt I have landed on the wrong side of history in my GC convictions - I can’t shake the feeling that the recent developments are too good to be true.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
12
SinnerBoy · 30/04/2025 03:20

I know! It's classic trans strawman catastrophising.

FrippEnos · 30/04/2025 05:37

@ButterflyHatched

That is some serious hyperbole.

I particularly liked

You won your battle against an ally who has been fighting your corner for decades, but it's likely to cost all of us the war

I mean WTAF. Your side has been telling women that they don't exist, has been writing them out of existence (literally), tried to make anyone that isn't "trans" a subclass of their own sex, and have cheated women out of their well earned medals and money.

What would it look like if you weren't "fighting our corner" (paraphrased)

Helleofabore · 30/04/2025 07:20

ButterflyHatched · 30/04/2025 02:21

What should be done with people who have been repeatedly demonstrated for the best part of a century's worth of research to only benefit from receiving actual specific medical treatment with a long and comprehensive track record of efficacy dating back fourty years in some cases and a hundred years in others, now that you have almost completely removed their access to said treatment?

Brainwashing and torture doesn't work, demonstrably.
Bullying them back into the closet doesn't deal with the problem - it just hides it. Badly. These people still exist. The trauma you cause to them won't go away. It just stops them being productive members of society.

No amount of 'no, you are the real bigot' DARVO will change the reality of what you are gloating about here. Reasonable people see you in a clearer light when you say stuff like this openly, and it's about bloody time that light was shined on this toxicity.

If you ban cancer treatments for cancer patients, then they still have the same healthcare as people who don't have cancer. They just don't have the healthcare they specifically need.

You were just about able to weasel it when most people hadn't just spent a week watching their transgender friends and loved ones shrink into themselves, retreat from social existence and revert back to the learned trauma responses they haven't seen with such ferocious intensity for years, but the very real impact of what your ideology has created in practice is hard to deny now.

GC ideology was always going to run into trouble once it pushed past the 'reasonable concerns' trojan horses and started showing its true face. Well, the mask has been slipping for a while now and people are noticing that you are still pushing toward an eliminationist agenda despite constant assertions that this was never about toilet bans and removing healthcare for adults.

The whistleblowers are amassing, the cooked books don't line up, the pet bigots parachuted in to grease the wheels of social murder as one last hurrah before retirement are a recurring pattern so predictable that denying it requires ever more desperate contortions. You've just detonated the integrity of the law by imposing a ban so ridiculous and so brazenly in breach of the UK's obligations to the ECHR that legal professionals who wouldn't have touched any of this with a barge pole are now scrambling to salvage what they can of the situation. The Prime Minister has weathervaned to court your hate votes with such shallow desperation that nobody on any side of the lines is buying it.

The price of fixing the nightmare you have created is likely to mean an effective withdrawl of single sex services in most cases and an open door to the far right when this goes to courts and consultations in the years to come.

You won your battle against an ally who has been fighting your corner for decades, but it's likely to cost all of us the war.

It's like the 2nd class passengers on the titanic triumphantly declaring that steerage don't get to load into lifeboats before they do.

More hyperbole. And the old appeal to authority and ‘it’s been happening for decades’.

What medical treatment can be deemed successful if it means that the patient is living a life which doesn’t reflect material reality?

The material reality is that the patient is male. But the patient demands to be living as if they are female. No extreme body modification can make this true. I believe you have told us you were extensively counselled to understand this.

Yet here you are trying to manipulate people into treating you as if you are something you are not. And you are still blaming the wrong people.

The blame lays with the people who choose to have the treatment, after being counselled extensively that they cannot change material reality who still believe society have to treat them as materially changes. I suspect part of the blame lays with their clinicians who obviously didn’t tell those people clearly enough that they can make all these changes to their bodies but who also weren’t honest in saying that female people deserved to have provisions that don’t include any male people.

The blame doesn’t belong with the female people who were misused in the life of those people. Misused as either part of ongoing medical treatment to make male people feel better or to be abused for not following the script needed to allow that male people to live a life that was not premised on material reality. The blame doesn’t belong with the female people who collectively say no to their lives being fundamentally changed by some patients and their clinicians.

“Reasonable people see you in a clearer light when you say stuff like this openly, and it's about bloody time that light was shined on this toxicity.”

When you surround yourself with only people who love and support your personal decisions, of course you are going to write stuff like this. This. This is the DARVO you talk about.

This is a typical male human reaction to being excluded from female single sex spaces. Their first reaction is ‘but not me’ and to play through all the emotionally manipulative ways to retain the access they should not have had. When there are already many third spaces available, but being refused because what is demanded is compliance in a belief set not material reality.

So, either a group of patients from decades ago has a claim against their clinicians because they were not counselled extensively that they weren’t changing sex or those patients were extensively counselled that they couldn’t change the sex of their body?

“You won your battle against an ally who has been fighting your corner for decades, but it's likely to cost all of us the war.”

This is sublime DARVO! Are you trying to sell yourselves, as a groups, here as an ally? Fuck, that is grim reading.

How can a group who show such inherent disrespect for female people be a true ally of those female people?

But I notice that at the same time you are telling us you all were our allies all along, you are vilifying us using guilt by association with murderers and bigots. I think you might need to revisit this fantasy war scenario as it seems far more soap opera like. It is like something that Trump would say to be fair.

Helleofabore · 30/04/2025 07:24

“The whistleblowers are amassing, the cooked books don't line up, the pet bigots parachuted in to grease the wheels of social murder as one last hurrah before retirement are a recurring pattern so predictable that denying it requires ever more desperate contortions. You've just detonated the integrity of the law by imposing a ban so ridiculous and so brazenly in breach of the UK's obligations to the ECHR that legal professionals who wouldn't have touched any of this with a barge pole are now scrambling to salvage what they can of the situation. The Prime Minister has weathervaned to court your hate votes with such shallow desperation that nobody on any side of the lines is buying it.”

This is a thing of beauty.

You know the law has not changed from what was written 15 years ago?

Helleofabore · 30/04/2025 07:31

Helleofabore · 30/04/2025 07:24

“The whistleblowers are amassing, the cooked books don't line up, the pet bigots parachuted in to grease the wheels of social murder as one last hurrah before retirement are a recurring pattern so predictable that denying it requires ever more desperate contortions. You've just detonated the integrity of the law by imposing a ban so ridiculous and so brazenly in breach of the UK's obligations to the ECHR that legal professionals who wouldn't have touched any of this with a barge pole are now scrambling to salvage what they can of the situation. The Prime Minister has weathervaned to court your hate votes with such shallow desperation that nobody on any side of the lines is buying it.”

This is a thing of beauty.

You know the law has not changed from what was written 15 years ago?

But then, if a person cannot recognise boundaries that require consent, why do we expect them to recognise any boundaries within society?

TheOtherRaven · 30/04/2025 07:35

And if a person's entire belief system is rooted in something that isn't actually true, there's limited point in expecting them to process and deal with other inconvenient bits of reality.

You can't argue rationally when most of the argument is about something only happening inside the other person's head.

Datun · 30/04/2025 07:41

ButterflyHatched · 30/04/2025 02:21

What should be done with people who have been repeatedly demonstrated for the best part of a century's worth of research to only benefit from receiving actual specific medical treatment with a long and comprehensive track record of efficacy dating back fourty years in some cases and a hundred years in others, now that you have almost completely removed their access to said treatment?

Brainwashing and torture doesn't work, demonstrably.
Bullying them back into the closet doesn't deal with the problem - it just hides it. Badly. These people still exist. The trauma you cause to them won't go away. It just stops them being productive members of society.

No amount of 'no, you are the real bigot' DARVO will change the reality of what you are gloating about here. Reasonable people see you in a clearer light when you say stuff like this openly, and it's about bloody time that light was shined on this toxicity.

If you ban cancer treatments for cancer patients, then they still have the same healthcare as people who don't have cancer. They just don't have the healthcare they specifically need.

You were just about able to weasel it when most people hadn't just spent a week watching their transgender friends and loved ones shrink into themselves, retreat from social existence and revert back to the learned trauma responses they haven't seen with such ferocious intensity for years, but the very real impact of what your ideology has created in practice is hard to deny now.

GC ideology was always going to run into trouble once it pushed past the 'reasonable concerns' trojan horses and started showing its true face. Well, the mask has been slipping for a while now and people are noticing that you are still pushing toward an eliminationist agenda despite constant assertions that this was never about toilet bans and removing healthcare for adults.

The whistleblowers are amassing, the cooked books don't line up, the pet bigots parachuted in to grease the wheels of social murder as one last hurrah before retirement are a recurring pattern so predictable that denying it requires ever more desperate contortions. You've just detonated the integrity of the law by imposing a ban so ridiculous and so brazenly in breach of the UK's obligations to the ECHR that legal professionals who wouldn't have touched any of this with a barge pole are now scrambling to salvage what they can of the situation. The Prime Minister has weathervaned to court your hate votes with such shallow desperation that nobody on any side of the lines is buying it.

The price of fixing the nightmare you have created is likely to mean an effective withdrawl of single sex services in most cases and an open door to the far right when this goes to courts and consultations in the years to come.

You won your battle against an ally who has been fighting your corner for decades, but it's likely to cost all of us the war.

It's like the 2nd class passengers on the titanic triumphantly declaring that steerage don't get to load into lifeboats before they do.

Good lord. Just use the unisex toilet.

Datun · 30/04/2025 07:49

... plus the odd full stop wouldn't go amiss.

GreenFriedTomato · 30/04/2025 08:12

I'm so bored of reading this hysterical hyperbolic nonsense. Most people don't give a damn if your're trans so long as you stay out of women's spaces. Wear what you like, call yourself what you like. Join me in the queue for the one toilet in Costa. Just don't force me to change my beliefs and I couldn't care less
I rarely swear but all these claims of genocide, exclusion from public life and literal murder are really Fucking offensive.
You often claim that being trans/gender disphoria isn't an illness, yet demand 'life saving treatments'? Hormones? Boob jobs? Bottom surgery? No one died from lack of these, unless you're refer to the mythical suicide rate as a result of not having the body you want. Comparing it to cancer treatment is simply gross when people do actually die of Cancer with or without treatment.
Imagine that I'm very unhappy with my body and it's causing me extreme distress. Can I get breast implants and a tummy tuck on the NHS? Can I fuck.
So if you guys don't have any illness, why should the NHS pay for very expensive body modifications just so you can be your true (in)authentic selves?
I'm so sick of the whingng and whining from men who aren't getting what they want.

teawamutu · 30/04/2025 08:43

FrippEnos · 30/04/2025 05:37

@ButterflyHatched

That is some serious hyperbole.

I particularly liked

You won your battle against an ally who has been fighting your corner for decades, but it's likely to cost all of us the war

I mean WTAF. Your side has been telling women that they don't exist, has been writing them out of existence (literally), tried to make anyone that isn't "trans" a subclass of their own sex, and have cheated women out of their well earned medals and money.

What would it look like if you weren't "fighting our corner" (paraphrased)

I think Butters meant 'fighting for our corner'.

Which, yeah, was kind of our point, too.

SternJoyousBee · 30/04/2025 08:57

TheOtherRaven · 30/04/2025 07:35

And if a person's entire belief system is rooted in something that isn't actually true, there's limited point in expecting them to process and deal with other inconvenient bits of reality.

You can't argue rationally when most of the argument is about something only happening inside the other person's head.

💯

FlakyCritic · 30/04/2025 09:06

ButterflyHatched · 30/04/2025 02:21

What should be done with people who have been repeatedly demonstrated for the best part of a century's worth of research to only benefit from receiving actual specific medical treatment with a long and comprehensive track record of efficacy dating back fourty years in some cases and a hundred years in others, now that you have almost completely removed their access to said treatment?

Brainwashing and torture doesn't work, demonstrably.
Bullying them back into the closet doesn't deal with the problem - it just hides it. Badly. These people still exist. The trauma you cause to them won't go away. It just stops them being productive members of society.

No amount of 'no, you are the real bigot' DARVO will change the reality of what you are gloating about here. Reasonable people see you in a clearer light when you say stuff like this openly, and it's about bloody time that light was shined on this toxicity.

If you ban cancer treatments for cancer patients, then they still have the same healthcare as people who don't have cancer. They just don't have the healthcare they specifically need.

You were just about able to weasel it when most people hadn't just spent a week watching their transgender friends and loved ones shrink into themselves, retreat from social existence and revert back to the learned trauma responses they haven't seen with such ferocious intensity for years, but the very real impact of what your ideology has created in practice is hard to deny now.

GC ideology was always going to run into trouble once it pushed past the 'reasonable concerns' trojan horses and started showing its true face. Well, the mask has been slipping for a while now and people are noticing that you are still pushing toward an eliminationist agenda despite constant assertions that this was never about toilet bans and removing healthcare for adults.

The whistleblowers are amassing, the cooked books don't line up, the pet bigots parachuted in to grease the wheels of social murder as one last hurrah before retirement are a recurring pattern so predictable that denying it requires ever more desperate contortions. You've just detonated the integrity of the law by imposing a ban so ridiculous and so brazenly in breach of the UK's obligations to the ECHR that legal professionals who wouldn't have touched any of this with a barge pole are now scrambling to salvage what they can of the situation. The Prime Minister has weathervaned to court your hate votes with such shallow desperation that nobody on any side of the lines is buying it.

The price of fixing the nightmare you have created is likely to mean an effective withdrawl of single sex services in most cases and an open door to the far right when this goes to courts and consultations in the years to come.

You won your battle against an ally who has been fighting your corner for decades, but it's likely to cost all of us the war.

It's like the 2nd class passengers on the titanic triumphantly declaring that steerage don't get to load into lifeboats before they do.

The sheer palpable hatred and dismissal of womens rights in your thread, the transperbole!

As Cass Review and WPATH Files prove, there is ZERO benefit to these dangerous drugs that cause fecal and urinary incontinence, Osteoporosis at age 24, narrowing spinal cord, lack of intellectual growth and smaller cortex and tumors.

Which is WHY the highest experts have had these dangerous drugs removed. Just as they did with Thalidomide and Lobotomies.

Females having female only spaces is SUPPORTED by the EHCR. What you advocate; that a male like yourself be admitted to female only spaces, BREACHES rights established by the EHCR for females. And your advocacy of this, @ButterflyHatched , shows your Male Entitlement crystal clear.

This has never been about 'trans rights'. It's only ever been about MENS RIGHTS. The fact you won't even acknowledge our trauma or even sympathise or apologise for that shows your clear Male Entitlement and Male Pattern Thought Process and why you don't think like a female. There is no empathy in your posts. It's all about Mens Rights activism. Your posts prove our point. And it's why you are losing this war and why feminism and the basic human rights of females are winning, and why we will never go back.

FlakyCritic · 30/04/2025 09:08

GreenFriedTomato · 30/04/2025 03:15

And comparing cancer treatment to gender reassignment. Seriously?

It's no wonder these loathsome males are so hated and becoming more and more hated by the day. They don't realise they are their own worst enemies.

SternJoyousBee · 30/04/2025 09:08

The mantrums are getting tedious.

The SC has confirms what women have been saying for years. That women’s rights and trans demands were incompatible. Your side, Butters, insisted that wasn’t true. Your side has caused this mess. Time for you to clean up your own mess and to stop trying to appropriate women’s spaces.

Blame your allies in organisations like Stonewall who misinterpreted legislation and sold lies to public bodies and businesses.

And perhaps listen to women in the future.

FlakyCritic · 30/04/2025 09:21

Comparing it to cancer is a masterstroke in irony considering their 'healthcare' is know for....causing cancer.

But, we all know that @ButterflyHatched will never respond to any of our individual points. He never does.

RapidOnsetGenderCritic · 30/04/2025 09:43

“The whistleblowers are amassing, the cooked books don't line up, the pet bigots parachuted in to grease the wheels of social murder as one last hurrah before retirement are a recurring pattern so predictable that denying it requires ever more desperate contortions. You've just detonated the integrity of the law by imposing a ban so ridiculous and so brazenly in breach of the UK's obligations to the ECHR that legal professionals who wouldn't have touched any of this with a barge pole are now scrambling to salvage what they can of the situation. The Prime Minister has weathervaned to court your hate votes with such shallow desperation that nobody on any side of the lines is buying it.”

And the Fantasy Prize for Creative Writing goes to ... ButterflyHatched. The judges particularly praised the extraordinarily convoluted mixed metaphors, and are applying for a Guinness Record for the most in one sentence.

RedToothBrush · 30/04/2025 09:48

You know, I rather like Butters posting. It provides me with a certain amount of entertainment over just how ridiculous some of these arguments are. Butters provides a good reminder of just how divorced from reality some individuals have become.

Here's Butters arguing that transpeople are being deprived of medical 'care' at the same time as there is a full on medical scandal in the wings that is highlighting a catatrophic failure of safeguarding at the Tavistock.

A few points on this - there were multiple staff who were fully signed up to the idea children were trans. They were willing to work for the service and refer children onwards. These are NOT people who didn't believe in transition.

And yet...

They began to see how problematic this experimentation was, how much it was neglecting to consider other possibilities. To the point that AT LEAST A QUARTER OF THE NON-EXECUTIVE STAFF RAISED SAFEGUARDING CONCERNS WITH SENIOR MANAGEMENT at one point. And it still took years for this to be taken seriously. This isn't just one individual. This was at least ten we know of. All good staff who ultimately took hits to their careers over it all.

Hannah Barnes points out the following (amongst other significant points of over representation of certain groups). GIDS asked about sexuality and found 90% of females reported being same sex attracted or bisexual. For boys the figure was 80.8%. Not only this but the original Dutch study was even worse. 100% of the girls were same sex attracted or bisexual. 98% of the boys were. You had staff who said they were encountering homophobic attitudes on a daily basis - gay staff in particular were silenced over this and told they were biased for voicing concerns - even when the data was blantant and totally backed up their point. But its totally not potentially risking gay conversion... oh no...

And this is worth stressing because there is absoluetely no consideration in Butters narrative for the harms done to those who may have been misdiagnosed and swept along by this crazy, one size fits all, affirmation only blanket approach to gender questioning children and there being no ability to filter out children who had other shit going on and were simply caught up in this frenzy to commit 'rightthink' and not be labelled as transphobic.

And this is before you even try to consider the data on the outcomes on the Dutch study starting to look a lot more dubious...

And Butters comes out saying 'whistleblowers are amassing'. To whistleblow WHAT exactly? An imaginary bogieman? A scandal based on fictious and bogus dreamed up studies? An alternative set of medical ethics that only apply to trans people? I mean, does Butters still take some of the health care demands I've seen banded about seriously?

We can go further here. The Supreme Court Ruling actually works in the favour of transpeople in terms of their health. Imagine a world where it was transphobic to acknowledge sex. So doctors get all these trans patients coming to them with various ailments and because they legally have to treat them as the sex they have on paperwork, these patients get second rate treatment when they are given incorrect doseages, have incorrect anatomical treatments or fail to get the right diagnosis because their symptoms don't align with their chosen sex... And THIS IS WHAT TRANS PEOPLE APPARENTLY SHOULD BE DEMANDING!? Are we saying that Equality of Health for trans people looks like malpractice and inappriopriate treatment all so trans people can feel affirmed in their chosen gender???!!! What kind of psuedo-religious pity is this?!

The Open Letter to Parliament the other day, is a particularly good eye opening example in its detachment to reality and its desire to go on a cleansing from public life of anyone who has publically raised concerns over safeguarding or merely considered the impact on women or anyone else who isn't trans. It is cultlike in tone and concerning in its authoritarian demands. It doesn't understand the difference between the legal and the political. Its incoherent and ill educated and reads like its been written by a bunch of 14 year olds who have zero understanding of how the grown up world actually works. Its like having the school kids demanding to take over and insisting that any food other than chocolate ice cream and burger and chips is poisonous and laws should be enacted to prevent the availability of anything else.

'Mask slipping'? Butters fails to understand that all thats really happened is the trans fig leaf fell off and people started to realise that legal fictions and cosmetic surgery actually dont change your sex and actually trying to be nice and pretend that you can, harms a whole range of people (including those who identify as trans)...

By the time I got to the last line about how we are looking unhinged, I was struggling not to roll on the floor crying with laughter.

Butters, the answer is still no.

OuterSpaceCadet · 30/04/2025 09:49

Fucking hell!

It's really simple.

Come back to us when males of any or no gender id stop the actual violence against women and actual quantifiable oppression of women and we'll reassess whether single sex services and categories are still necessary.

You first, dudes. Show us you can change first.

RedToothBrush · 30/04/2025 09:55

RapidOnsetGenderCritic · 30/04/2025 09:43

“The whistleblowers are amassing, the cooked books don't line up, the pet bigots parachuted in to grease the wheels of social murder as one last hurrah before retirement are a recurring pattern so predictable that denying it requires ever more desperate contortions. You've just detonated the integrity of the law by imposing a ban so ridiculous and so brazenly in breach of the UK's obligations to the ECHR that legal professionals who wouldn't have touched any of this with a barge pole are now scrambling to salvage what they can of the situation. The Prime Minister has weathervaned to court your hate votes with such shallow desperation that nobody on any side of the lines is buying it.”

And the Fantasy Prize for Creative Writing goes to ... ButterflyHatched. The judges particularly praised the extraordinarily convoluted mixed metaphors, and are applying for a Guinness Record for the most in one sentence.

Edited

I think you nail it there much more concisely than I do.

The escalation of this alternative world would be fascinating to watch if you could remove the worry that individuals really and truly believe this stuff.

Unfortunately I don't think we are looking at creative writing. I do think some of this is sincerely held beliefs.

Which raises questions about the implosion. This bubble of a fantasy world, so many truly believe in is unsustainable. We really need to see it for what it is and treat accordingly rather than trying to continue to appease it or 'be kind' about it.

There is nothing kind in trying to maintain this. It just sucks more vulnerable people into it.

Helleofabore · 30/04/2025 09:56

I want to know who the whistleblowers are whistleblowing on?

RedToothBrush · 30/04/2025 09:57

Helleofabore · 30/04/2025 09:56

I want to know who the whistleblowers are whistleblowing on?

Likewise.

RapidOnsetGenderCritic · 30/04/2025 10:02

RedToothBrush · 30/04/2025 09:55

I think you nail it there much more concisely than I do.

The escalation of this alternative world would be fascinating to watch if you could remove the worry that individuals really and truly believe this stuff.

Unfortunately I don't think we are looking at creative writing. I do think some of this is sincerely held beliefs.

Which raises questions about the implosion. This bubble of a fantasy world, so many truly believe in is unsustainable. We really need to see it for what it is and treat accordingly rather than trying to continue to appease it or 'be kind' about it.

There is nothing kind in trying to maintain this. It just sucks more vulnerable people into it.

Show quote history

Yes. It's so depressing to see what the ideology does to loving relatives. I now know many parents in a similar place to me, and have heard the stories of siblings, children, wives. A bit of humour, or a flash of anger, relieves the pain for a few minutes, but the underlying sadness at what has become of my son, and where that may lead him, continues.

RedToothBrush · 30/04/2025 10:08

The whistleblowers are amassing,
To do what?
the cooked books don't line up
cooked books? Can we have some examples please? Or is this just 'comments I don't agree with'
the pet bigots parachuted in to grease the wheels of social murder
what the fuck is social murder? Is this one of those phrases from the Maggie Chapman word generator? Who are the pet bigots? Can we have some names?
as one last hurrah before retirement are a recurring pattern so predictable that denying it requires ever more desperate contortions.
huh? wat? recurring pattern thats so predictable no one knows what the fuck this sentence means or refers to.
You've just detonated the integrity of the law by imposing a ban so ridiculous and so brazenly in breach of the UK's obligations to the ECHR that legal professionals who wouldn't have touched any of this with a barge pole are now scrambling to salvage what they can of the situation.
Integrity of the law? Bans? Breaches? Legal professionals now scrambling? Who are we talking about here? Fife NHS trust? I mean they went by the Diversity Department's advice, not their legal departments... What obligations? You mean the one to women to have single sex provisions as outlined in the exemptions? You mean recognition in law of same sex attraction?
The Prime Minister has weathervaned to court your hate votes with such shallow desperation that nobody on any side of the lines is buying it.
Well I'll give you 98% on that point. The only difference is I'd argue he gave time of day to the hatred of women. Women just wanted their own space, they don't hate anyone. They don't want to be used for validation and its ok and not hateful to say this.

spannasaurus · 30/04/2025 10:11

Helleofabore · 30/04/2025 09:56

I want to know who the whistleblowers are whistleblowing on?

Are they dog whistleblowers?

RedToothBrush · 30/04/2025 10:13

RapidOnsetGenderCritic · 30/04/2025 10:02

Yes. It's so depressing to see what the ideology does to loving relatives. I now know many parents in a similar place to me, and have heard the stories of siblings, children, wives. A bit of humour, or a flash of anger, relieves the pain for a few minutes, but the underlying sadness at what has become of my son, and where that may lead him, continues.

Show quote history

Yep.

Someone is pushing those caught up in this, into a scenario and mindset reminisant of an imploding cult where those caught in the compound think they are all about to be tortured and persecuted so they burn the place down instead, taking their children with them.

Its frightening for those of us who see it happening to people we know and care about. But theres little we can do. You can't 'save' people from this mentality. They have to work it out for themselves.

The grifters and the ideolog politicians really aren't helping by winding so many people up rather than offering the reassurance they deserve and is within their power to offer. I fear what will happen.