Is it possible to be a feminist and also have some empathy for transgender people today?

[HoundOfTheBasketballs]

I’m not going to pretend I’m an expert here but everything feels incredibly polarised. Like, either you’re with us or you’re against us.
Is there no middle ground in this debate?
I am, and always have been a feminist, but I know and like people who are trans and non-binary. I can’t be the only person feeling confused and conflicted, can I?

Fully transitioned I would consider, sex organs made to mimic that of the opposite sex, along with hormone treatment and fully living a good, happy and purposeful life. You seem to have the figures on how many men have a penis still but if having hormone treatment it will not be the same as before. How are you going to react when a manly looking, bearded, muscled trans man walks into your private spaces and tells you in his deep voice he's actually a woman? Because you're not going to like it, you're not going to believe he was once a female so how are these situations going to be dealt with, because the trans person will have nowhere to go. I know you don't care about the trans women being confronted by men when she walks into those places but there's probably going to be violence and on a human level we should care.

I think because when you apply logic and rational thought it falls apart.

They’re mostly attacked by men though. So why would women want to share toilets and changing room with men who identify as women, yet haven’t fully transitioned into transwomen?

Wouldn’t a trans man be going in to the men’s toilets?

No men in women’s spaces. Your argument is not remotely convincing, @LibbysBodiceButtonsso spare us the faux concern.

God, because they LIKE women, they want to be a woman, they're not out to hurt them

i don’t believe that many of them do like women.

They certainly don’t respect women’s boundaries.

All women however they present are welcome into female only spaces. The answer to male violence is not to send men into women's spaces. Perhaps the Trans groups could educate men into accepting a different type of men into their mens only spaces.

You will always get the odd pervert but perverts can pervert any old place and time. Are we supposed to be scared to go out now?

It’s about privacy and dignity for women and girls, as much as safety.

But they are not women.

And that’s all that really needs to be said. Women’s spaces are for women. Not men.

Ha and you think the type of bigoted yobs who caused the violence are up for being educated do you? I think not,they'll just be gee'd on by this. They're loving all this

We’re holding our own though !

Are you intentionally misunderstanding this? As already pointed out women don't think all men who identify as not men want access to women's single sex spaces to harm them. We just want our single sex spaces to remain single sex. As soon as you let a man in they become unisex.

Not anything to do with women.

Irrespective of whether they’ve fully transitioned even

because there’s no such thing as fully transitioned

So the issue is male on male violence and the answer is not to send men into women's spaces.

I don't know where you've been over the last 5-10 years LibbysBodiceButtons, but it's a little late to demand women be kind and pretending that the trans community is harmless, when women have been doxxed, threatened with rape, had their children threatened, arrested, fired from jobs, hit in the face and battered. All in the furtherance of trans ideology.

Take it up with the men who did all that. Not the women they did it to.

No the answer to male violence is not to send trans women into men's spaces

They can use men’s or gender neutral. They don’t belong in women’s spaces.

Exactly. It’s just so tedious.

So where do you think we should send them

Why can't men 'be kind' and stay the hell away from women's spaces, hmm?