People missing out on cancer screening recalls to due gender not sex being recorded.

[HidingBehindTheWallpaper]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/sex-data-gender-identity-nhs-police-review-b2718090.html

If only someone could have foreseen this!

Hence why when PP said this wording is solely for the benefit of trans patients reading it I said it's actually mostly in the guidance for HCPs, labs, etc to be aware that eligibility includes those who could have their sex marked as male. There will also be trans men who are still registered as female.

Anyone with a Y chromosome can obviously be grouped with XY - i.e. men because that's how genetic works.

Hence why when PP said this wording is solely for the benefit of trans patients reading it I said it's actually mostly in the guidance for HCPs, labs, etc to be aware that eligibility includes those who could have their sex marked as male. There will also be trans men who are still registered as female.

You think a letter sent out directly to patients is for the benefit of people working in the labs in hospital?

When do you think these HCP see this private letter?

The word hence does not mean what you think it does. There is no link at all between those two sentences.

This is it, in a nutshell.

Sophistry and word games over truth cost lives and rights.

For once, at least it is the liars paying the invoice.

I'm quite embarrassed by this but it was only a few years ago I learnt i had one, I just knew as a woman I needed one. I'm 40+, educated and English is my first language. But I still didn't know (ironically it was because of the language change comments on here that I found out.) Don't assume people know just because it is blindingly obvious to you.

I remember a case where a transman said they were male so they were treated as if they were. I can't remember what it was - something like a heart attack or similar where males and females present differently. If they had know the sex they would have recognised what it was. And if the correct sex was on the record, instead of the gender, the HCPs would have realised. I seem to recall the individual died but my memory is hazy and I could be wrong.

I agree but the more I think about it the angrier I get. There are children and vulnerable people who are caught up in this. I really feel our politicians, decision makers and the justice system should be held to account. They have enabled the lies through laws to such an extent that medical records are meaningless. The same goes for criminal statistics. Whenever I brought these concerns up with both my MP and local councillors I was given such patronising responses. "There, there, nothing to worry yourself about. We have very sensible policies in place. The numbers are so small bla bla bullshit" I even thought at one time why am I so worried, of course the these clever people will have safeguarded against such problems. Ha ha. I will no longer trust any government to get anything right.

They look at different levels in blood tests for men and women, I think, so it's fucking stupid to lie.

But then it's fucking stupid to lie anyway....this ship has sailed for me a while ago. If you die because you refuse to admit you're delusional, it's on you, sad, but your fault.

The cervical screening issue, particularly the wording around it, is a massive red herring, because the medical implications of misrepresenting one’s sex are far wider than that.
The issue of ensuring that the majority of eligible women are notified should be easy enough to fix. There are ways of wording advertising campaigns that are inclusive (women and other people with a cervix seems OK). Sometimes mistakes will be made - my daughter had a hysterectomy including removal of the cervix, and subsequently got invited tor smear tests. She solved this by asking to be removed from the screening list.
Sullivan recommends that both sex and gender identity (if applicable) should be recorded. This would solve most of the problems simply and effectively.

That sounds plausible. The ones that I always recall are about kidney function.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4799573-if-only-there-was-some-way-to-know-what-treatment-trans-patients-should-get?

Thanks for the link to the old thread @RethinkingLife . I just reread that great trans health manifesto. I needed a laugh and this helped! 😃

It's almost like the context is in the quotes and the two sentences are related

Perhaps you could find and link that story? I have read similar stories in comments (with no actual link, just described) and they always sound made up by someone with a very limited experience of HCPs and protocol in an emergency situation. Yes records are updated and checked for drug allergies etc but lots of the stories about incorrect sex markers on a record suggest clinicians in an emergency setting don't run tests and fully examine a patient and instead base a diagnosis of a description of symptoms and their sex marker. Like is your story suggesting a trans man was conscious and told HCPs he was male and disclosed nothing else? In which case, that doesn't seem believable to me and even so, they would be still be fully examined in an emergency setting, are we to believe they also didn't disclose any medication they were on or any of their medical history when it was being asked? It seems a reach to paint a phantom trans person as so delusional they would put themselves literally in deaths way, which I struggle to believe without an actual example. Were they unconscious and HCPs were basing their knowledge of his sex by the record? Again, they would be examined. It doesn't add up.

Did you have your first smear test at 40+? You've never had a gynaecological exam in 40+ years? Never used a tampon? Really? The mention of people with a cervix is not the first time the word cervix or cervical has been used in cervical cancer screening, what did you think those words meant in all those 40+ years? The invite always came with an explainer of what a smear test was for and explained what a cervix is (the neck of the womb) so I'm surprised you never saw the word cervix before they started using it in the eligibility wording....

It seems a reach to paint a phantom trans person as so delusional they would put themselves literally in deaths way, which I struggle to believe without an actual example.

You want to see delusional, just have a read of the MN thread above that @RethinkingLife linked to.

https://metro.co.uk/2019/05/20/pregnant-transgender-mans-baby-died-because-nurse-didnt-realize-he-was-in-labor-9613972/

One sad example for you @Pombearsallday

Did you read the article? There was no mention or reference of delusional trans people not disclosing their sex while receiving medical care in that link. It was advocating that Doctors need to adjust gender scoring to be inclusive of trans people and that medical research needs to include them when researching these scoring matrixes.

Again, did you read the article? Trans identify was disclosed, pregnancy was tested for. They gave bad medical care - I fail to understand how this is the fault of a "delusional trans person" given they disclosed they were trans, informed them of last period, disclosed testosterone usage etc

He was rightly classified as a man. But that classification threw us off from considering his actual medical needs.’

Do you not get it? Add in the threat of heaven forbid upsetting trans individuals by misgendering can you recognise the real risks.

Literally when presenting to the department, he confirmed he was trans and pregnant. A HCP dismissing that information and not acting on a pregnant patient with abdominal pain has nothing to do trans people being delusional or fear of misgendering. Whether their sex marker was male or female is completely irrelevant to that shocking medical care tbh. Are you suggesting that the pregnancy or trans status wasn't believed and they thought it was a man falsely claiming to be pregnant and therefore not investigated because they will only provide pregnancy care for people with a F sex marker? How ridiculous and shocking care. Both articles linked so far only provide examples of why language is becoming more inclusive to raise awareness.

Do you think perhaps what I'm saying is that there is a consistency in the language of the letters and the guidelines?

Have you worked in a fast paced A&E department? There will be multiple staff dealing with patients at various times. Blood and other tests recorded on the system linked to the sex/gender classifications. Staff changeovers etc you can see how information can become muddled. If the computer records had been factual ie. This patient is female, then this baby may well have survived. Yes human error was a factor but so was the incorrect sex classification.

And different levels are normal for trans patients on hormones. It sounds like some posters aren't in agreement with the medical professionals advocating for research on how to best treat trans patients by being inclusive and incorporating them into our scoring matrixes. It sounds like some are advocating for them being considered solely as female which (if there is genuine concern about their healthcare) could put them at risk also by not taking into account any hormones they're taking would effect their normal range.

you die because you refuse to admit you're delusional, it's on you, sad, but your fault.
Still waiting on an example of this irl! So far the risks seem to be coming from HCPs not having awareness or enough knowledge of trans identities and providing them with bad medical care.

Yes I've worked in hospitals. Regardless of handovers and different staff, the key information of the patients presentation and their symptoms being disregarded or forgotten should never happen and using a sex marker as an excuse isn't gonna cut it for that level of neglience. Do you think they are constantly checking everyone's records for their sex marker and never skimming over the information of why someone has presented to emergency? Give over.