Ireland

[SuperSleepyBaby]

Reading about the Sandi Peggy case and the various issues that have arisen in Scotland - the rape crisis centre, secret cameras in mixed sex toilets in schools, Isla Bryson, Katies Dolatowski etc - it makes me think, is there just as much issues in Ireland?

i know Barbie Kardashian, the male player on a women’s GAA team. Are there as many issues in Ireland as there is in Scotland, but not really reported on in Ireland?

Male politicians of all parties have been sex offenders some are TRAs and some oppose trans ideology. For example Ex-Labour mp Eric Joyce was(probably still is) a fervent TRA and was also convicted for having child sex abuse images on his devices. Least said about Ivor Caplin allegations probably the better until he goes to court but very definitely a TRA.

Since this thread is specifically about Ireland I'd like to say I am not aware that 'Male politicians of all parties have been sex offenders' here and suggest you qualify that statement.

Apologies my statement was too general as I haven’t checked every political party.
FF & FG TDs are probably more likely to give character references for sex offenders.

Given how common male sexual offending is, I think it's a pretty fair bet that all parties have at least one sex offender (just not necessarily one who's been caught yet).

Which is wrong, but does not equate with being sex offenders. Then there's SF, Labour, the Greens, Aontu, PBP, Soc Dems, Independent Ireland, some of them very small with only a couple of males. Your words accused specific identifiable men of crimes. Citing a couple of examples from another country didn't help.

I agree Bint, but the post specified politicians, and even including local representatives in that it was unprovable hyperbole. There are enough real issues in Ireland (including NI) without making potentially libelous blanket statements like that.

Apologies I was responding more to the mention of Trump and it was to say male sex offenders exist in every politician persuasion as they exist everywhere. I expressed myself clumsily.

I'd say in my friendship group, most people didn't know about it until a couple of years ago, but the ones that find out have very practical attitudes about it (no medicalising children, no men in women's facilities etc). Getting self-id through was a very carefully engineered coup.

Given the outcome of the recent referendum www.referendum.ie/archive/referendum-on-the-fortieth-amendment-of-the-constitution-care-bill-2023/ that tried to erase women and mothers and had people on the news trying their very best to sell it, I'd say that the Irish public definitely wouldn't have voted for self-id if it had been made clear what they were voting for.

Family and tradition matters more. There's certainly a veneer of progressiveness (especially amongst students/politicians and the like) but it's not reached through to most people in day to day life in my experience.

Did they ever cover the BK trials in the news?

The initial trial after the High Court competency ruling and the offences were news worthy.

The second trial had the prison sexual violence element.

Naming two British politicians is both unhelpful and quite frankly confusing. Had to Google ivor caplin!

I agree with Mx nibble re the conservative values of the irish.
And our way of dealing with things..

The child abuse scandals over the last while has led to simplistic but effective safeguarding in most junior schools and sports clubs for young children. They don't get changed communally anymore. The turn up in their sports clothes on PE day and go home in them. Same with rugby...go home covered in mud.

Swimming is more of an issue probably.

My older sons used to shower in their underpants after rugby as nobody wanted to get naked in front of each other.

I think exhibitionism is frowned upon and I do wonder if irishmen have the same level of the agp sexual fetish as some other countries.

Voting in NI is still very community-based and it takes a lot for some voters to switch parties - this is a highly frustrating reality of politics here. Plus, SF are keeping their support for genderist policies below most people’s awareness, as are SDLP, by mostly mentioning their support in Stormont debates rather than in campaigning literature. Alliance are more open about it, and happy to accept funds from Ferring Pharma, so their voters have a better idea of what the party supports: puberty blockers for children, self-ID, basically the standard range of genderist policies.

I agree with you that more people in NI need to vote on issues other than the reunification question because the electorate’s failure to hold parties to account on social issues is giving them free rein to support and implement policies that negatively affect their voters.

I no longer have a vote in NI but yeah, that's exactly the problem. I don't see SF rowing back on genderism unless the boys who stand behind SF decide to oust Mary Lou from the leadership. And I assume the SDLP won't move without SF also doing so.

Mike Nesbitt has been quite sensible, though I'd be wary of extrapolating from him to say the UUP is worth a preference vote.

As for the others, Alliance I fear have boxed themselves into a corner, the Greens differ not at all from Alliance, and you really don't want to start me off on the people currently trading as PBP.

Has someone decided not to let us discuss the case of BK? He's an adult, he's a convicted violent offender and the system is terrified of him. He'll be dumped out on the streets in the next few months, a threat to everyone.

I know he had an appalling childhood. I strongly suspect that the gender-enthusiastic way his adolescence was handled has made his life worse not better. At least he's in a male prison now.

www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/jury-acquits-barbie-kardashian-charges-33973404

I remember reading a long article in an actual paper newspaper (possibly the Irish Times) a good few years ago now about a woman who while in custody had violently attacked a female social worker/ prison worker and ripped off her eyelid - I remember it because I was shocked at the level of violence carried out by a woman. It was only months later, that I realised the story was about BK and he was male and NOWHERE in that story did it mention that.

That's the bullshit we are dealing with here with the Irish media. They are very willing to fawn over drag queens, while lying about the sex of a dangerous man.

It's quite depressing how far behind the conversation we are here compared to the UK. I look on enviously at the court cases and media coverage that just isn't happening here, and realise we are years away from getting rid of this shit.

SF, as a party, are weirdly reluctant to change leadership in general - someone gets the job and stays in it well past the point of being effective as long as the boys in the backroom approve of them. I don’t view Mary Lou as a good leader, she has too much of the Nicola Sturgeon about her, she’s always telling the electorate off for not being what she wants them to be. Michelle O’Neill I have a bit more time for but the SF strategy of trying to attract the youth vote by being what they think is “down with the kids” is leading them to ignore lots of issues that need sensible policies rather than woke, “be kind”, soundbites.

Nesbitt, and formerly Beattie, in the UUP have gone on a journey from “be kind” to “actually, there’s some problems with this”, on the issue of genderism, so I’m more inclined to view them favourably. They seem to be open to discussion.

I used to be a Green voter (and member) but I left, years ago, over their support for genderist policies; I told them why but got a snotty answer in response so I won’t be considering them again any time soon.

Alliance, at that time, seemed more open to discussion on social issues (e.g. abortion) but have since adopted a party line on social issues and that line is not open to debate (I think Stephen Farry had a lot to do with this hardening attitude, if his appearances on BBC Ulster are anything to go by). I used to have great time for Naomi Long but the fact that she is prepared to spout ridiculous nonsense about sex and gender has disappointed me, I have no respect for people willing to lie about obvious reality in this way. I also think Naomi has been serving as party leader for longer than is healthy for the party too.

Edited to add that SDLP and PBP are slavishly following SF on the social issues so there’s no real difference between these parties or possibility for disscussion.

Frankly, as usual, NI is behind on this issue and the lack of serious discussion or attention by MLAs has led to the Civil Service, Health Trusts, and NGOs making up their own policies that are genderism-influenced.

If the recent scolding of WRN NI for being unkind is anything to judge by, NI MLAs are out of touch with how voters’ attitudes are moving on this issue (and a few others).

I would agree with this, social media is totally captured but on the ground it's completely different. I live in the most liberal area of dublin, and I have never seen a trans person in real life, going about their business, and no it's not because they pass so well, they just seem to be pretty thin on the ground. I have never met one in a loo, or at the gym, or in the changing rooms in a store. There was a trans woman in dd's college course with her, she didn't know her well but said she was quiet and kept herself to herself. There is a transman now in her place of work, again very quiet, doesn't make a fuss. My youngest is 16 and when they got to about 11 her friends were all (secretly) trans, then non binary, then gay, they are pretty much all now 'cis' girls, please forgive the use of that term. She is at an all girls secondary school now there are no trans children in her school, not one. My friend works in the prison service and says that despite self ID they deal with this on a case by case basis, usually trans prisoners are in a segregated wing, sometimes in a prison for the opposite sex, sometimes not.

Alliance, at that time, seemed more open to discussion on social issues (e.g. abortion) but have since adopted a party line on social issues and that line is not open to debate (I think Stephen Farry had a lot to do with this hardening attitude, if his appearances on BBC Ulster are anything to go by). I used to have great time for Naomi Long but the fact that she is prepared to spout ridiculous nonsense about sex and gender has disappointed me, I have no respect for people willing to lie about obvious reality in this way. I also think Naomi has been serving as party leader for longer than is healthy for the party too.

I used to have dealings with Stephen, and he was never someone who was very good at listening. He wouldn't thank me for saying this, but he had that very Dominic Cummings thing of assuming he was more clever than everyone else in the room, and he was probably right about that, but that assumption meant he would miss out on viewpoints and information that might have been useful to him.

Agree about Naomi being leader too long. The members have a lot of affection for her, but I'm not sure that's shared by the voters. I'm not sure who her replacement would be though. It's kind of the opposite problem to the UUP who had to cycle back to Nesbitt because everyone else had been leader.

Tusla had written to the news outlets after the Garda BOTLO was leaked when the State failed to section him. It was/is unlawful under the Childrens act to name a child before the courts. So his pre18 criminal record would be effectively sealed.

If you remember the Child A and Child B murder case. The parents of the murdered child [name redacted] could not lawfull give a interview and name their daughter and the Dail passed an amendment to the act. But that was for victims who could not seek the right to set aside their anonymity.

And his sectioning case detailed how the medical assessment stated that he had adopted a "gender position" after meeting a child with GD while in care.

And if he is still in prison he will be in the Limerick Womens one.

He was transferred to the male wing in August 2023. Still too close for comfort when he's let out.

www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/barbie-kardashian-transferred-male-prison-30614173

What is it about the media that has them so captured? I can see why politicians and policy-makers etc. have gotten caught up in it, but why do we have such blanket acceptance by main stream media? Whatever happened to factual journalism? To investigative journalism? I can't see what would be in it for them to go along with this illusion.

Anyone who hasn't listened to Paddy's podcast, I do recommend it.

paddyspodcast.ie/episodes-3/

Deadringer
My friend works in the prison service and says that despite self ID they deal with this on a case by case basis, usually trans prisoners are in a segregated wing, sometimes in a prison for the opposite sex, sometimes not.

Your friend is imo mistaken the law is clear.
Or has the Dail passed an amendnent to the prison acts?

If the prisioner is female they are not allowed to be in the male prison system.

LIimerick has been set up as the Male with GRC segregated wing, but without a GRC the prison authority has no lawful way to transfer a male from the male to the female systems.

And it would have been a misuse of public funds to spend €120k+ on one prisioner's social life if he could be moved to a specialist male sex offender unit for free.

The most frustrating thing here is that the laws are against us - the GRA was passed without much public awareness, and our equality legislation doesn't include sex as a protected characteristic, so we're pretty fucked really.

And most of the population don't even really know about this, it's not like the recent Referendum where people had an inclination to think about/ research the issues and there were radio discussions etc.

These laws were just quietly passed without public approval. I'm so angry with successive governments who have betrayed women.

Barbie Khardashian was moved from the women's estate in Limerick towards the end of his sentence. It was at a point where he was becoming a bit too visible and too many questions were being asked. And after the issues with his social worker.

My understanding is that there were still at least two men in the women's estate there at the time - still are there for all I know. So there's definitely a degree of case by case happening, even if this is not official policy.

I sense there is at least some unease/pushback from those working within the prison system (at the highest levels) but not out and out rebellion.

What ministry do prisons fall under I wonder? Is it justice?