Public opinion turning against transgender ideology yougov poll

[Lovelyview]

https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/51545-where-does-the-british-public-stand-on-transgender-rights-in-202425

'a new YouGov study, the fourth in a series reaching back to 2018, shows an increased scepticism towards transgender rights across the board – and particularly in the two and a half years since our previous wave of this study.
Notable in this most recent study – conducted in mid-December – is the growing resistance on transgender rights among those groups that are typically more permissive on the issue, like women and young people.
In fact, the only question on which women now take the permissive view on transgender rights is saying that people should be able to change their gender socially, although at 55% this still represents an eight point drop since the 2022 survey.'

Well worth a read and hopefully a sign of the direction of travel with this issue.

I've seen that mentioned on here so will also find that, thanks

Transmaxxers are also a different group. We have had at least one of them come and 'educate' us in the past. I won't say which group of young men they are part of on the thread as I might get deleted.

Sadly, when we say that female people with transgender identities are used as resources for this political movement aspect of gender identity, they really really are. Some posters have tried in the past to shame us for not mentioning those female people. But the reality is, feminism includes those female people. Why would we need to keep mentioning them, when most of us would support their inclusion in the single sex provisions as far as possible? But they use the accusation as some kind of political point scoring that really just fails.

Yes, there will always be issues where we discuss negative impacts of the demands of some of those female people, usually on language, but the threads are generally not about them as a group.

The only disclaimer is that it could be quite tough listening if your child has been on T for sometime. Helen does speak frankly. So maybe don't if you're in a pickle right now.

I'm now trying to think of a calming or funny non-related podcast but am realising all of my favourites are about disasters 😬

Thanks for the warning! I am in a pickle and I'm going to give myself a few days grace before I delve into things as I admit I feel upset and confused at the moment

🤣🤣 it's kitten videos all the way for me!

here's an enjoyable distraction 😂

I would avoid rabbit twitter threads at the moment. Although, the bunny conservation people are doing a great job in fending off attack and keeping their posts about bunnies!

Omg 🤣🤣🤣 so funny, trust the golden to scoff not only his but the other dogs spaghetti in seconds! 🤣

I saw a thread about that! Sounds crazy! I don't do twitter thankfully.

Thanks ❤️ to everyone for putting up with my nonsense and not giving up on me! And for all the helpful info. As I said I'm going to take a wee break for a few days and then I'll get back into learning more.

If you keep reading and watching content, from a wide variety of sources, then you will reach a position that you will feel comfortable in. Whatever that position is. I don’t know if it will be one that won’t be still distressing. However, you are actually coming at this learning process at a good time.

Because 6 - 7 years ago there was not much written or discussed that was fact based that was easily available. Now there is plenty. And plenty of progress too around protecting female people and children. Not just discussion but actual legal progress, although you might not agree. But at least the information is there so you can make an informed decision about what you do and don’t agree with.

And I do recommend that if you have questions, come back and ask. You will get a range of answers, and they may not reflect your position but you will likely get food for thought at least. You know posters will not tip toe around giving straight answers at least.

I love it so much 😭

@BlueJeansAndMoonbeams
All any of us can do as parents is what we think is right at the time. You did what you thought was best for your child and there’s no way to know what things would be like now if you’d done it differently.
But keeping an open mind and a willingness to reconsider what you’re doing as things move on is crucial. And sometimes that’s hard to do and painful to experience.

So take your time, look at things when it feels ok to and be open and honest enough with ourselves and our kids when we realise we got it wrong.

And, despite the rumours that this board is a viper’s nest, we’re really not. We challenge and argue and question. Sometimes we’re sarcastic or silly. Discussion can be robust but I’ve never seen anyone be malicious. And as you’ll see on the “break it down” thread questions and thoughts made in good faith are welcome.

If you also like disgusting things then I recommend Dr Pimple Popper on YouTube. Those videos clear my mind of whatever I was previously thinking about.

It's not nonsense Bluejeans. This stuff is a lot to take in and sort out what you think about it.

And anyway, anyone with a Captain Beefheart reference as a user name is welcome here! 😄

I am not without sympathy for you on a personal level - you want to maintain a relationship with a person you love. But that sympathy has been exploited too - cute children have been wheeled out on TV programs and those opposing this ideology have been put in the spot to show they are cruel and terrible by bursting what that child has been led to believe. That is why children are such a focus of trans identified men because they elicit sympathy.

Also a few years ago a male teacher who identifies as a woman, who was presenting himself so very reasonably, was invited on stage at an women’s rights event and said words to soothe the worries of those present. I remember reading a Twitter exchange with him about it and someone interjected with ‘why did you use the women’s toilets?’ It felt so harsh and out of place a criticism that I was taken aback. But it also showed how his actions completely undermined anything he had said on stage. These discussions can come across very bluntly but that is because language has so often been twisted and women’s rights dismissed in those conversations.

😁 absolutely one of my favourite songs! Glad to find another fan 😍

Hahaha they really are fascinating aren't they hehe. I love a good spot 👏

I'm totally against children being encouraged to transition. A child cannot possibly understand the implications of such a massive thing. So I'm totally with everyone against that. I hope that at least one thing the push back will achieve is putting a stop to that. My child never mentioned such a thing as a teen and I wouldn't have gone along with it. Unfortunately they were of an age to do as they please when it happened. It's not something I would have wanted for them. I thought they were happy and proud to be a lesbian as they got older so I didn't really understand it. But I chose in the end to accept it as I wanted to keep our close relationship.

"These discussions can come across very bluntly but that is because language has so often been twisted and women’s rights dismissed in those conversations."

This is true.

As I have said on another thread where someone was trying to convince posters that they should just use 'they/them' rather than correct sex language, language became the tool for obfuscating what was happening. It was because people used the language that they believed was 'kind' and 'respectful' that some people took longer to realise what was happening.

It was very deliberate. Hence there have been noticeable moments when the Overton window was pushed and language freed up.

I remember the sheer relief when Kellie Jay Keen yelled 'He is a man!' at the swim meet with Lia Thomas racing. And then the comment to the female person with a transgender identity who tried to discredit her with 'Are you a biologist'. With her reply 'I am not a vet, but I know what a dog is'.

There have been moments like that over the past years that really stand out. Because it felt like a relief to use those words.

A bit like Magdelen Bern's 'I would rather be rude than a fucking liar'. And her reply to Alex Drummond's ”The thought of surgery terrifies me”, and as Magdalen Berns famously replied, “Of course it terrifies you, Alex. They chop your cock off.”

https://www.youtube.com/@MagdalenBerns

I remember the outrage about Helen Joyce's ‘a huge problem to a sane world.’ Yet, when you actually did break down what she meant, it really is. That female people have been expected to make so many accommodations for a group of male people is a problem, and we have had to go through court cases to make progress. It was blunt and it was very uncomfortable. Yet, it is the stark, unadorned truth.

If the truth can be recognised in a blunt comment, then it is up to those who find it uncomfortable to understand why they find something truthful uncomfortable. The onus should not be on people trying to tell the truth to speak in comfortable ways when the issue is someone needs specially curated speech to be able to take in the truth. Because even just the process of understanding why it is uncomfortable can bring greater clarity.

I haven’t quite made it to the end of the thread but feel moved to post to @BlueJeansAndMoonbeams - most women on here would feel passionately protective of your child, and their anger and bitterness is aimed at an ideology that leads people to damage healthy bodies and some to behave very badly in various ways, mainly targeting or impacting women.

That’s behind the expression of powerful emotions that’s troubling you here.

Also, we don’t police pronoun usage- Yoyr words are your words. I think you have a daughter and would prefer to use her/she. You are free to use he him because they are your words.

Pronouns are powerful, there’s a wonderful piece called ‘pronouns are rohypnol’ that’s well worth reading. I feel strongly about using accurate language, particularly in situations were it matters. But you get to use whatever ones you like.

I have a transitioned youngster in my life that I’m being careful around as the easiest thing for them would be to walk away from me. I worry. A lot. And can do nothing.

You are not 'doing nothing'. You are here educating yourself and I'm sure you apply what you learn here in any way that you can, to help your youngster.

For quite a few of us here the hinge or peaking moment that took us from thinking supporting trans rights was a version of supporting gay rights, calling people what they want to be called, accepting, etc etc, was the moment it came for a young woman or girl in out social circle or family and we thought W T F?

Particularly if we'd already gone though having anorexic/s around the place a generation earlier, killing or nearly killing themselves, and could see a similar pattern of self-destruction at play, but this time with the media and the righteous looking on with simpering approval.