is mumsnet a safe space for me?

[rexrabbit]

would you say mumsnet these days is a safe space for a non-transphobic lesbian with children to hang out?

Shakira doing her Dimetrodon impression.

No I wouldn't, it's a hotbed of hate here.

I try to be around to balance it out but it's depressing af. I wouldn't do it if I were LGBTQ or trans myself because it would make me suicidal reading some of the posts.

I take solace in that it's this generation's equivalent of homophobia and that the next generations will look back in horror at such outdated views.

The definition appears to be mutable

Aw shit, the last 20 minutes of posts hadn’t refreshed and I see I am therefore late to the party and repetitive with my dimetrodon post.

Right so no examples of transphobic words or deeds then, just the usual 'away and look up the definition yourself'.

I'm SHOCKED I tell ya. 🙄

I Googled it, and discovered a film from 2017 that doesn't look as if it is of any interest to me.

Which generation, heyho?

If transphobia gets deleted, sobtherefore there are no examples, how is it this place is a hotbed of transphobia.

I don't particularly care if anyone, regardless of their chromosomes choses to live their life in a way they perceived to be "male" or "female".
I only care if by doing so they cause distress or physical danger to another person, such as in a rape centre, or sport, or other protected single sex place.

I could be wrong but transphobic, as I've seen it used on this board, appears to mean "Waaaaaaaaah they don't agree with me".

'I try to be around to balance it out but it's depressing af. I wouldn't do it if I were LGBTQ or trans myself because it would make me suicidal reading some of the posts.'

Claiming that reading things you find offensive can cause suicidal thoughts is an outrageous thing to say. It's extremely dangerous and inaccurate to blame one single factor or person for suicidal ideation.

It's a manipulative way to attempt to get people to stop saying what you don't like hearing.

If you struggle with the meaning of words, there are several good dictionaries available online.

I don't think it's the women on FWR who struggle with the meaning of words.

Ageist much? Assuming we are all of a similar age and therefore will die out and the next generation will take over that you assume will be more brainwashed with gender ideology?

Sorry to burst your bubble but being pro sex based rights is not related to age. It seems to be a class thing though, more higher middle class are all for no sex segregation and everyone else likes the sex segregation to be in place.

And today's white saviour award goes to...

Honestly, there are plenty of Ls & Bs from your acronym* here who don't require your hand wringing advocacy.

as an aside "LGBTQ or trans" what on earth did you think the the T was for?

I feel I should admit I had totally misunderstood 'pedipalps', at this point.

You do know that a lot of women on this board are gay themselves? Marched for gay rights? Do you even have the first clue who you're talking to? Or even what we believe.

It's not a "hotbed of hate" not to believe in the misogynistic, homophobic bullshit that is genderwoo. There's nothing remotely progressive about a fact-free ideology which is entirely built on sexist pink and blue sex stereotypes from the 1950s that most feminists binned decades ago and you people are desperate to bring back and entrench. The attitudes of people like you are decades behind. You're taking us and our rights back 50, 60 years (longer in the case of women; more like Victorian times). It's embarrassing.

You could try learning about feminism instead. it's much freer, has been pushing back on the idea of "gender" boxes for decades and doesn't require medicalising and sterilising kids if they dare not to fit backwards limited pink and blue sex stereotypes enough for your narrow minded, conservative sensibilities. GTFO.

Well… it is so tricky these days

Stonewall just changed their definition of transphobia… Denying anyone’s gender identity used to be transphobic, it no longer is….

which dictionary/ source do you suggest to we have a reference?

https://sex-matters.org/posts/updates/stonewall-changes-transphobia-definition/#:~:text=The%20fear%20or%20dislike%20of,or%20refusing%20to%20accept%20it.

It's a sincere question, becsuse the definitions are always either coherent but unreasonable, or reasonable but incoherent.

It would be amazing to get a definition that makes so much sense that suddenly it's blindingly obvious why a man's self image as a woman, a state he has only ever experienced externally, is suddenly more authoritive than the experiences of female people, or why the only possible way to accomodate a man with such a belief is to treat him as interchangeable with female people even though his gender identity rests on something in his mind not his body, or why the identity of men who believe they are women is more important in sport than the opportunities of people who are female, or why the statistical alignment of men who think they are women to male pattern violence and abuse is so high if they are just like women and why this isn't an issue when housing them with female prisoners, or why female people can't be allowed to set up single sex provisions alongside gender-aligned provisions, or why it's not a bad thing to medically adjust young people's bodies based on a sudden strong belief, or why it's ok that we don't have any statistics about how sex impacts critical social metrics like crime and wealth because it's more important to measure by gender...

So if you have that definition, the one that makes sense not just from the perspective of what is good for trans people but also of what is fair and reasonable for female people, the ones who still bear the weight of a structurally and socially sexist society, I would genuinely love to hear it because no, i do not know what that definition is.

Okay! We can look to Stonewall for the definition, seeing as pps are coy about giving their definitions.

Transphobia

Prejudice or negative attitudes, beliefs or views about trans people. This can include the fear or dislike of someone based on the fact they are, or are perceived to be trans.

www.stonewall.org.uk/resources/list-lgbtq-terms

That accord with pps who are here with us in the hotbed of hate?

@BackToLurk

I've edited to remove the misrepresentations.

Is it this "Prejudice or Negative attitudes, beliefs or views about trans people who are homophobic, misogynist or push conformity to sex-role stereotypes. This can include the fear or dislike of someone based on the fact they are, or are perceived to be trans homophobic, misogynist or pushers of conformity to sex-role stereotypes. ." or the old one which specified "including denying disliking their gender identity encouragement of the enforcement of homophobia, misogyny and conformity to sex-role stereotypes or refusing to accept it."?

Which leaves:

Negative attitudes, beliefs or views about people who are homophobic, misogynist or push conformity to sex-role stereotypes. This can include the dislike of someone based on the fact they are homophobic, misogynist or pushers of conformity to sex-role stereotypes. ."

or

disliking their encouragement of the enforcement of homophobia, misogyny and conformity to sex-role stereotypes or refusing to accept it."

okay so

You realise don't you @heyhopotato , that us feminists are winning the war, and polls from 2020 to 2025 show a continual decrease in support for Gender Ideology, as time goes on? So in fact, eventually Gender Ideology will be looked back on in horror and seen as a terrifyingly misogynistic and outdated era. Or did you not know the polls slide more against Gender Ideology as each year passes? You appear to live in a misogynistic and insular outdated echo chamber that does not reflect reality in any way.

I've always thought of it as "Trojan". The constant piggybacking and appropriation of other people's civil rights fights in a movement that is primarily for the benefit of a group of middle aged heterosexual men, the "every day is upside down day", the constant lies, abuses and gaslighting tactics of its advocates, and the infiltrating all women's and gay rights organisations to destroy them from the inside with their misogynistic, homophobic nonsense that will eventually dismantle all of the rights those orgs once fought for.

I love my great-niece. I don't believe her to be a man.

Am I transphobic?

Not just bitey <wiggles eyebrows>

I'd say that, yes, this is a safe space. You can ask any questions you want, and the worst that will happen is a group of enthusiastic women will ask you to explain more or run up with the virtual equivalent of explanatory pamphlets - which, admittedly can feel quite full on when there's a lot of us, but it's well intentioned and not malicious.

OK. Sometimes they'll just flat out tell you that you're wrong and why you're wrong - but still, they're not going to cancel you, expel you, dox you or come after you with pointy sticks - you can name change, come back again, and no-one will ever know.

Not believing in sexist claptrap gets women called mental, sickening, disgusting and toxic.

Remind me again who's unsafe under identity ideology?

Ah no darling. Transgenderism and gender identity are juat this generation's version of society's same old sexist ideas about women and men.

I hope that the people who hold such sexist and reductive ideas that they advocate changing healthy bodies to fit sexist gender stereotypes do indeed look back in horror at what they were cheerleading.