Teen declared they were trans and now says they can't be in contact with us

[crochetedcat]

As the title says really, I'll try to keep this brief but obviously it's complicated.

DS went to university and within a few weeks of being there declared he was now trans and had a new name. We were all rather confused as this seemed out of the blue at 18. He is autistic but seemed happy and doing well, good course, plans for the future etc. I've kept using 'he' here for clarity.

We decided to jointly take the approach to be supportive and to focus on everything else, didn't question it, carried on as usual. I was very aware that challenging it would not go down well, especially when at uni with potentially lots of people saying how awful we were for asking any questions at all. So we decided to take the 'thanks for telling us dear, that's great, how's uni going' approach.

Tbh there was very little change apart from when they came home for a visit in November they were wearing a bit of make up and had made changes to voice and mannerisms. This was difficult to deal with as it felt like the concept of being female was being stereotyped but again, we didn't react and continued to support. He happily went back off to uni after a few days of seeing family etc.

Christmas was the same. He came home for a week but was fairly distant. But we continued being positive and asking about course, friends etc etc - everything you would usually do. No one questioned anything and just rolled with it. The key point here is we have all been as accepting as possible, no one has said anything even vaguely negative, lots of enthusiasm about uni and life more broadly.

Then early in the New Year, we got a message that we were all clearly embarrassed by him and there would be no more contact ever again. It felt ludicrous tbh. The day before we'd been chatting on WhatsApp about his course and something I'd been reading. I responded asking where this had come from, that we weren't embarrassed and would support him in whatever. He said ok and asked about the dog as she'd needed to go to the vet. A completely unemotional reaction really to having just declared he'd never see his family again.

However I haven't heard from him since. He ignores all messages including asking him if he's ok. This was nearly 3 weeks ago. He's not great at responding to messages but would usually do so in a day or two even if just an emoji.

I am guessing the accusations that we are unsupportive are about his anxieties. Or wanting the drama of no one supporting him. It feels very similar to 'the script' of the cheating husband where history is rewritten to fit the narrative.

I also assume the wanting to cut contact is due to him feeling uncomfortable in his 'old life' because it's confronting and now his new normal where probably everyone is effusive.

I would bet money on new friends / the internet driving this.

But it feels so unreal and I don't know what to do next. Is it serious? Is he just never going to have contact with us again? Do I just remain supportive and sending him photos of the dog and articles I see about climate science and including him on the family groups, he hasn't left those yet?

I'm of course angry that someone could just send a message like that to his mother with no feeling. And upset. And scared etc etc

And then there's the minor fact I'm financially supporting him through university. I'm paying for the phone contract for the phone he used to tell me he was never going to see me again. Is he assuming I'll carry on sending him £700 a month to cover his uni halls costs whilst he declares he's estranged?! It feels like a younger teen yelling that they hate you and then asking what's for dinner and can they have a lift to town.

At a loss really and not sure where to go from here to have the most sensible outcome.

Thank you.

So if I respond, I get accused of derailing, but if I try not to derail by not responding, I'm being tactical. There's no winning!

The reason for a death is determined by a coroner at an inquest - not randoms on the internet. It's so disrespectful to weaponise a death for your own argumentative reasons. Nobody should be speculating about this.

I don't think it's reasonable to think that someone would go so far as to remove their penis and balls and take feminizing hormones simply to stand in cubicles next to biological women who are also in cubicles. It's a much more reasonable deduction that people who go through such a thing genuinely feel themselves to be female and don't have nefarious reasons for living as one. The vast majority of changing rooms these days aren't communal anyway; they have cubicles. So a man with bad intentions would - providing GRCs were only issued after full transitions - have to go through all the surgery and hormones to use mostly private cubicles. Which would make no sense.

I don't agree with self-ID and using that to access changing rooms. No way.

So you think it's coincidence that The Vivienne died on a weekend when there was an outpouring of abuse because she was dressed as a woman? You don't want to admit that there are tragic consequences for trans denial and abuse, so you're criticising me, which doesn't take away from that fact that this performer was very likely driven to suicide by some of the same kind of attitudes displayed on this thread. Criticise me all you like, but it doesn't change the uncomfortable truth that rejection and abuse of men who don't conform to male stereotypes can contribute to their mental suffering, sometimes resulting in tragedy. If not for that terrible outpouring of hate after Blankety-Blank, where Viv went on TV in a dress and makeup, they would probably still be alive.

I'm not interested in why men have cosmetic surgery to try to represent a women's body. The social contract and our laws exist for good reasons.
No women anywhere in the world campaigned to have men sharing spaces where they undress. It's a totally male led demand.
No men in women's spaces.

Here you are - listen to this TV presenter discussing the very same issue:

https://x.com/BevJacksonAuth/status/1883082021918183482

I'm being a responsible adult pointing out how reprehensible it is for someone to weaponise a death to try to point score online. It's a fact that a coroner determines the cause of death in the UK.
The Samaritans have very clear guidelines about the responsible reporting of suicide in the media and advise against making unsubstantiated allegations.

@ChicLilacSeal

You absolutely cannot say why this man chose to end his life, it's pure speculation. Suicide is rarely attributable to one factor. And I'm not sure why you're blaming it on women on Mumsnet. How much abuse do you think women in the public eye get?

I'm being a responsible adult pointing out how reprehensible it is for someone to weaponise a death to try to point score online.

I agree. Emotional blackmail isn't exactly a novel approach though.

OK, I'm reprehensible, abhorrent, all the things. That doesn't change the fact that the way some parts of society treat non-gender-conforming males dreadfully affects their mental health, and that Vivienne's fate is very likely to be a result of that. Criticising the poster is just a smokescreen to distract from the fact that anti-trans attitudes can have tragic consequences.

For the hard of thinking over there, he wasn't trans.

Criticising the poster is just a smokescreen to distract from the fact that anti-trans attitudes can have tragic consequences.

No. It is reprehensible to speculate about the death of a young man simply to prop up your flimsy argument about gender. He isn't "trans". I thought "trans" meant physically transitioning to you? Try to at least make some sort of coherent point.

The coherent point ship sailed some time ago. Well no, it never left the harbour.

Suicide rates amongst trans young people are the highest

No, they are not.

Why does getting abuse from being on the tv, somehow become the problem of women to resolve in their changing rooms?

I'm sorry, but as I've said before on this thread, deal with the abuse rather than making this issue a problem for women to put up with at their expense so men don't have to change their behavior.

Why should it ALWAYS be the women who have to put up and shut up with the consequences of direct and indirect unacceptable behavior of me?

Women are not support humans to males. We are not there to validate males sense of identity. Frankly we've got enough problems of our own to deal with. Lack this vast lack of knowledge of women's biology.

As I said on another thread, skirts and high heels are not reproductive organs. Those reproductive organs are rather important and surgical transition is purely cosmetic.

Sex is not gender and sex matters. If we are prevented from taking about sex because it might be distressing for some of the 'women' in our presence, women are thrown under an almighty bus.

And yes this includes issues like sexual assault and voyeurism because sex matters when it comes to access to women's bodies and women's dignity and issues of consent.

Statistics on young people questioning their gender were made up to attempt to prove that suicide rates were high. They were not high. Somebody just plucked a figure out of the air and said it was fact which it wasn't. It reminds me a bit of the made up statistics about MMR and autism. The lie gets repeated and repeated, that does not make it true.

Clearly bothered to read the bloody thread then...

... what is it with the scolders and the tone policers who always have some excuse as to why they can't actually read what anyone says here, but are happy to just smear them or act as if they have superior knowledge (which falls apart at the mildest of questions)?

I am horrified someone has come along to a mother’s thread asking for help to support her child and not once demonstrated any contempt for that child and then proceeded to threaten her that her child might commit suicide. It’s sinister and wrong.

I agree.

More than one poster.

I wish I had more time but I just don’t. I’m really sorry I was wrong about the suicide rates- I meant to say attempts. I REALLY don’t want to spread misinformation- my point is This conversation is so feisty and spicy because it’s a minefield without precedent no one has the answer for every case. I have someone in my life who I care about who is trans. I am deeply concerned about trend in young people mixing up people’s behaviour with their intent (my work is in therapy and career with young people) I have seen transphobic comments on mumsnet. I am worried that the relationship between this young person and their mum is going in a bad direction and that rather than talking through all the details with a trained therapist who has time to shift through all the ins and outs - people on here will convince her that she should show her true feelings such as ‘insulted’ I don’t want this to end badly for her or her child - sorry I don’t have time to chat more x

What RedToothBrush's posts illustrate is the damage that transition [often? always?] does to family members. RTB is speaking with long experience of this from the perspective of a sibling, and with really in depth analysis of what has happened in her family and often applies much more widely. As a parent I find her insights immensely valuable, and I fully understand her need to "intellectualise the issue".

Kindness is fine except that it is defined and demanded by trans activists who think it only applies one way, and who do not allow truth to get a word in edgeways. Understanding appears to mean kindness, as it is in my experience impossible to understand trans thinking, which is not based on rationality and is contradictory. Rights for everyone - yes please. When trans activists accept women rights we will have moved a long way towards mutual acceptance.

Omg! This is the only time I’ve been called sinister in my life. Omg I had no idea things could get so lost in translation. This is an emerging massive problem in a whole new arena in problems with young people. I genuinely wanted to help not by scaring the mum to death but by saying this is too nuanced for mumsnet. And not to match her teens poor and alienating behaviour I’m worried for this mum and her teen- the honest truth is I don’t have time to think wordings through. Will delete my account now (realised I’m just too busy and if my advice isn’t helping then it’s pointless!) x

You'd do well to read the thread.

You might learn something to help the person in your life who is trans. And to free yourself from the emotional blackmail in the process.

I tire of all those who claim to be so concerned but can't really be arsed when it comes down to it ...

...it's easier to just do as you are told.