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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Defending Women from Gender Ideology Extremism and Restoring Biological Truth

1000 replies

IwantToRetire · 21/01/2025 18:51

Purpose.

Ideologues who deny the biological reality of sex have increasingly used legal and other socially coercive means to permit men to self-identify as women and gain access to intimate single-sex spaces and activities designed for women, from women’s domestic abuse shelters to women’s workplace showers. This is wrong. Efforts to eradicate the biological reality of sex fundamentally attack women by depriving them of their dignity, safety, and well-being. The erasure of sex in language and policy has a corrosive impact not just on women but on the validity of the entire American system. Basing Federal policy on truth is critical to scientific inquiry, public safety, morale, and trust in government itself.

This unhealthy road is paved by an ongoing and purposeful attack against the ordinary and longstanding use and understanding of biological and scientific terms, replacing the immutable biological reality of sex with an internal, fluid, and subjective sense of self unmoored from biological facts. Invalidating the true and biological category of “woman” improperly transforms laws and policies designed to protect sex-based opportunities into laws and policies that undermine them, replacing longstanding, cherished legal rights and values with an identity-based, inchoate social concept.

This will defend women’s rights and protect freedom of conscience by using clear and accurate language and policies that recognize women are biologically female, and men are biologically male.

Policy and Definitions.

The policy is to recognize two sexes, male and female. These sexes are not changeable and are grounded in fundamental and incontrovertible reality:

(a) “Sex” shall refer to an individual’s immutable biological classification as either male or female. “Sex” is not a synonym for and does not include the concept of “gender identity.”

(b) “Women” or “woman” and “girls” or “girl” shall mean adult and juvenile human females, respectively.

(c) “Men” or “man” and “boys” or “boy” shall mean adult and juvenile human males, respectively.

(d) “Female” means a person belonging, at conception, to the sex that produces the large reproductive cell.

(e) “Male” means a person belonging, at conception, to the sex that produces the small reproductive cell.

(f) “Gender ideology” replaces the biological category of sex with an ever-shifting concept of self-assessed gender identity, permitting the false claim that males can identify as and thus become women and vice versa, and requiring all institutions of society to regard this false claim as true. Gender ideology includes the idea that there is a vast spectrum of genders that are disconnected from one’s sex. Gender ideology is internally inconsistent, in that it diminishes sex as an identifiable or useful category but nevertheless maintains that it is possible for a person to be born in the wrong sexed body.

(g) “Gender identity” reflects a fully internal and subjective sense of self, disconnected from biological reality and sex and existing on an infinite continuum, that does not provide a meaningful basis for identification and cannot be recognized as a replacement for sex.

Recognizing Women Are Biologically Distinct From Men.

Full statement text at https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/defending-women-from-gender-ideology-extremism-and-restoring-biological-truth-to-the-federal-government/

Every news outlet is reporting this as anti trans legisliaton.

Not one has reported it is about women's rights.

That's why I started this thread, although there are others as hoping the search engines will pick it up.

Seems that women's rights are so unimportant to anyone, that even when there is a political statement about them, the media reports it is about something else.

Defending Women From Gender Ideology Extremism And Restoring Biological Truth To The Federal Government – The White House

By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, including section 7301 of title 5, United

https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/defending-women-from-gender-ideology-extremism-and-restoring-biological-truth-to-the-federal-government/

OP posts:
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Lostcat · 27/01/2025 17:59

Myalternate · 27/01/2025 17:54

He isn’t transgender I imagine

Right? and?

teentantrums · 27/01/2025 18:01

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 17:57

I said that specific trans person should change somewhere privately if she is unable to change in the facilities available at that centre without exposing her penis to a group of teenage girls.

That doesn’t mean I think trans women at large should not be allowed to use women’s changing rooms. I don’t think this at all.

Edited

This is just ridiculous. How on earth do you think that would work? You do realise that we cannot make up individual rules for every single person that wants to use facilities? We need clear guidelines so that women and girls know a single-sex space is just that. Why would you exclude this particular trans woman but not all males? What is the difference?

DeanElderberry · 27/01/2025 18:02

At least Americans won't have to put up with this 'her penis' stuff in future. I hope the rest of us win the same freedom.

Speaking of playing games.

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 27/01/2025 18:05

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 17:59

Right? and?

And he is an individual with a dsd that has had a profound impact on his life. People with a dsd have nothing to with transgender. Also objects to the term intersex because as he says he isn't between sexes, he is male with a glitch in his biological makeup

MrsOvertonsWindow · 27/01/2025 18:09

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 17:57

I said that specific trans person should change somewhere privately if she is unable to change in the facilities available at that centre without exposing her penis to a group of teenage girls.

That doesn’t mean I think trans women at large should not be allowed to use women’s changing rooms. I don’t think this at all.

Edited

Indeed. And the result of this was a transwoman repeatedly wandering through the female changing rooms when teenage elite swimmers were naked and getting into their very tight swimwear.
As you can see from the story the transwoman also also made a big fuss when a hotel protected women swimmers from having to share the women's changing rooms in a spa with them.
Pleasingly Swim England (who once were completely enraptured at the idea of men having access to women's changing rooms) promptly changed the rules to restrict access to the girls.

Not prudery - basic safeguarding of girls and an understanding of the potential for a breach of the Sex Offences Act (voyeurism)

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12350741/Parents-raised-concerns-transgender-pool-official-using-womens-changing-room-time-young-girls.html

Parents' concerns over trans pool official using women's changing room

Anne Coombes, 65, who last week blasted a hotel spa for not giving her a key to a female changing room,  was volunteering as an official at the British Summer Championships in Sheffield.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12350741/Parents-raised-concerns-transgender-pool-official-using-womens-changing-room-time-young-girls.html

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:12

teentantrums · 27/01/2025 18:01

This is just ridiculous. How on earth do you think that would work? You do realise that we cannot make up individual rules for every single person that wants to use facilities? We need clear guidelines so that women and girls know a single-sex space is just that. Why would you exclude this particular trans woman but not all males? What is the difference?

Not ridiculous at all. Quite the opposite It’s the only proportionate way to deal with the issue that safeguards all concerned

teentantrums · 27/01/2025 18:13

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:12

Not ridiculous at all. Quite the opposite It’s the only proportionate way to deal with the issue that safeguards all concerned

How does it safeguard women and girls to allow males into their spaces? I dont think you know what safeguarding is.

FlowchartRequired · 27/01/2025 18:13

DeanElderberry · 27/01/2025 18:02

At least Americans won't have to put up with this 'her penis' stuff in future. I hope the rest of us win the same freedom.

Speaking of playing games.

Anyone who says/writes 'her penis' and means it seriously, is a fucking liar. They are also someone who puts the wants of some biological males before the needs of biological females.

I note that Lost has not answered my injured woman in hospital and their request for single-sex intimate care question, and this is not the first thread that I have asked it on.

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:17

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 27/01/2025 18:05

And he is an individual with a dsd that has had a profound impact on his life. People with a dsd have nothing to with transgender. Also objects to the term intersex because as he says he isn't between sexes, he is male with a glitch in his biological makeup

I never said your husband was either transgender or intersex . I know nothing about your husband or his body or his life. And I absolutely respect his preferred use of terminology and his sex/ gender.

However, there are people who are transgender and there are people who are intersex (and use that term) - both groups are affected by this legislation. We need to be able to talk about these groups- and the existence of DSDs more broadly , in order to understand and define biological sex, which is what this legislation is about. We also have to be able to understand what biological sex is (and isn’t) in order to understand what it is to be trans.

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:18

FlowchartRequired · 27/01/2025 18:13

Anyone who says/writes 'her penis' and means it seriously, is a fucking liar. They are also someone who puts the wants of some biological males before the needs of biological females.

I note that Lost has not answered my injured woman in hospital and their request for single-sex intimate care question, and this is not the first thread that I have asked it on.

is a fucking liar

how? Because I use words in a way you don’t like?

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 27/01/2025 18:20

I think losts issue is she is very much of the be kind persona. She's envisioning Hayley Cropper not Isla Bryson. The problem is you can't do a person by person check so it has to be all males out of women's spaces because we do not know which ones are dangerous.

teentantrums · 27/01/2025 18:20

We also have to be able to understand what biological sex is and isn’t in order to understand what it is to be trans.

Funny how we never used to have a problem understanding what sex people are until about 5 minutes ago. And for all your waffling about biological sex, you still want to let males into female spaces (although some of them have to stay out for .....reasons). What is the point in talking about biological sex if that is not going to be a crucial factor in your "safeguarding" anyway?

bluenova · 27/01/2025 18:20

I understand that on the whole those with DSDs do not appreciate being used as pawns by trans activists. This is because they know whether they are male or female despite their genitalia.

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 27/01/2025 18:21

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:17

I never said your husband was either transgender or intersex . I know nothing about your husband or his body or his life. And I absolutely respect his preferred use of terminology and his sex/ gender.

However, there are people who are transgender and there are people who are intersex (and use that term) - both groups are affected by this legislation. We need to be able to talk about these groups- and the existence of DSDs more broadly , in order to understand and define biological sex, which is what this legislation is about. We also have to be able to understand what biological sex is (and isn’t) in order to understand what it is to be trans.

Edited

All people with a dsd (intersex to you) have a biological sex. This does not affect them

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:21

teentantrums · 27/01/2025 18:20

We also have to be able to understand what biological sex is and isn’t in order to understand what it is to be trans.

Funny how we never used to have a problem understanding what sex people are until about 5 minutes ago. And for all your waffling about biological sex, you still want to let males into female spaces (although some of them have to stay out for .....reasons). What is the point in talking about biological sex if that is not going to be a crucial factor in your "safeguarding" anyway?

Who’s we?

lifeturnsonadime · 27/01/2025 18:24

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 27/01/2025 18:20

I think losts issue is she is very much of the be kind persona. She's envisioning Hayley Cropper not Isla Bryson. The problem is you can't do a person by person check so it has to be all males out of women's spaces because we do not know which ones are dangerous.

I hope Lost is actually male because I really despair if any female will ignore the known oppression of women over the whole of time in favour of the wishes of a group of males.

Surely no woman can have such internalised misogyny.

teentantrums · 27/01/2025 18:24

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:21

Who’s we?

I could ask you the same question. Let’s say society, the general public, blokes choosing which bathroom to enter, never used to be a problem.

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:25

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 27/01/2025 18:21

All people with a dsd (intersex to you) have a biological sex. This does not affect them

It may not affect your husband but it absolutely affects all kinds of people living with DSDs, if you don’t understand this you have an extremely narrow experience and understanding of sex, DSDs at large and many of the people living with them. I posted an article earlier in this thread written by an intersex person setting out how this legislation affects them.

Who are the women with CAIS in Trump’s EO?

FlowchartRequired · 27/01/2025 18:28

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:18

is a fucking liar

how? Because I use words in a way you don’t like?

Not just your Humpty Dumpty use of words. I have read your posts and the content is unteathered from biological reality and suffers from the worst kind of terminological inexactitude - lies justified by idealogical fanciful thinking.

teentantrums · 27/01/2025 18:28

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:25

It may not affect your husband but it absolutely affects all kinds of people living with DSDs, if you don’t understand this you have an extremely narrow experience and understanding of sex, DSDs at large and many of the people living with them. I posted an article earlier in this thread written by an intersex person setting out how this legislation affects them.

Who are the women with CAIS in Trump’s EO?

Edited

You are making out this is a centuries old problem. What was wrong with the situation 10 years ago?

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:34

teentantrums · 27/01/2025 18:28

You are making out this is a centuries old problem. What was wrong with the situation 10 years ago?

Well many things have changed in 10 years. In many ways the situation was better as people were a hella lot less transphobic, and there wasn’t this kind of oppressive legislation around. On the other hand trans people suffered much more social isolation, stigma, discrimination, less visibility in society, less access to support. Provision of healthcare was better, but that didn’t mean that people had access to it etc.

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 27/01/2025 18:36

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:25

It may not affect your husband but it absolutely affects all kinds of people living with DSDs, if you don’t understand this you have an extremely narrow experience and understanding of sex, DSDs at large and many of the people living with them. I posted an article earlier in this thread written by an intersex person setting out how this legislation affects them.

Who are the women with CAIS in Trump’s EO?

Edited

No you posted an article from Apr 24 which has nothing to do with this legislation.

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:38

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 27/01/2025 18:36

No you posted an article from Apr 24 which has nothing to do with this legislation.

Nope that was a different article about the adoption of a UN resolution on the rights of intersex people.
I also earlier posted an article written by an intersex person about this EO and how it eliminates their very existence
RTFT,

Myalternate · 27/01/2025 18:39

…..Transgender people are people whose gender identity is different from the gender they were thought to be at birth. “Trans” is often used as shorthand for transgender.
When we're born, a doctor usually says that we're male or female based on what our bodies look like. Most people who were labeled male at birth turn out to actually identify as men, and most people who were labeled female at birth grow up to be women. But some people's gender identity – their innate knowledge of who they are – is different from what was initially expected when they were born. Most of these people describe themselves as transgender.
A transgender woman lives as a woman today, but was thought to be male when she was born. A transgender man lives as a man today, but was thought to be female when he was born…..

🤣. thought to be?

From Transequality.org

teentantrums · 27/01/2025 18:39

Lostcat · 27/01/2025 18:34

Well many things have changed in 10 years. In many ways the situation was better as people were a hella lot less transphobic, and there wasn’t this kind of oppressive legislation around. On the other hand trans people suffered much more social isolation, stigma, discrimination, less visibility in society, less access to support. Provision of healthcare was better, but that didn’t mean that people had access to it etc.

I was quoting your message about DSDs, not trans people. Why do you keep on deflecting?

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