"Punch a TERF" Sarah Jane Baker to speak at #UKWomensMarch London on 18 January 2025

[IwantToRetire]

There have been many threads about Sarah Jane Baker, and there is an existing thread about the (nationwide) Women's Marches on Sunday.

East Sussex WRN
What happens when you join #UKWomensMarch because you are worried about #VAWG and then you raise concerns that violent torturer Sarah Jane Baker is a speaker at the London march? One of our members was thrown out of the #UKWomensMarch for doing just that. https://x.com/WRNEastSussex/status/1879634795086672173

and

Women's Rights Network - WRN
Following reports from a number of our members, we are very concerned about the real aims of the so called UK Women’s March taking place in cities around the UK on January 18th. A march that purports to be about women, and to be raising concerns regarding violence against women, is welcoming into its midst a convicted violent criminal, whose hostility and threats towards the women who call him out is well known. We are also concerned that any women who raise their concerns are instantly removed and made unwelcome.
https://x.com/WomensRightsNet/status/1879831474616115593

I know not everyone is on twitter, so wont see comments.

But thought this so extraordinary that it was worth at least a thread title in the hope the media will pick up on it. And alert others who haven't seen this.

There is also discussion on the FWR thread mentioned above. https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5228413-the-womens-march-thats-all-about-the-men

If anyone wants to let them know your reation to this

Contact email for organising group: [email protected]

• Website: https://ukwomensmarch.co.uk/

• Facebook private group https://www.facebook.com/groups/1073715297406848/events main organising there

• Instagram https://www.instagram.com/ukwomensmarch/

• TikTok https://www.tiktok.com/@ukwomensmarch

That is absolute fucking lunacy.

Has it been confirmed that he is a speaker?

Well I dont know personally but cant believe that WRN would lie.

Also if you join the existing thread it is being discussed there.

This what happens when "feminists" only know what it is because of what men have told them what it is.

Not sure why as their statement is a bit obscure but WI are pulling out
https://www.thewi.org.uk/campaigns/news-and-events/statement-uk-womens-marches-18-january

But many left wing groups are supporting / publicising, as opposed to the other, lets re-invent the wheel Million Women March in February, which is getting a lot of right wing support / publicity.

I started that thread. You popped along quite early to say "I am not even sure why anyone bothers to give them attention"

Anyway, the London march has announced speakers on X and Instagram. They haven't announced Baker. I'm not saying he definitely isn't speaking, I just haven't seen that announced.

Personally, I think the fact his attendance was seen as less of a problem than women calling for single-sex spaces on signs is bad enough. And that's before we even get to chat messages being deleted and people being kicked out of chats for highlighting his attendance to other women.

Women's Resource Centre are promoting it https://www.wrc.org.uk/blog/promote-our-petition-at-the-uk-womens-marches-2025

Or exploiting it to get name recognition?

I think it’s definitely worth anyone on X pushing back against these organisations, and possibly some of the confirmed speakers, to see whether the London march organisers will either confirm or deny SJB’s status. Either would potentially have interesting responses.

As I said when your thread first started, why is anyone surprised.

To spend ages going on about how strange it it they have these ideas just seems pointless. We know that most women's groups who claim to be feminist think this, even RCCs.

But as I explained, assuming WRN isn't lying, I just thought there are far wider implications in this specific case.

Maybe its time there was a discussion on FWR about why those women who are motivated to be IRL activists (as opposed to just typing at a keyboard) are always TWAW.

And presumably why so many left wing groups and MSM are promoting it.

Unless and until more groups, such as WRN and others, who are gender critical, events like this will always be inclusive.

So that it the issue. Not that a TWAW event is taking place.

How do you think women who are gender critical can organise and get the same level of support from other women as this group has been getting.

If we cant offer and alternative and are only able to say you are wrong,

Well I’m a WRN member who tries to be as active IRL as I can. I guess others could do the same.

Leeds Women's Aid joining Leeds march

Women for Refugee Women will have a speaker at London march

It’s probably worth noting though that a lot of the women most informed and angry about trans ideology, grassroots women’s rights etc often have the kind of caring and other responsibilities that make IRL activism difficult

I wasn't meaning it to be personal.

But I think it is an issue.

Having the ability to discuss on FWR the problem of being overwhelmed by the TWAW agenda is obviously not only needed but of huge benefit to those who feel silenced by it.

But sadly as a whole FWR is one small voice.

the other, lets re-invent the wheel Million Women March in February, which is getting a lot of right wing support / publicity.

That one is a march by women, but not for women. They've said it's about protecting children (not sure if they've said from what).

Million Women Rise in March is, I think, the one that's both by and for women.

True, but in the past few years we've had groups like FiLiA organise its massive annual conference, Woman's Place UK hold huge public meetings, the various ReSisters groups engaging in different public activities, not to mention the dogged work of the WRN groups and the many outdoor Let Women Speak events. You can hardly accuse gender-critical women of sitting back and just mouthing off online.

I agree. @IwantToRetire suggested that those who are activists IRL tend to be TWAW rather than GC. I was trying to explore why for some women going to events can be challenging. I’d include many accomplished older women in this who frequently have demanding careers that limit time they have available. And that’s before we acknowledge the extra risk for women in some sectors

My experience is that many women reconcile these different priorities by engaging in activism that may just be “typing on a keyboard “ but has real value. Put simply we make FoI requests, while they make TikToks

Id also be wary of assuming that a large social media presence (and actually even a march) equates to success. I’m reminded very much of the bewildered Momentum members after the 2019 election, who couldn’t understand why Labour lost when “we had loads of people at Jeremy’s rallies and millions of views on YouTube”. The graft that GC women are engaged in is probably more likely to reap rewards than a pretty Insta.

For personal reasons (time limiting) and what seems complete failure of MN notification services, not always up to date with thread.

I am not saying there are no GC activism. I am saying turning up to an event organised by a small group for an audience is not the same as being active locally or whatever. ie every town and city needs a GC group monitoring local finances etc..

But the main point I am making, is that like it or not, when it comes to a popularity contest GC feminists do not come out very high.

ie if a group on facebook anounced if was organising a women's sex based rights march on facebook, how many would respond positively, now many would spontaneously arrange a similar march locally.

I suspect hardly anyone at all.

Despite legal and some sporting events victories, and acknowledgement by some politicians in a grudging way that GC views should be respected, in the general public there is no traction.

And galling as it is to see that something that is so anti women's sex based rights getting grass roots support, this is a reflection of a reality.

So basically I am saying, nobody likes us!

As individuals we might not care, but in terms of getting people to listen, let alone support women's sex based rights, it creates an obstacle to regaining rights that as women we used to automatically assume we had.

From UKWM

When we shared our statement, objectives and vision for UK Women’s March, we naïvely assumed it would be enough to convey the purpose and values of this movement.

However, in recent days, we have observed that, despite our commitment to inclusivity and intersectionality, individuals who do not share these values are fostering an increasingly hostile environment.
This group is a private, inclusive, and intersectional space that does not tolerate transphobia, racism, hate speech, or any behaviour that undermines our commitment to equality and respect.

While we acknowledge that gender-critical views have been recognised as a protected philosophical belief under UK case law (Forstater v CGD Europe), this is not a space for expressing views that invalidate or harm trans identities or conflict with the lived experiences of marginalised groups.

Our rules are clearly outlined, and all members are expected to adhere to them. If someone’s behaviour or comments conflict with these principles, we reserve the right to remove them to maintain the safety and inclusivity of this space.

Thank you to everyone who continues to uphold this group as a safe and respectful space for all members.

Central Team UKWM

ie they might recognise that gender critical views are a protected belief in law, but they can ignore it because trans rights have a higher value.

if a group on facebook anounced if was organising a women's sex based rights march on facebook, how many would respond positively

We don't know how many of those responding to the call from Women's March joined thinking it was for the rights of actual women. The Million Women march isn't specifically GC, but it is women only. I think Million Women Rising is properly for women's rights.

A bit off topic - well at least related.

If the msm is to believed the US Women's March that the UK one is in sympathy with has apparently been renamed the People's March.

The Women's March this year has been rebranded as the People's March, co-hosted with a number of other progressive organisations including Planned Parenthood, National Women's Law Center and Sierra Club.
Tamika Middleton, the managing director of the Women's March, said Saturday's march was focused on building a coalition, adding that those in the progressive movement needed to come together like they did in 2017.
"We're seeing attacks on women, on reproductive rights, on LGBTQ folks… and we're realising that we really have to build some coordination across the movement to build the kind of mass movement that can fight back," she said.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2pv70921yo

In the years after 2017, the Women’s March fractured internally as the group faced allegations of racism and antisemitism. It also came under scrutiny for being more focused on the voices of straight white women over women of color and the LGBTQ+ community, a rift that caused sponsors to pull support and leadership to shift.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/rebranded-womens-march-returns-trumps-170731556.html

I think that is partly the point I am making.

If more women "liked" the politics of FWR / respected sex based rights, then anouncing a Women's March would have automatically have been assumed to be women only, or have had a clarification as to whether or not it was trans inclusive.

ie in most public discussions women only is now assumed to be trans inclusive.

In the instance of these 2 new pop up marches, it wasn't something mentioned in either introductory statement / intent.

Meanwhile the assumption is that tomorrow's march is in fact the SWP in disguise, and the February one a Reform initiative!

Maybe we should have an experiment on facebook.

Find a catchy name for a facebook group (Million Women Marching or something?), but in an introductory statement make clear it is a march about sex based rights, and see how many women not only join, but want to plan a local march.

And in the private group discussion just eject those who say it should be trans inclusive, and say the march is about the protected rights of biological woman as allowed under the law.

How soon before it would be in the mainstream that anti trans women are being discriminatory?

Trans speaker with violent past dropped by anti-Trump women’s march

Organisers of a women’s rights march have been forced to drop a transgender speaker after being “made aware” of a violent past.

The co-ordinators of the UK Women’s March (UKWM) caused outrage by asking Sarah Jane Baker, a convicted criminal, to address crowds on Saturday in London.

The organisers had encouraged “anyone who is an ally of women and believes in women’s rights” to march with them in the fight for gender equality – and the event was set to have Baker as a speaker.

However, they have now said that Baker will not be given a platform.

article continues at https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/01/18/trans-speaker-violent-past-dropped-anti-trump-womens-march/

But also can be read in full at https://archive.is/ZHne0

The presence, or even suggested presence, of violent men like Baker would be offputting to me in terms of joining a march. He's actually tried to encourage other people to 'punch terfs'.

So this might be why GC women don't go to these marches? He's not the only one, after all. We all know that.

The woman who started the UK Women's March on facebook has left the groups because of conflicts.

She said she hadn't realised there were differing ideas as to what is or is not feminist.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1073715297406848/posts/1123372169107827/

The facebook group is suspended until 6 February.

Its a shame really because even if everyone has different versions of feminism it was her insistance that her view as to what was the right sort of feminism that created the tensions.

Instead of allowing local groups to work out for themselves what they wanted to do. Which I think many did.

But maybe some of the local groups will keep going without having to be beholden to a some sort of central control.

@BackToLurk
I couldn't post this on your own thread as it was full so thought I'd post it here.
Seems things have changed as a result of whatever happened at the Leeds March (anyone know what did happen as I've not found anything yet...) Just wanted to keep you updated so you could check it out!

Edit: typo

Do you have photos of each of the individual shots or a link to the post as I can't read the pictures, thanks