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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Gender neutral language in pregnancy care

203 replies

QuirkyJadeSwan · 10/10/2024 02:49

So I’m currently pregnant with my first and have been kind of low key annoyed with how common discussions around pregnancy and related topics remove to term woman or female (I.e birthing people). I started getting bugged by this during my trying to conceive phase and now it bugs me even more. I know it’s kind of a minor thing in the grand scheme of things but I needed to vent. Seriously going through TTC & pregnancy has made me about 10x more aware of how different physically women are.

OP posts:
Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:27

Lady1ntheLake · 10/10/2024 09:42

Pregnant person here. I’m very happy for that language to be used. It’s clear, direct, and factual, and in no way confusing or alienating. Claiming otherwise, in service of a political point, feels disingenuous.

Perhaps you don't think of yourself as a mother - perhaps you think of yourself as a 'birthing parent'. But I suggest many more women do think of themselves in terms of being women and mothers, especially at such a time when the female body is paramount.

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:29

Lady1ntheLake · 10/10/2024 10:10

How are you being asked to accommodate anyone? You’re free to call yourself whatever you like. You just don’t get to object when others refer to you as a person—unless you identify as something other than human?

Are you going to be the 'birther' to your child, or will you be the mother. Please don't tell me you are going to have your child call you Daddy? You know it really is not just about you.

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:32

Lady1ntheLake · 10/10/2024 10:40

The mother infant dyad concept is offensive to all manner of non traditional families.

How ludicrous is that.....offensive......

The mother child -dyad is one of the central foundations of life on earth - regardless of species.

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:35

Lady1ntheLake · 10/10/2024 10:53

Actually a lot of sources do use the term "people with penises" because some women and non binary people have penises.

No they don't. Women are adult human females the world over, and they do not have male sexual organs.

i hope you are not going to enforce this idea on your child. It will make them very confused, and to do that intentionally would be exceptionally bad parenting.

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:36

Lady1ntheLake · 10/10/2024 10:59

Yes, and the earth is flat.

No the earth is a globe, and women are female. Basic stuff!

LittleshopofTriffids · 11/10/2024 11:38

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:32

How ludicrous is that.....offensive......

The mother child -dyad is one of the central foundations of life on earth - regardless of species.

I think it’s pretty important for humans but I wouldn’t go as far as to say ´regardless of species’. It’s more of a mammalian thing. Sea turtles don’t care for their young like cats do for example.

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:41

Lady1ntheLake · 10/10/2024 12:14

It absolutely is protected, but that won’t stop a small company from trying to circumvent the law, and we can’t afford a protracted legal battle.

Maternity discrimination is illegal but still happens all the time.

Perhaps if you stopped thinking of it as maternity discrimination it wouldn't happen. After all only women can be mothers.

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:44

DadJoke · 10/10/2024 16:42

The term "pregnant patient" has been used for decades with no issues - would anyone have a problem with that?

Pregnancy is not an illness, it is a natural event.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 11/10/2024 11:46

This is an incredibly middle class anglocentric white privilege take.

I guess that's because that's an accurate description of the vast majority of trans rights activists and their supporters.

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:48

LittleshopofTriffids · 11/10/2024 11:38

I think it’s pretty important for humans but I wouldn’t go as far as to say ´regardless of species’. It’s more of a mammalian thing. Sea turtles don’t care for their young like cats do for example.

Yet I'm pretty sure female sea turtles exhibits behaviours that are particular to gestation and birthing - regardless of what happens afterwards.

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:49

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:48

Yet I'm pretty sure female sea turtles exhibits behaviours that are particular to gestation and birthing - regardless of what happens afterwards.

Using her back flippers, the reptile digs a nest in the sand. Digging the nest and laying her eggs usually takes from one to three hours, after which the mother turtle slowly drags herself back to the ocean. The sea turtle lays up to 100 eggs, which incubate in the warm sand for about 60 days.

Everlore · 11/10/2024 11:50

When I went for my first midwife appointment, the midwife asked me for my gender identification, she then asked if I was assigned female at birth.
I didn't pick her up on this at the time, because I know she was probably obliged to ask this. However, I did later say to my husband that it seemed like a ridiculous question to ask since, if I had been born a male, I'd be a medical marvel since I'm pretty sure that anyone born male can't get pregnant. I am, however, not sure that everyone is aware of this biological fact, given some of the ridiculous assertions I've heard people who should know better make about the biological distinctions between men and women. Isn't it David Lammy who thinks that transwomen can grow cervixes? If supposedly intelligent and well-informed people can be so ignorant of basic biology then I would be unsurprised to learn that some people might believe that people born biologically male could get pregnant given the right surgery and hormones.

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:52

"But, no matter how bewildering it might sound, reptiles do invest in their young. Active instances of maternal care are observed among over 1000 of species, a roughly one-tenth of total diversity. Some do with high dedication, especially crocodiles.

The fierce and protective maternal instinct in different species is at least equal to, and in some cases maybe even stronger than ours. Biologically programmed to preserve their species by protecting and caring for their young, some species go to incredible lengths to do so…"

LittleshopofTriffids · 11/10/2024 12:10

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:48

Yet I'm pretty sure female sea turtles exhibits behaviours that are particular to gestation and birthing - regardless of what happens afterwards.

Of course, but I was responding to a post about the mother-infant dyad concept, which is really quite different depending on species. Not on sexual dimorphism and female sexual reproductive systems in general.

LittleshopofTriffids · 11/10/2024 12:11

Shortshriftandlethal · 11/10/2024 11:52

"But, no matter how bewildering it might sound, reptiles do invest in their young. Active instances of maternal care are observed among over 1000 of species, a roughly one-tenth of total diversity. Some do with high dedication, especially crocodiles.

The fierce and protective maternal instinct in different species is at least equal to, and in some cases maybe even stronger than ours. Biologically programmed to preserve their species by protecting and caring for their young, some species go to incredible lengths to do so…"

Edited

This is interesting. I had heard that some crocodiles carry their young on their backs.

GiveMeSpanakopita · 11/10/2024 12:19

LittleshopofTriffids · 11/10/2024 11:38

I think it’s pretty important for humans but I wouldn’t go as far as to say ´regardless of species’. It’s more of a mammalian thing. Sea turtles don’t care for their young like cats do for example.

Yeah, marine creatures really aren't much like humans are they. And yet TRAs will try to persuade us that humans can change sex based on the fact that they (mistakenly) believe seahorses can...

HaveYouActuallyDoneAnyWashingThisWeekMum · 11/10/2024 12:38

DadJoke · 10/10/2024 16:42

The term "pregnant patient" has been used for decades with no issues - would anyone have a problem with that?

Has it? I’ve never heard this and I have been pregnant three times, the first time being around 25 years ago.

Maray1967 · 11/10/2024 12:44

Lady1ntheLake · 10/10/2024 09:42

Pregnant person here. I’m very happy for that language to be used. It’s clear, direct, and factual, and in no way confusing or alienating. Claiming otherwise, in service of a political point, feels disingenuous.

I think many of us have a very different view. Removing the words ‘woman’ and ‘mother’ from pregnancy care is outrageous sad insidious. If I’d had a blue folder with ‘pregnant person’ all over it, I would have spent a few minutes with a sharpie correcting the language.

Maray1967 · 11/10/2024 12:47

HaveYouActuallyDoneAnyWashingThisWeekMum · 11/10/2024 12:38

Has it? I’ve never heard this and I have been pregnant three times, the first time being around 25 years ago.

I was never referred to as a pregnant patient 24 and 16 years ago. I was a pregnant woman- the only type of person who can be pregnant.

california22 · 11/10/2024 12:50

This was the self referral that I did this morning. A clear change from two years ago...

Gender neutral language in pregnancy care
MrsOvertonsWindow · 11/10/2024 15:00

Maray1967 · 11/10/2024 12:47

I was never referred to as a pregnant patient 24 and 16 years ago. I was a pregnant woman- the only type of person who can be pregnant.

It's absolute nonsense that women used to be called "pregnant patients" - as women who were pregnant before them male dominated erasure of women's language occurred. It's untrue.
And typical that it's a man who decides to lecture women from his position of never having been a pregnant woman. 🙄

SiobhanSharpe · 11/10/2024 15:09

Yep, also never called a pregnant patient over 30 years ago now.
However I was called an 'elderly primigravida'.😒
I suppose it does denote a female person.
(I think they've dropped that now. Not before time. )

frazzled1 · 11/10/2024 15:11

When I went for my first midwife appointment, the midwife asked me for my gender identification, she then asked if I was assigned female at birth.

How ridiculous. I'd be temped to say my sex was determined at conception, just like this baby I'm carrying. Big smile.

LeavesOnTrees · 11/10/2024 15:12

Lady1ntheLake · 10/10/2024 10:53

Actually a lot of sources do use the term "people with penises" because some women and non binary people have penises.

I know this is a serious discussion and we should all be serious about it.
But this did make me laugh.

Women don't have penises. It's impossible to change sex.

HaveYouActuallyDoneAnyWashingThisWeekMum · 11/10/2024 15:22

MrsOvertonsWindow · 11/10/2024 15:00

It's absolute nonsense that women used to be called "pregnant patients" - as women who were pregnant before them male dominated erasure of women's language occurred. It's untrue.
And typical that it's a man who decides to lecture women from his position of never having been a pregnant woman. 🙄

Woah, Mrs Overton, let’s not make assumptions about the sex of the poster named @DadJoke 🙄

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