How do you support other siblings when a teen decides they are trans

[Autumnleavesareslippery]

I've name changed for this, have been a member for 19 years since pregnant with DS. I'm going to try and be factual as I'm in shock and dealing with a whole host of mine and my children's emotions. Yes I'm using 'he' here as none of us have got our heads around this. I'm trying to be very honest in how I feel and really need some support from people who have more of an idea about how to handle this than me.

DS (19) came home from uni on Friday. On Friday night at about 11 pm in the family chat he declared he was transgender. He informed us what he was called. It was an unusual name choice for a 19 year old - that of someone perhaps born 150 years ago. Think Enid. He told us he'd known for years.

All of us were in shock. I have DD (17) and DD and DS (both 14). I sent a message privately to him thanking for letting us know as I wasn't quite sure what else to say. He didn't read it and remained in his room. Didn't even bother with the usual teen response of a thumbs up.

Saturday and Sunday he acted completely normally, like nothing major had happened and he had told us he was vegetarian now or something. He seemed calm and relaxed. He looked exactly the same - a 6ft 2 broad shouldered man.

He then came downstairs to get a lift to the train station dressed as what I can only describe as a stereotype of what someone might think a woman looked like. Badly done make up. An odd dress that didn't fit. And started talking in a completely different soft 'feminine' voice and doing strange things with his hands that he must have deemed 'female'. He had lace like gloves on. It looked so outdated and strange.

The best way to describe it was he looked like Dame Edna or the character out of little Britain from 20 years ago in that the clothing was odd and it seemed almost designed to get a reaction. But he appeared to be deadly serious and nonchalant about it. A woman would have been clearly mocked if she dressed like it. It just leaves me wondering whether this is what he views women as?! Not that he knows any women who would act like this - he's surrounded by many women who express themselves in multiple ways but not in an Edwardian lady about to collapse way.

I drove him to the station trying to make small talk about the weather and his course and came back to everyone sat staring in disbelief. He's never said anything, acted in any way 'feminine' (whatever that means). He's at a RG uni, studying a science subject with 3 As at A level, and has organised himself a part time job. I only say this because life seems to be going well for him, rather than a potential response to something.

He is however autistic.

DD 17 is furious and says he's making a mockery of women and that woman is not a costume. She says he better not be going in female only spaces.

DD 15 looks stunned and keeps asking why he thinks he can just become a woman and what he thinks that means. She can't identify out of periods etc etc. DS 15 is laughing in disbelief. DH just looks completely confused and keeps muttering about getting loads of tattoos when he wanted to shock his parents thirty five years ago.

I genuinely don't know what to do next. Please bear in mind I'm in shock, had only just 'got over' my first born leaving for uni and all the emotions that brings.

I want to support DS19 with whatever gender expression he wants. When he still looked like him (and didn't appear to be 'dressed as' a mockery of women) I was shocked but we just thought ok, this is him experimenting with finding himself or whatever. But now I'm really worried about him and his future and whether others will look at him and think wtf. I'm also angry at the very (sorry to stereotype) 'teen boy' way he told us - late at night, no response, informing us what he was called rather than perhaps asking 'could you call me'. No consideration of the impact but I guess that might just be being 19.

I agree with what both of my daughters are saying. How do I say this because it then directly criticises DS? Do I accept he is an adult, has made his choices and my care and focus should be on them? I can't gaslight them and tell them they're wrong.

I'm now worried he's going to go into female spaces, as a clearly visible six foot plus male. This would make me angry.

He is at a university where I know lots of his lecturers (I am an academic in the same field). I know many are gender critical. Do I mention it to them first or let it be the elephant in the room?

I don't know what to say to my 85 year old mother. I think she will be very shocked and worried. I'm trying to work out if we have to tell her (she doesn't live nearby).

I don't know how much to talk to him or challenge this. I feel a kind of grief. I'm worried he's going to take hormones or do something irreversible.

We all dislike the name / think it's a very odd choice - which makes me feel very alienated from him.

And at the end of the day he's my 'baby' - I want him to be happy. I don't want people to criticise him. I want to support him but how do you do that when you question so much what he is doing? It wasn't the fact he declared himself to have a different gender but rather what followed - the declaration of name, strange clothing and fear of him going in women's spaces.

I also do absolutely realise he is an adult and can make his own choices and face the consequences. He has his own life (albeit he's being financially supported by us).

I guess it was just so sudden.

Any advice on what to do next would be gladly received.

Yes, I too distrust the ND movement, the framing of a developmental disorder as an 'identity'. It is damaging in all the ways that you imply, and I can also see in other threads currently active on MN, how it is blinding people who are unaffected by autism to the real and severe disability associated with this condition.

@ExtremelyPrivate I think I am there too. Had a discussion on another thread where someone was saying you should not say ‘those with autism’ but ‘autistic’ because… ‘identity first, innit’.

I pushed back (okay, took umbrage) because as a family - with at least 6 diagnosed ASD/ADHD people across two generations - we don’t call ourselves ‘autistic’ first. We reject the ‘label’ as labels tend to be definitive, limiting and exclusive. Obviously, we accept we are ND people, but our divergence is multi faceted (ASD, ADHD, dyslexia, dyspraxia etc) and varied between us, and is as varied and complex as every aspect that comprises our ‘whole’ selves.

Autism is a part of us, a lens through which we experience the world. It is at times a constrictive and delimiting, but at others it is at the source of our creativity and compassion. I and my kids hate the label and won’t say ‘hey, I’m autistic’ as our first introduction to ourselves unless it is essential or salient to something specific.

I was told that I and my family are in the minority, though. 🤷🏻‍♀️

You aren't allowed to differ and everyone has to defer to the noisiest most vocal disruptor because me me me. And if you don't defer to the identity then it's punishable by shaming.

The level of outright abuse this carries is awful. There is no space allowed for other opinions, experiences or feelings.

That isn't helped by social media generally and echo chambers.

Frankly I can't think of more boring people than those who are so self righteous about stuff like this. And half of them are doing as 'allies' whilst talking over people directly affected.

I am so DONE with identity politics as a force it's untrue. It's so open to abuse and the shutting down of any sane conversations.

This is all very interesting.

My belief (not very controversial) is that being autistic makes kids more vulnerable to the exploiters online trying to 'sell' trans ideology because they already don't fit in/feel there's always been something wrong with them, i.e that there's a positive correlation but it's not causal.

But now I'm wondering if they tell kids that present as vulnerable that if they get an autism diagnosis it will 'prove' that they 'are' trans, i.e. that the link is causal and it's their destiny to transition.

My son first said he had gender dysphoria and was considering a gender 'reassignment' (hate that term) at 17. Then he asked for an autism assessment. Once he had the autism diagnosis, the narcissism started - the expectation that everything would now revolve around him and his needs - "because of my Asperger's" (not a term we or the clinicians used really, so perhaps also encouraged by someone online). (Do they tend to talk about Asperger's still in the US?) And also just the out-and-out unpleasantness. It's not who he used to be, so would not be classic NPD imo, but, like the other stuff, I'm wondering now if he's been given a script.

He's a proper little dictator now. One of respects in which I feel most terrible about the estrangement is that it's actually been a relief. 🙁

This! This is basically the whole argument in a nutshell. You can't force the rest of the world to engage in your fantasy.

I might give it a try myself. Identify as the sole UK lottery winner and anyone who says I shouldn't be paid is being wealthphobic and needs to be kinder! I've always known I should be rich. I could end up suicidal from your insistence on acknowledging reality! Whaddaya mean I have to buy a ticket? Don't you know I'm special!!!

My DC was diagnosed young with an ASC and is very aware that trans is associated with ASC. DC's response is that it's disablist and transphobic to say that if you are autistic then you aren't really trans.

DC being older and already living away from home made it easier. I feel less responsible and we're not in each others faces all the time so it's easier to get along. We were visiting DC when DC told us, we weren't staying with DC so we had more space to process.

Sympathies to everyone who is wrestling with this. Hope you are OK OP.

This is the line the TRAs take on Twix etc… but I always push back that they are being ableist (disableist?) because of the 6+ ASC’s in my family, only one identified as trans/queer!

Your DC is misrepresenting the actual argument, which is that autism can cause body dysmorphia that can be mistaken for gender dysphoria and it's really important for clinicians to differentiate between the two.

I really feel your pain on this. I'm over it all. I blame America for this - outrageously unfair I know- but as the old saying goes, America sneezes and then Europe catches flu. I feel like America's 'newness' means everyone is desperately seeking identity and now we are catching the obsession - but it doesn't belong to us. It's not ours to obsess over. Fast social change and increased cultural diversity here is probably adding to this desperate questionning of 'who / what we are'.

I know you did qualify your statement as outrageously unfair, but legally speaking the wave of gender identity politics via recognition of self-ID started elsewhere, namely in countries in South America (Argentina became the first country to pass self-ID laws in 2012, and the neighboring countries followed suit, all before 2020) and Oceania.

Multiple European countries, including Belgium, Ireland, Portugal, Denmark and Norway (by a Conservative government to boot), all legally adopted self-ID in mid- to late-2010s, before the US did in 2021.

The current iteration of the transgender rights movement in the form of gender identity politics is not something that can be simply attributed to the US.

That's news to me and I'm happy to stand corrected!

Maybe I'm influenced by some of the loudest social media voices being American 🤔 Also by the fact that I've recently finished working with a group of American trainers who shoe-horned identity politics into EVERYTHING.

But yes, I acknowledge it was a childish over-simplification!

I'm afraid I think that there are powerful patriarchal interests that are supranational, and have a finger in everyone's legislative pie.