In Australia - Moira Deeming defamation trial now on

[TheSandgroper]

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-09-17/moira-deeming-john-pesutto-defamation-trial-day-two/104360100

This is from our very TRA ABC. Please note the comment from “Mr Southwick, a Jewish MP re Angie Jones’ tweet”. Well, Angie Jones is as Jewish as they come but they don’t say that.

Also, for, those who don’t know, see Angie on m.youtube.com/@TERFTalkDownUnder, though she hasn’t posted for a while. Some really good interviews.

Do you consider then that the Liberal Party and the National Party are extreme politically?

@Helleofabore

And I don’t speak for Australia’s indigenous people at all. I also don’t call their activists ‘bonkers’.

I recognise they are human, and that extends to their behaviour. Mundine only seems to have gone somewhat off course in the last couple of years, really. It is unusual for a First Nations man to hold the opinions he does, and I think that's where people feel the dissonance.

Well, that's just bizarre.

@Helleofabore

Do you consider then that the Liberal Party and the National Party are extreme politically?

Neither are, but some factions within them can be described as more conservative. However, the quote was about CPAC, and that has a broader representation.

I feel this may be somewhat preemptive because of how the trial is going. Building a narrative to deploy later.

“It is unusual for a First Nations man to hold the opinions he does, and I think that's where people feel the dissonance.”

According to you.

And yet, there are First Nations people who hold a wide range of opinions. And you have just generalised about First Nations people.

Remarkable.

Oh, I see the "we don't report, just leave things to stand" turned out to be incorrect.
I'll keep my observations about common argumentative tactics to myself then.

Ok.

So now that you have stated this, do you think that the things you have accused Moira Deeming of believing are outside the membership of the Liberal Party and that she was going to be expelled because of her views on abortion, COVID vaccines, and the energy crisis? (Did I miss any that you stated?)

😁
It could have been anyone who reported your posts. Perhaps it was MessinaBloom?

There are often lurkers who report stuff.

This is interesting about the broader landscape of Victorian politics and how Deeming came to be in the party (and the influence of Abbott/Credlin). You can read the link by clicking then going into airplane mode.

https://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au/news/politics/2024/09/21/abbott-was-his-neck-it-the-collapse-the-victorian-liberals

The model of fundamentalist Christian movements becoming mainstream by joining more right wing political parties. Aligning government/principles more with Christianity is exactly what CPAC is pushing for.

I'm secular and have no desire to see more influence of any religion in government so this bothers me.

The lurkers seem to have left a lot alone.
Given usually the "thread monitors" are thought to be TRAs, it's interesting. No matter though, although I try very hard to stick to the principle of "using the same courtesy when posting messages on Talk as you would use when speaking to someone face to face" sometimes I can be a bit rude under provocation.

Just interested in the double standards really.

Just to go back to this. Sall Grover needs funding for her court case, the people at the conference are exactly the sort of people who are likely to donate. So I can understand why she's there.

Liz Truss and KJK, not so much

You don't know who reported you or why, so you can't tell whether double standards were in play.
And if it was a lurker, they cannot have posted that your posts should stand -otherwise they would be a previous poster, not a lurker.

I don’t think the lurkers are thinking what Cassie thinks they are thinking……..well defo not me

Actually if you read the article I linked it appears that the issue with her maiden speech was more than that.

In her first speech after being elected in November 2022, she condemned left-wing school curriculums and the decriminalisation of sex work.

These are also controversial opinions, regardless of your own perspective. Try starting a thread on here (any board) about the Nordic Model and you will see that it's a controversial topic.

And yet, KJK will no doubt sit on the same panel as Sal Grover and Rachel Wong.

Do you think that these women are there just to get their messages out about what is happening?

Or do you feel they are now guilty by association of speaking at CPAC Australia? The conference of the Liberal and National Parties of Australia, of which neither are ‘extreme’ politically as agreed by other posters.

The ‘left wing’ schools curriculum refers to the Safe Schools programme. I believe that Eresh posted an example of role playing that was part of that curriculum where the role playing involved acting out sexual abuse and discussing it.

Do you think that it is appropriate for child sexual assault, rape and abuse survivors to be exposed to this in their curriculum? Did you look further at what the ‘left wing’ curriculum was referring to?

Controversial is doing a lot of heavy lifting here

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/feb/23/victorian-liberals-have-no-plans-to-change-abortion-laws-despite-mps-claims-leader-says

This is an account of what happened after that speech. It's a bit more complex than "people hate her because she's GC".

Note also the quote from Pesutto which is very clear on his position:

Pesutto said he had spoken to Deeming about “working as a team”.

“I’ve had some good discussions with her today and I think she understands the importance of us working as a team, and I look forward to having further discussions in the future,” he said.

My personal opinion is irrelevant as to whether her maiden speech was controversial. It demonstrably was, for more than just her GC position.

Try to stick to one line of debate, it'll be easier for everyone to follow.

Or maybe "I feel" a completely different way than the false dichotomy options that you've decided I must hold.

I'm not interested in your approach to this, as I keep saying.

@Helleofabore

So now that you have stated this, do you think that the things you have accused Moira Deeming of believing are outside the membership of the Liberal Party and that she was going to be expelled because of her views on abortion, COVID vaccines, and the energy crisis? (Did I miss any that you stated?)

I've already stated what she was being expelled for, and that's on the record. It's not my opinion. Is that what you're asking or do you want to reframe your question/s?

@Snowypeaks

It could have been anyone who reported your posts. Perhaps it was MessinaBloom?

So, you, then.

GC women are not allowed to use the same tools you use? That would definitely be a double standard. Maybe it's time to level the playing field.

What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander, as they say.