Thread 2: TWO “Female Boxers” Set To Compete At Paris 2024 Were Previously Disqualified From Women’s World Championship For Having “XY Chromosomes”

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A second thread for those who wish to continue the discussion.

Thread 1 can be found here...

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5129412-two-female-boxers-set-to-compete-at-paris-2024-were-previously-disqualified-from-womens-world-championship-for-having-xy-chromosomes?page=1

I was v brave and posted about this on my Facebook page.

Lots of likes, but comments from people telling me imane is a biological female.

I posted proof from the IBA that she has tested as a male and was told we should have less judgement, be kind, and it's not good for Imane mental health.

Toxic empathy. Feeling so much love and kindness for a man with no penis that you would sanction allowing them to punch a woman in the face.

I'm so sick of people telling women to be kind.

Extraordinary, isn't it. Women are, quite genuinely, expected to fucking roll over. That's their purpose.

Well, I have just found Tandora's 'Feminists against sex segregation in sports' thread in AIBU. 🙄

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5134116-feminists-against-sex-segregation-in-sports?page=1

I wouldn't spend too long reading it.

so both of the 'controversial' boxers are now guaranteed a medal. What a sad day for women's sport.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/olympics/articles/c0w44q1nlw2o

I was just watching the fight between Lin and "her" opponent. The commentators' repeatedly referenced her advantage due to her height and longer arms. I wonder why that is. I feel so bad for the women trying to fight who can't get close.

You are right, it's the same old drivel.

Yeah, I've found it fucking despairing. I was awake in the early hours and I could feel my brain almost on fire with how wound up I was getting. I can not believe the amount of people I know who are spreading horrible misinformation about this shit. Someone I know posted the disgusting meme, categorising this is as 'white woman's tears.' Tbf, it was posted by the most deranged handmaiden I know but this a woman who considers herself an under-feminist, mocking a crying woman who has just been punched twice in the face by a man, losing everything she has worked for and having a likely broken nose, because she cried.

I don't actually know what I'd do if it wasn't for mumsnet and a twitter that no longer bans anyone who talks about this factually. I've deactivated my facebook account for a while and removed the app from my phone. I'll crack up otherwise.

@alittleprivacy
I feel exactly the same but a part of me is hopeful that this might be the moment where identity politics are exposed as a massive fraud. Stay strong women!

The IOC has declared words are effectively meaningless and nobody owns definitions so…

All these countries that are fielding female boxers who are losing out due to the IOC allowing cheating - do we think they will put in complaints and keep the pressure up? I think Hungary has already complained.

I know Khelif is next scheduled to fight a female boxer from Thailand. Who is Lin Yu Ting down to fight next?

Could you point out it’s not very good for their opponents’ mental or physical health?

Esra Yildiz Kahraman of Turkey. Wednesday at 20:30 (unsure whether that’s French or UK time)

Thank you!

According to the BBC article, the IBA are going to hold a press conference on Monday to outline the reasons why Lin Yu Ting and Khelif were disqualified. It will be interesting to see the IOC squirm. This isn't going to go away, despite how much they want to brush it under the carpet. On the contrary, I think it is going to blow the whole issue open and a lot more people are going to become aware of what has been happening in women's sports. And then the media might actually have to report on it property.

I absolutely sympathise. I generally don’t talk about this in real life so MN is a lifeline. I was so gutted to see a friend had shared a scolding post full of misinformation on social media. I had to stop myself from interacting as I knew it wouldn’t end well. Generally I assume most people are either quietly GC or live and let live but don’t think deeply about these issues (I was like that before I peaked). It was really disappointing to see a friend being a bit more… activist-ish. I can only hope that in time, the rules are tightened up on women’s sport and we are proved right.

Of course, @KeirSpoutsTwaddle

But women with broken noses and shattered Olympic dreams don't matter.

I learnt the phrase toxic empathy through this issue. You feel so much compassion for one person - who may or may not have been complicit, who may have been horribly exploited, who may just be a simple cheat - that you forget the impact on anyone else.

I’m desperately hoping for so red faces in a few days. But not optimistic. Thing is, as I understand it, even if they are shown to be XY men who have undergone male puberty, they are within the rules of the IOC so presumably can’t be removed.

So we’ll have a situation where two people can not enter regulated contests, but still win every Olympics.

Madness.

I really hope the whole athletes with DSD issue is thoroughly aired and plastered all over the media. I’m sick of JKR and others being labelled as queen of the mean and so on. It’s fecking outrageous.

Oh that’s good news, @biddyboo ! I do hope it gets legs and runs across every screen and media outlet in the world.

Bastarding cheats!

My empathy for the men stopped when they carried on competing having been told why they are so successful.

The ski jumping athlete showed so much grace in comparison.

I would hope the IBA conference will clear up a few things, but I suspect reporting on it will be very limited.

We will know what's been said, because we will follow it. It will be reported in the mail, probably, or the times, GBNews, TALKTV, but a lot of my circle would not touch those news sources with a barge pole.

So...... The world will keep turning, people will forget, it will go away - until next time.....

God I hope so. This has gone on for too many years. Even after the Semenya court case which showed clearly the cover up that had been going on the media were still not explaining it to the public and calling him a 'woman with high testosterone'.

I don’t know if this link has already been posted here or on other related threads, but to me it a)explains why some people think Khelif is biologically female; and b) bloody winds me up as that’s not what has been said!:

https://news.sky.com/story/nicola-adams-speaks-out-on-olympic-gender-boxing-row-13189195?dicbo=v2-9ZdA4cH

“Adams, 41, posted her views on X on Friday after Carini withdrew from her fight against Algeria's Imane Khelif, who is a biological woman, just 46 seconds into the bout on Thursday.”

This is why all this AFAB crap is stupid. It’s the stealing of language from people with DSDs but it’s also the confusion as people without DSD are being referred to as AFAB when they’re just actually female. Now we have a case where somebody has a possible DSD and journalists are taking ‘assigned female’ to mean ‘born female’ and thus ‘biological female’.

I am a bit worried by this.

I hope very much that whoever does this press conference has spent the weekend talking to people like Ross Tucker, Emma Hilton, Carole Hooven, Tommy Lundberg and the maybe Alison Sydor and Linda Blade.

Otherwise I can see it might go down as poorly as Thomas Bach’s attempt.