Tinkerbell syndrome, pronoun badges and trans existence

[Alltheprettyseahorses]

Inspired by some posts in a now-full thread:

Someone in the workplace who is trans is literally existing as trans in public. Yet we are told that disagreeing with accessories like pronoun badges means we don't want transpeople to exist in public.

So - must trans necessarily involve others and is it so fragile an identity that it will disappear like Tinkerbell if not constantly affirmed by everyone around the transperson? Is not noticing the badge transphobic? As most people, including those with specific protected characteristics and including most transpeople to be honest, don't wear badges announcing their identity, does this mean they don't exist in public?

I would argue the sole purpose of pronoun badges is to involve others in the validation of a specific type of trans identity whether they consent to this or not and even if they don't understand they have been allocated as having a supporting role in someone else's main-character life. But speaking on a personal level, I have my own priorities and interests - I find it an imposition to be subjected to the macroaggression of being expected to change my natural language processes for someone who will never be part of my concerns.

(I don't normally start threads so if I don't come back I'm not shaving my hairy feet, I've probably forgotten or something)

Why is misgendering so important if gender identity is an innate quality completely separate from any external observable characteristics?

You may well ask.

🤔 good question

Yeah, whenever a woman tells me she's non-binary, I can effortlessly understand that I am interacting with an insecure Pick Me.

It's quite handy as it saves me the hour or so of interaction that it would normally take to figure this out.

yeah fifty quid says it never happened

Insecure pickme women are women and I defend their rights to single-sex spaces, same-sex HCPs for intimate examinations, and female-only sports too.

Well you sound lovely

My post was clear. Do you usually think that people who use the word I are talking about you or we or them? Because it isn't true. If I say "I am happy", that is what I mean. What I am not saying is "You are sad".

This mangling of language to make it all about you is odd. If you struggle with even the most basic use of pronouns in speech, that is a you problem.

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

Didn't you say on another thread...........

"Anyone wearing that T-shirt (adult human female) I would perceive as being in the cult of personality and think they were at least a bit of a knob, and at most shared a lot of the kinds of wider views she promotes on twitter around Trump/Islam/moms for liberty/reform "

Bit hypocritical no?

How long will it be before they start insisting everyone in the workplace wear pronoun badges? A guy was sacked from his job in the public sector recently for not declaring his pronouns on his email signature. People are being forced to partake in an ideology that they don’t necessarily agree with. You must either subscribe or at least pretend to subscribe to it. Absolutely ludicrous and sad that people cannot feel free to express their true opinions on the matter.

It isn't a gotcha at all. The poster I addressed the question to brought up the policing of behaviour.

There's nothing wrong with being able to identify Pickmeishas.

Have you got a link for that sacking case? Did he go to tribunal?

My post was clear. Do you usually think that people who use the word I are talking about you or we or them? Because it isn't true. If I say "I am happy", that is what I mean. What I am not saying is "You are sad".

This mangling of language to make it all about you is odd. If you struggle with even the most basic use of pronouns in speech, that is a you problem.

You minimised women's feelings in a dismissive, sneering way. You're extremely transparent. So yes it was clear.

I do know that my sense of womanhood is not so fragile that I fear erasure and annihilation when I see someone wearing an ID badge

Btw I don't have a sense of "womanhood" in anything other than that I am a female human being. I am a woman, and men aren't, whatever pronouns they use, it's as simple as that.

If it's https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/people/council-worker-sacked-over-deliberately-provocative-pronouns-used-on-emails-4709487 then "not using pronouns" is a misrepresentation. He made a political statement in his email footer and, whilst I agree with his view, I don't agree that putting political points on the pronouns field was a professional way to handle it.

I don't think sacking was necessary and he may have had a claim but as far as I know he represented himself.

Your post was indeed clear and you were making a snide implication about other posters.

So was the nasty comment about "struggling with the most basic use of pronouns in speech".

Very clear.

Of course they're women. That's the point.

You said:
I do know that my sense of womanhood is not so fragile that I fear erasure and annihilation when I see someone wearing an ID badge

To me, that clearly implies that you think that women who object to pronoun badges have a fragile "sense of womanhood", and "fear erasure and annihilation" and that is our reason for our objection to them.

Otherwise, why say that at all? Why not just say "I don't have a problem with people wearing pronoun badges"?

This mangling of language to make it all about you is odd. If you struggle with even the most basic use of pronouns in speech, that is a you problem.
I agree, you're of course referring to those who insist they compell and control others speech and creating a distortion of reality in order to make language about them aren't you?

I didn't minimise anything. I clearly posted about me, not anyone else. When I spoke of my womanhood what I meant was my womanhood. You don't have a sense of womanhood, fair enough, some women don't. No men do.🤷‍♀️

Not a nasty or snide comment. A straight forward one that said If you struggle with even the most basic pronouns in speech, that is a you problem.

Can you see my use of you? It's very clear and different to my use of I.

The simple takeaway from this should be that I does not mean you. If you think it does, you have a problem.

You either have an attitude problem @TooBigForMyBoots or you can't/don't word things clearly. Several posters have read your comments and come to the same conclusion that they drip with sneering and contempt. If that's not what you intended then the problem is you and your delivery not those on the receiving end.