Are young women insane?

[irishmurdoch]

Just been on a Reddit travel forum where young people planning their "year out" are discussing the merits of mixed gender hostel rooms. Lots of women talking about men snoring but absolutely none of them seem to be aware of the safeguarding risks. My mind is boggling. AIBU??

I've stayed in plenty of mixed hostel dorm rooms, as long as there is enough people in the dorm it's not a problem for me.

Also went on a university trip once as a replacement for someone who had dropped out, on the condition that I shared a room with 3 guys from the physics department. I think it was more awkward for them than for me. It didn't once occur to me that this would be a safeguarding risk. Young adult women should be trusted to make these decisions for themselves.

That's an interesting perspective - I've never traveled solo so I hadn't thought of it that way.

I slept in shared dorms in youth hostels while travelling. I also selected mix sexed university dorms. No issues at all.

It's a figure of speech, like talking of a 'insane risk'. It doesn't mean i think they've actually lost their marbles, just that they haven't thought it through.

I've stayed in mixed sex accommodation when younger, assuming someone wanted to do something inappropriate (which most don't) a room with 10 other people within 6 feet of you probably isn't a place its likely to choose to do it.

I realise they're not new - I think I mentioned early on that my friends and I always avoided them when travelling (30 yrs ago) because we were aware of the risks back then. My point is that it seems like that awareness has been eroded. Like some other posters, I'm wondering whether in the midst of the current obsession with inclusion, girls aren't being taught that they can take steps to protect themselves.

Honest answer that's not very politically correct is it depends where you are the world.

I've noticed the treatment of women in some parts of the world deteriorate significantly in some parts of the world over the past 20 years.

They just do not see the issue. I would hate it, but am I guessing if multiple women had issues in mixed dorms, then word would spread and they would be avoiding them. That does not seem to have happened.

I’m similar went travelling very young 17 family said that’s dangerous but no one sat me down & told me what who where how, times have moved on don’t know if yungsters are more important on personal safety now….

Absolutely, I think the risk depends on the size of the group/dorm/if you're with anyone you know well or not.

I would say young women aren't insane, but they are young. And we've got a generation now who have been brought up to believe that risky sexual behaviour is not just normal, but clever and aspirational.

Fwiw many years ago, when I was at uni, I stayed in a hostel with other girls from a volunteering group I was part of. One of them knew a bloke there (he was at another uni) and he ended up staying in our room for some spurious reason. Took the bunk under mine. I admit that I'd flirted with him, but I was 21 and single and probably quite naive. I flirted with everything in trousers. Lights went out, and he reached up and shoved his fingers in my knickers. I remember thinking wtf, and then saying, v loudly, get your hand off me. Everyone in the room heard me. No one turned on the lights or told him to leave. I didn't know wtf to do. It totally changed the attitude if the other girls towards me, though. I was told he had a girlfriend, as if I was somehow the one in the wrong. The girl who knew him, who was a couple of years older than me, told me that if I made a fuss, I could really ruin things for him. In hindsight I can see now that she knew full well it was sexual assault. I was basically bullied out of the group, and left it not long after.

So yes, men will take advantage in a mixed sex space.

Actually, come to think of it, I'm probably safer in a dorm than the cheap, (but not cheap enough this time), hotels I usually stay in.
Obviously I'm on my own and anyone could try to get in, or someone who works there who has a key.
The hostel was also in a much busier area when I was walking home at night.
That's not to say I've felt unsafe in the hotels either, I have my wits about me, but I'm not scared.

Are they definitely talking about the 'merits'? As in they choose to stay in mixed over female only when both options are available?

When I was a solo female traveler I often found that only mixed dorms were available outside of major cities and I was determined not to let that prevent me from traveling to somewhere I wanted to go, even though it wasn't ideal.

And I also agree with another post that mixed dorms were often safer in practice. They were bigger and had lots more people in (male and female), whereas in a female dorm you would quite often be alone. It seems higher risk to me as a lone women in a female dorm (which often don't lock properly!) where a predator could easily target you and get you alone than being a lone woman in a dorm with multiple unconnected men as it's unlikely all of them would be complicit in an attack.

This.
Hostel mixed space rooms have always been a thing, even when I was "young" 20 years ago.
I would have felt safer in one of those (and still would now) than in somewhere with a single room that didn't lock properly.

The 70s was also the peak of hitchhiking culture though, which seems to counter this argument of increased awareness in safety when travelling.

I think the reality is that not much has changed over the decades, it's just more talked about now because of social media and travel influencers

I disagree. Yes obviously there may be an issue rarely but i never understand the level of paranoia on this board.

Young people have friends of both sexes far more than my generation.and are not as naive as you think

I shared with men too at various points in my life. They've become great friends

As long as they are aware of potential dangers and take steps to keep as safe as possible as you rould with either sex

In my twenties my friend and I stayed at a hostel. On going to our room there were basically males staying in every other bed.

We asked to be moved and they did with no question it was all a no brainer.

They got our point.

In general I agree with you. I used to travel extensively on my own 10-15 years ago and was horrified then at the risks young women took with their own safety FOR LITERALLY NO REASON.

One friend hitchhiked solo from Turkey back to the UK, mainly with lorry drivers. Another agreed to go home with random men and sleep on their sofa. All in the name of saving money or lack of forward planning (e.g. booking a hostel bed before it sold out).

It's the same with young women all over though. Once I was with a group of girls from another western country (not UK) in Asia and we needed to get a taxi back. We had a choice between a proper licensed taxi driven by a woman (very unusual safe choice to have!) or a random bloke in his own car who was willing to drive us for slightly cheaper. I had a huge row with the girls as I was the only one wanting the female taxi driver. In the end I worked out how much the price difference was between them and it was 90p. They were willing to risk their safety to save 90p!

I mean, these are horrifying scenarios, but sort of irrelevant to the OP.

Mixed sex dorms are usually totally fine. Have stayed in dozens as a solo travellers. If there's like 8 people in a room, no-one is trying anything on. The hostel literally have all your identifying info, often a scan of your passport, not optimal sex crime conditions.

On the odd occasion where I've booked a 4 person dorm and then realised it was all blokes I've asked to swap, but that's only because I've found everyone (myself and dudes) has felt uncomfortable otherwise, especially if they're all mates.

What do you mean by 'the level of paranoia'?
Do you mean everyone is saying 'there is some risk' or that there is one person saying 'the risk of assault is so large that I wouldn't advise mixed-sex rooms in any circumstances'?

Risks are risks; paranoia is down to how people interpret them and choose to act. What do you think is being suggested that you think is not understandable? < none of this meant in a snarky way, I'm just interested.

I wish I'd had a pound for every time I said 'I can look after myself' when I was a young woman.

I didn't look after myself, I just got lucky.

And, if I hadn't got lucky, I would never in a million years have 'kicked up a fuss' about it, because I'd told everyone I could look after myself.

I had to spell this out to my daughter, but not until she'd already booked herself into mixed sex. Single sex dorms are more expensive than mixed sex which is annoying. The reality is that it is only the women who feel the need to pay extra. Mixed sex dorms actually end up being mostly male which makes it even worse.

Assuming everyone is in the room at the same time. And the men are strangers. Every summer there are reports of 'lads on holiday' gang-raping women. Most sex attacks go unreported. Turning a blind eye/ covering for a rapist friend is certainly not rare. Another woman present offers no protection against a group. Oh and let's not forget voyeuristic crimes like recording of undressing, toileting, bathing. I just wouldn't recommend mixed sex accommodation. I'd always advise against it. It's so not worth it. You can never be too safe. Hostels aren't even good value anymore. Young women should secure proper accommodation.

Nah, maybe I'm naive but I don't believe that.
The men would be strangers to each each other too, and in a room of 30, as I was, there's no way everyone is going to accept it.
It was good value too, £176 for 5 nights in July.

I think a lot of women don't like to think about how vulnerable they are when asleep. (I remember that harrowing case of a girl being assaulted and killed in her bunk while on a school trip to France). The same women saying it is safe would probably never sleep in a public park which is arguably safer. I was sexually assaulted by a man when there were at least 3 other people close by (not in a hostel). I literally froze. I couldn't believe anyone could be so brazen.