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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

David Lammy

144 replies

DomingoinLittleOakley · 28/06/2024 18:24

Someone wasn't paying attention in biology class.

https://x.com/FFS_WhatNow/status/1806680418134974709

x.com

https://x.com/FFS_WhatNow/status/1806680418134974709

OP posts:
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8
MissScarletInTheBallroom · 29/06/2024 10:31

CassieMaddox · 29/06/2024 10:22

Don't be ridiculous. There are millions of threads here about "Stonewall capture" which is essentially "guilt by association". Lots speculating about various people's objectivity because they know trans people or have them in their family. Lots about left wing parties being funded by drugs companies etc.

I'm not being ridiculous. Women like JKR are constantly accused of being in league with the far right and therefore being anti abortion, for example, when people like Nicola Sturgeon and Lisa Nandy are never accused of being on the same side as rapists even when they are literally calling for those rapists to be housed in women's prisons. There is no link whatsoever between JKR and the far right, but she still gets accused of that, whereas there is a very obvious and direct link between Nicola Sturgeon and Lisa Nandy and the male rapists for whom they are advocating, and yet no one would label them as pro rapist. It's an extraordinary double standard.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 29/06/2024 10:32

ResisterOfTwaddleRex · 29/06/2024 10:30

I agree that it's a clear sign of stupidity to believe humans can change sex. As well as that men with £5 bits of paper are women.

Thank you.

We are allowed to call stupid people stupid, even if they happen to be working class female Labour politicians.

WickedSerious · 29/06/2024 11:55

ResisterOfTwaddleRex · 29/06/2024 10:30

I agree that it's a clear sign of stupidity to believe humans can change sex. As well as that men with £5 bits of paper are women.

It's either immense stupidity or they're lying through their teeth.

ActivePeony · 29/06/2024 12:05

LGB Alliance are is one of those and if I were a politician I would not want to be perceived to support them either

Why? Are you homophobic?

AllProperTeaIsTheft · 29/06/2024 12:18

My point is why are people dragging up old interviews by Labour politicians and posting them as if they are recent with 5 days til an election?

This would be a reasonable point if David Lammy and other Labour politicians (including Keir Starmer) had apologised for their idiocy, or even fully admitted they were talking bollocks. I believe KS recently blamed his 'It's not right to say that only women have a cervix' comment on the fact that 'the debate was so toxic' at the time. Pathetic. And no, I'm not a Tory voter.

biddyboo · 29/06/2024 12:38

I think highlighting this has been good as it demonstrates how things have perceptibly shifted. Some of Labour politicians' statements (90% of giraffes are gay, 99.9% of women don't have a penis, transwomen can grow a cervix) are quite rightly being seen now as utterly ludicrous. People aren't going to put up with this nonsense anymore.

And the headline about Angela Raynor above is misleading because she didn't say she wouldn't be cowed by JK Rowling, she was asked if she would be, and then she squirmed and avoided answering the question. I think Labour are aware that none of this is going to away after the election, especially with all the tribunals coming up, so my hope is that sense will prevail.

Alltheprettyseahorses · 29/06/2024 13:32

CassieMaddox · 29/06/2024 09:50

Honestly. The false equivalences people pull out tickle me Grin

Starmer has every right to talk about his career history as that's part of him and what he brings to the table.

Lammy talking about female biology is not in any way comparable, due to the fact he's a man and its an opinion.

No. This is a blatant attempt to move the goalposts. Do you know who has the right to talk about what politicians have said or done? We do.

Floisme · 29/06/2024 14:26

It seems perfectly reasonable to me to reflect on statements made by senior members of the party that is expected to form the next government, and who will quite possibly have no meaningful opposition.

If they were made before candidates underwent any pre-election coaching then I find them even more interesting.

My only quibble is that I think it would be courteous to make the date of those statements clear from the start, otherwise I get confused as to whether or not this is fresh madness.

If the statements no longer reflect the views of the MP/s concerned then there is a clear remedy open to them.

ILikeDungs · 29/06/2024 16:36

CassieMaddox · 29/06/2024 00:05

My point is why are people dragging up old interviews by Labour politicians and posting them as if they are recent with 5 days til an election?

Odd behaviour.

Not odd whatsoever. Have these absolutely batshit pronouncements been corrected at all, or can men indeed grow a cervix as Lammy claims, and are women still dinosaurs who are hoarding their rights? Women's rights, hoarded by women... fancy that.

Let's remember that this is David Lammy of the disappearing policemen. And the David Lammy who helped craft the GRA. Again, fancy that.

David Lammy and the missing policeman

#davidlammy #police

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55FW9hw2M-Q

TeenagersAngst · 29/06/2024 16:48

@MissScarletInTheBallroom And lol at the idea that rising to the top of the Labour party is a sign of intelligence. The world of politics is like a toilet in which shit floats to the top. It would be much harder to reach the top as an intelligent person.

😂😂😂😂

Shortshriftandlethal · 29/06/2024 16:49

biddyboo · 29/06/2024 12:38

I think highlighting this has been good as it demonstrates how things have perceptibly shifted. Some of Labour politicians' statements (90% of giraffes are gay, 99.9% of women don't have a penis, transwomen can grow a cervix) are quite rightly being seen now as utterly ludicrous. People aren't going to put up with this nonsense anymore.

And the headline about Angela Raynor above is misleading because she didn't say she wouldn't be cowed by JK Rowling, she was asked if she would be, and then she squirmed and avoided answering the question. I think Labour are aware that none of this is going to away after the election, especially with all the tribunals coming up, so my hope is that sense will prevail.

Rather than sense prevailing what is actually happening is everything is reaching fever pitch; with last minute backroom deals; manipulation of language and message; people pouring scorn on the Cass Review and anyone who mentions it; Helen Webberley giving interviews to the Times; Labour MPs admitting that they forsee men in women's toilets and changing rooms........They're totally going for broke with the intention of forcing it through come hell or high water...and then just hoping " all of the fuss dies a death".

Monumentally stupid. How wrong and so far wide of the mark can supposedly clued up people/politicians be? The whole shit show is going to unravel at lightning rate...and Labour are going to have a full time job on their hands responding to, and dealing with, the inevitable fallout of having made negligent law totally lacking in clarity - and in insulting and patronising intelligent women who have been alerting them for years, and explaining their valid concerns.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 29/06/2024 17:14

Shortshriftandlethal · 29/06/2024 16:49

Rather than sense prevailing what is actually happening is everything is reaching fever pitch; with last minute backroom deals; manipulation of language and message; people pouring scorn on the Cass Review and anyone who mentions it; Helen Webberley giving interviews to the Times; Labour MPs admitting that they forsee men in women's toilets and changing rooms........They're totally going for broke with the intention of forcing it through come hell or high water...and then just hoping " all of the fuss dies a death".

Monumentally stupid. How wrong and so far wide of the mark can supposedly clued up people/politicians be? The whole shit show is going to unravel at lightning rate...and Labour are going to have a full time job on their hands responding to, and dealing with, the inevitable fallout of having made negligent law totally lacking in clarity - and in insulting and patronising intelligent women who have been alerting them for years, and explaining their valid concerns.

Edited

This is why, despite the last 14 years of Tory misrule, I will be glad if Labour lose and have another 5 years in opposition during which to get the fucking message.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 29/06/2024 18:09

WickedSerious · 29/06/2024 11:55

It's either immense stupidity or they're lying through their teeth.

Neither is a good thing in someone hoping to run the country.

Midgegreenstreet · 29/06/2024 19:52

CassieMaddox · 29/06/2024 09:54

Maybe in respect of gender ideology.

In respect of cost of living, public services, economic growth etc we could have had it very much better too.

Russ Jones is doing a 14 year tory retrospective. This is from the first year of Camerons government. He assesses the impact of various policies and I can barely bring myself to read it.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1806331089926893615.html

It is, in fact, possible for the Tories and Labour to be crap simultaneously in different ways. It does not excuse the Labour gender nonsense.

Signalbox · 29/06/2024 19:57

Omg I’ve not seen that video. How embarrassing for him! This really shows why clear messaging is necessary in healthcare. So many people have such a poor grasp of human biology.

Cailleach1 · 29/06/2024 20:11

@CassieMaddox ”Actually while I'm typing this, it is notable how much criticism is of the black man and the working class woman. God forbid they should get ideas above their station and actually be in power”

Think it is the other way up. There is no functional difference at all between people of different hues. Income levels either. However, no one is dismissing talk of people being black, white, working class, etc. Conversely, no one is going around saying that anyone can identify as them either, or play them as a role if they are not the genuine article. It would be an interesting exercise how compassionate for one’s true self these people would exhibit if someone merely ‘identified’ as something other than the sex they are not (say colour and background) and stepped on their toes. I think you’d find these people telling women to stfu suddenly don’t do magic thinking.

Men like Lammy remind me of that Jewish prayer where the men say thanks to God for not making them a woman. Some men, whatever hue he is, seems to enjoy having a power trip telling women to stfu. I bet he wouldn’t dismiss issues faced by black men, or them standing up for themselves, as them dinosaurs trying to hoard rights. I.e. the right not to be discriminated against and put directly in situation where they could be easily abused. In fact, whilst Lammy will very much consider hue a characteristic, he seems to think women are just bits that can be practically factory made, and will make anything they are fitted to a real live human female. Angela Raynor is doing very nicely thank you, in the corridors of power. I wouldn’t be crying into my beer for her being so hard done by life. I’d save that for the women she’d have share spaces with males. Women who have been traumatised by male violence, raped, or as faceless, male support bodies she’d agree with the policy of offering up on a plate to potential male rapists in prison and other areas where women are in a state of undress or vulnerable. I presume if any other group of people were deprived or fairness there’d be an outcry, or call for an immediate inquiry. Colour or background. With female sports, what the f do girls and women want fair or safe sports. Women as a sex seem to be subhuman to them. I am always reminded how some women campaigned against women gaining the vote. Lammy probably couldn’t give a toss, as he’ is not a woman (he could have the factory bit fitted, I suppose). But you’re quite right, if it was to do with colour, he’d be there batting against the bs. You see men’s rights are real. For real people.

Far from how hard done you’d have us think these examples are, they seem to be quite happy to make women vulnerable and unsafe. Possibly even tell them to stfu if they dared complain to being ill used and abused.

Cailleach1 · 29/06/2024 20:15

Meant to clarify, that the only people there are real and functional differences between are the two sexes. Men and women. Never mind your colour, class, ethnicity. No functional difference between any man. No functional difference between any woman.

So, the only real difference is the one being batted away as being just an ‘identity’. Yet the other ‘differences’, the ones that confer no difference, are being held up as sacred and real.

viques · 29/06/2024 20:20

Waves to the MN hero of the hour Jane who has a walk in and speaking part in the report

GCinTottenham · 29/06/2024 20:55

I have voted for Lammy for years, but will not vote for him again until he rethinks his position on women and gender.

CassieMaddox · 29/06/2024 21:36

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 29/06/2024 10:26

Given that JKR's position is that humans can't change sex, Lia Thomas shouldn't be swimming in women's swimming competitions, male rapists shouldn't be housed in women's prisons, we shouldn't be performing irreversible medical interventions on gender non conforming children and calling women menstruators is gross, I think you'd have to be really fucking stupid to disagree with that, let alone say it out loud.

And lol at the idea that rising to the top of the Labour party is a sign of intelligence. The world of politics is like a toilet in which shit floats to the top. It would be much harder to reach the top as an intelligent person.

Edited

Straw man. Angela Rayner has not disagreed with any of that. Or David Lammy actually. You are putting words in their mouths.

CassieMaddox · 29/06/2024 21:38

ResisterOfTwaddleRex · 29/06/2024 10:30

I agree that it's a clear sign of stupidity to believe humans can change sex. As well as that men with £5 bits of paper are women.

The £5 charge was the Tories 😴

CassieMaddox · 29/06/2024 21:40

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 29/06/2024 10:31

I'm not being ridiculous. Women like JKR are constantly accused of being in league with the far right and therefore being anti abortion, for example, when people like Nicola Sturgeon and Lisa Nandy are never accused of being on the same side as rapists even when they are literally calling for those rapists to be housed in women's prisons. There is no link whatsoever between JKR and the far right, but she still gets accused of that, whereas there is a very obvious and direct link between Nicola Sturgeon and Lisa Nandy and the male rapists for whom they are advocating, and yet no one would label them as pro rapist. It's an extraordinary double standard.

No. Some GC campaigners are accused of it because they are. You are now forced teaming the far right with JKR which is pretty shocking to be honest.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 29/06/2024 21:41

CassieMaddox · 29/06/2024 21:40

No. Some GC campaigners are accused of it because they are. You are now forced teaming the far right with JKR which is pretty shocking to be honest.

Oh don't be so daft.

CassieMaddox · 29/06/2024 21:43

ActivePeony · 29/06/2024 12:05

LGB Alliance are is one of those and if I were a politician I would not want to be perceived to support them either

Why? Are you homophobic?

No. I don't support orgs hosted in Tufton Street with non-transparent funding streams. I think they are pushing a far right agenda under a guise of being "reasonable".
When LGB Alliance explain who their large scale donors are I will be happier

ActivePeony · 29/06/2024 21:43

CassieMaddox · 29/06/2024 21:43

No. I don't support orgs hosted in Tufton Street with non-transparent funding streams. I think they are pushing a far right agenda under a guise of being "reasonable".
When LGB Alliance explain who their large scale donors are I will be happier

You really have lost touch with reality.