KJK’s insane rant

[Dontblameitonsunshine]

Kjk’s decision to attack everyone who is not her lapdog is increasingly destructive. It looks like Can-sg put on a great conference. Those doctors who have spoken up have risked their careers. Kjk has become famous and has started a business from LWS. She has benefited way more than any of these doctors.

Her work could be powerful if she just stopped attacking everyone else. But these days she is a demagogue and causes more harm than good by capitalising on vulnerable and timid women and telling them that they need her to speak for them.

She is living in a free society, completely entitled to her opinions, and I'm glad she shares them.

Self reflection is often lacking in many professional set ups and unless we hold people to account, things will not change.

If we don't regularly engage with oppositional discourse, we will fail those who we are hoping to help.

Safeguarding isn't about doing a course, having a few policies and a dbs.

It's about routinely reflecting on wider pictures and changing your approaches, and the key issue underpinning the disaster of "trans healthcare" has been the issue that KJK campaigns on the most:

women being allowed to speak.

The doctors that were there left GIDS in 2019. Hannah Barnes’s book details how they were speaking up way before Kjk started her business. I think LWS could be brilliant. But attacking everyone else who speaks up is just stupid.

And yet when women speak without KJK’s permission, she attacks them

And you're entitled to your opinion too.

I don't see this as "an attack" and I think that's the issue.

She's critical .

Nothing ever changes without criticism.

You don't think it's justified and that's a valid point too.

It's a reasonable point of view.

1. She is entirely against medical and surgical interventions for gender-distressed children. Pretty much everybody on this board agrees.
2. She doesn't believe in gender dysphoria as a disease, rather than a symptom of something else. David Bell said something very similar (on PM with Evan Davies the other day).
3. She doesn't believe in gender identity. See 1 above. I don't believe it's a real thing, either.

flirtswithrhinos (I think?) on another thread gave an example of how when in a group, the first person to make an estimate comes up with something preposterously high, others giving their estimate will go high also, though not as high as the preposterous first estimate. This is what has been happening - watered down versions of ideas which should never have been entertained. Like it's OK to let some "nice" men into single sex spaces. No.

I've just got about 5 mins in where she shows the slide from the conference which says that hormonal interventions should only be used with caution. Is that what they were saying? That it's OK to give these drugs to children with gender confusion? If so, I'm with her. These should never be given to children. If these doctors are still saying that, they are part of the problem.

I didn't attend the conference and I haven't watched the video yet, so I don't know what was said there.

Okay then. Why don't you contact her, tell her how her organisation could otherwise be brilliant and offer to volunteer. She isn't on Mumsnet so better to go to the source with your ideas.

https://www.letwomenspeak.org/contact

I'm further into the video and yes, it's the fact that they're #firstdosomeharm rather than do no harm as the conference is titled.

So yes I get her points and her anger and I think the conference warrants that criticism.

The medical community are still lagging behind.

It's so fucking obvious what GD is. And the medical community aren't doing what's needed.

Fair enough individual drs attending probably believe the same as she does. But have they taken these points there firmly enough?

She's asking for the line to be held.

flirtswithrhinos (I think?) on another thread gave an example of how when in a group, the first person to make an estimate comes up with something preposterously high, others giving their estimate will go high also, though not as high as the preposterous first estimate. This is what has been happening - watered down versions of ideas which should never have been entertained.

I think this is true here. GIDS giving hormone blockers to large numbers of children, and suggesting that this was 'standard' treatment for children with gender confusion made it look radical to say that this treatment was totally unsuitable for children and shouldn't ever be given to children. Now that people are starting to speak out it seems too much of a leap to say that, and they water it down with 'maybe a few children if their gender distress is really, really bad'. They need to just say no. Not ever. Not a single child should be given these drugs for gender distress.

Normally, in other contexts, I am an arch-compromiser. But both in terms of justice and conceptually, there is no middle ground in this battle. Men are not women. You cannot change sex, A little bit of unfairness in women's sport is not ok. Damaging some children is not ok.

I don't have 100th of her courage. I wouldn't get on with her personally, and she may be being unfair to some individuals. But in the main I think she is right.

All successful protest movements need your hardliners and your moderates.

The hardliners tend to go in first and hard. They highlight the issues, often in a very stark and uncomfortable way. The moderates come in later and often neogitate their way to a a better deal with the other side. The hardliners are still useful because the moderates know that they are there in the background to prevent them from compromising too much.

This is how major political change happens. Everything from the Chartists through the Suffragists to the Good Friday agreement. (Moderates are the gorup that are conspicuously lacking in Hamas vs Netanyahu btw.)

KJK plays the role of the hardliner in this fight we're in to stop our rights and safety being liquidated. As such she is not to every moderate's taste but her role is vital. Without her, the GC Womens Rights movement would long ago have collapsed into in-fighting and lengthy, incomprehensible essays by Jane Clare Jones.

In short, thank Goddess for KJK!!!

What is gd @WarriorN ?
It would be utterly pointless for doctors to stand in parks for LWS and talk about these kids. No one would care. Doctors have spoken at those events and no one has cared.
it is much more effective that they have had this conference and other doctors will be forced to contend with their points.

Thanks for understanding what I was saying despite my awkward phrasing!

Gender dysphoria

That's not what she's saying

She's saying that the views that women have been giving are not being supported in the places it's most needed, from my interpretation. Their voices about their children are still not being heard

Hardliners are great. Winnie Mandela, Malcolm X, Lenin, Stalin, Chairman Mao, Ian Paisley, Gerry Adams.

I Love KJK. I truly admire her strength in this.
It must be so hard to keep the courage of conviction with so many people telling her she is (insert insult here) wrong and to be kind!

Sorry I meant what is gender dysphoria @WarriorN ? There seems to be a lot of argument about this so I was surprised that you say it’s obvious

False and unhelpful equivalence, as is labelling her "rant" to be insane.

She describes it bloody well in the video!

OldCrone · Today 10:32

Is that what they were saying? That it's OK to give these drugs to children with gender confusion? If so, I'm with her. These should never be given to children. If these doctors are still saying that, they are part of the problem.

As much as I'd like to see it banned entirely, I don't think that's going to happen - yet. I view this as the first step, it's not ideal, but it's moving along to what may end up as a band. At least some children will be saved from this insanity. Well, at least until they are legally old enough to make their own decision, sadly.

I’m not telling kjk to be kind @CatLevelCare . You can read what I said and nowhere do i imply she should be kind. I’m saying that kjk is destructive and stupid for attacking her own side.

It shows you how bad things are that banning the illegal sterilisation of children is now seen as the extremist, hardline position.

Would you like to address her points? I assume that is what this thread is about. Or is it just attacking KJK?

What points do you disagree with?