They / them at work

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I've just written a long post and it's disappeared so in brief - how do you deal with staff who are they/them at work? I will really struggle to call a very obvious biological male 'they'. I also can't loose my job and do want to be respectful but also can't change my view on this nonsense !

I wondered about that! Using “it” would basically solve all the confusion caused by they/them, but it’s not going to happen bc it would be seen as dehumanising.

What do you think about DID or schizophrenia?

All right, if trans people don’t go through really hard and painful treatment to transition because they feel utterly miserable otherwise and feel that they must, what other reason can you think of to go through all that?

And how do you explain trans people feeling so much better post-transition? Like it was meant to be?

That's how they feel.

Some people feel very strongly that they are overweight or their nose is too big. I'm not debating whether some people feel like they are in the wrong body, I am pointing out that it is impossible to actually be in the wrong body. Or have the wrong brain. The brain that develops inside your skull is necessarily your brain. You are your body. Your body is you.

Please answer the question I asked you. Why does there need to be a reason you personally think is rational? It's a psych issue.

And how do you explain trans people feeling so much better post-transition?

There are studies which give the lie to this.

I’m not sure what DID is; as for schizophrenia, it’s a mental health disorder. What’s the relevance of the question?

Dissociative Identity Disorder. So I guess you aren't a mental health professional or anyone with even a passing understanding of psychology.

As far as I go, I don't believe in gender identity ideology, therefore I think it's simply a psychological issue involving a range of heterogeneous factors.

I am answering your questions; no need to get aggressive. And this isn’t the question you asked me. But to answer it, I don’t agree that it’s a psych issue. It has deep roots in biology, which you can see in all the links I posted earlier. Nobody knows for sure, but a lot of evidence points that way.

Then we'll have to agree to disagree because I don't think it is any more or less than a psychological issue.

I'm not, but you don't have to be a professional to read, listen, and form an opinion. Otherwise no one would be able to have an opinion on anything they didn't do professionally, which is clearly ridiculous. From my reading of reputable sources like medical journals, it seems there is a ton of evidence for biological roots in...well, just about everything about us, including gender dysphoria. As I said above, no one knows the answer, but if I had to choose, I'd come down on the side of a biological basis for the impetus to transition. Most mental-health conditions have a strong biological basis, including schizophrenia.

And you didn't answer MY question: What other reason can there be for someone to put themselves through all that dreadful treatment if they weren't so unhappy they felt they couldn't live without doing it, and how do you explain the happiness and satisfaction of many trans people after making the transition? If it was all a psychological issue, then making a physical change wouldn't solve that, would it?

Some people regret the change and say they were influenced or going through a phase, but many others report feeling "right" for the first time after the transition. There surely can't be a study saying that the latter group are wrong about their own happiness?

@Ereshkigalangcleg Let's say you're right and that feeling as if you're the opposite sex to what you were born is all a psych issue and has no biological reality. It doesn't change the fact that they're miserable and should receive kindness and not prejudice for their MH disorder, does it?

And what would you have them do? Are you advocating for counselling, antidepressants etc to treat the issue? Has that ever worked, to counsel/medicate someone out of their gender dysphoria? Maybe it has.

I'm also interested to know why you're so sure there's no biological basis for being trans? I don't mean that sarkily. I'd like to know. I've told you why my opinion: the existence of a lot of research from reputable institutions, reported in reputable journals, that there is something to the bio basis. As I've said, I'm strongly leaning that way; I can't know for sure. Why are you SO sure that it's not biological?

Yes, and many people who feel that way are right, and they lose weight or get a nose job, and then they feel better. There are also cases of body dysmorphia, of course. You're saying trans people have the same thing, but with their gender? It's totally possible. But there's so much reputable research indicating the opposite might well be true.

As regards the rest of your post, I think you're splitting hairs a bit. By "wrong," they mean they feel they have a female brain when their body is male, or vice versa. Of course their brain and body is them. It's not like there was a choice of brains and bodies like some Build-a-Bear and they got stuffed with the wrong version! But trans people overwhelmingly report feeling strongly that they are in the opposite-sex body to what they should be, they go through awful medical stuff to change, and most report feeling much happier after. I have no reason to disbelieve them.

I think the idea of a “gendered soul” or “being in the wrong body” is, to put it mildly, debatable. I get that some people feel tremendous dissonance between their identity and their physiology. This is a psychological issue. I think these people should be treated sympathetically (I’m not including the creeps sheltering under the trans umbrella).

People should be free to live their lives as they choose but they don’t have the right to compel speech or to violate the fundamental rights of others (in this case, women’s sex-based rights).

Whether gender dysphoria is biological or psychological, trans people suffer high rates of violence and prejudice, so you should be kind to them. They don't have easy lives.

But the extreme activists who infiltrate women's sports and get people turned out of their jobs for "misgendering" someone can p8ss off. That is NOT OK. As much as I advocate for trans people to live without discrimination, they're not the only people with rights, but the crazy extremists don't care about that.

I think young people are being influenced by the trans lobby, definitely. There's been a huge uptick in youngsters deciding they're trans. As for puberty-blockers, don't get me started. How was that ever legal? Children should not be able to make these decisions.

But as regards true-blue trans people, the ones who say they have always known, who are consistent in their need to change, and who go through very unpleasant medical treatment, feeling much better after, I err on the side of strong roots in biology. Because if the issue is psychological, changing the physical wouldn't help, would it? When people have plastic surgery because of body dysmorphia and not because they truly do have a big nose, they want more plastic surgery. They're still not happy. But that's not true of the many trans people who feel so much better after they transition.

I agree 100% with your last paragraph. The extreme activists seem to have no idea at all that other people have rights too.

I believe dysphoria exists. It is a feeling. Incidentally, calling it a mental health issue is transphobic, apparently.

Anorexics feel better after they lose weight. Does the fact that they are happier prove that they were overweight?

If you are male, so is your brain. If you are female, so is your brain. No build-a-bear.

Anorexia is not the same as being trans. Trans people mostly feel much better after transitioning and don't go on transitioning back and forth, usually. Many report that they feel right at last, and go on to live their lives as their new gender. In contrast, anorexics go on and on and on losing weight - it's never enough. Studies show that anorexia has strong biological roots, by the way. We now know that many MH disorders have roots in biology, much of the time. You say it's a psych issue, but why should it not be strongly influenced by biology, like, say, we know depression often is?

@Snowypeaks About your last para: "If you are male, so is your brain. If you are female, so is your brain. No build-a-bear."

Trans people beg to differ, and they put their money where their mouth is by going through really difficult treatment and risking social upheaval by transitioning. It doesn't make sense not to believe them.

We will just have to agree to disagree. I don't think there's any sense in flogging this one any more!

Just be kind to trans people and use their preferred pronouns at work. It costs nothing.

"Believe them" in what? That they have a disordered perception of their sexed body? I can believe that. That they somehow magically feel the same as the opposite sex and not like people of the same sex feel? No, sorry I don't.

Just be kind to trans people and use their preferred pronouns at work. It costs nothing.

It does cost women to participate in gaslighting themselves.

There is a cost to it. It indulges the fantasy that men can be women. And that can lead to real-world consequences of men then attempting to colonise women’s spaces.

Very few have full surgery.
What about the ones who don't feel better afterwards?
I don't doubt how they feel, I reject your assertion that because some people feel better after transitioning (whatever that is) that is evidence of that they have the wrong sex brain.