Lesbian members club to only allow biological women

[JanesLittleGirl]

"A FEMINIST campaigner is to open the UK’s first lesbian members bar that will only allow biological women to join.

The bar, named the L Community, is due to open in London later this year and will operate as a private members club so that it can bar trans women.

The bar has been set up by Jenny Watson, who in September last year was at the centre of a transphobia row after she insisted only “adult human females” could attend the lesbian speed-dating events she had organised."

digitaleditions.telegraph.co.uk/data/1615/reader/reader.html?social#!preferred/0/package/1615/pub/1615/page/23/article/NaN

I'll get an archive link in a bit.

Look at their giant Adams apple. Even babies can clock men.
Give it a rest.

I bet you got a little thrill out of imagining that.
What a sleaze of a comment.

What do you get out of it?

A boner?

Am I to assume that the previous poster thinks that this is why men grope women in nightclubs? Because otherwise they can't tell whether they're approaching a woman or not?

It's bollocks, sweetheart. Don't excuse sexual assault from men, and don't project their excuses onto women.

There are numerous secondary sexual characteristics that, when taken together, allow highly reliable sex differentiation.

• face shape
• breasts or lack of
• crotch bulge caused by male genitalia
• adam's apple only found in males
• hip-shoulder ratio
• hip-waist ratio
• brow ridges in males
• torso length to limb length ratio
• hand size
• foot size
• facial hair
• hairline at forehead
• voice pitch
• gait

I'll grant that cross-sex hormones and surgery can mask some of these, but some cannot be masked, creating a noticably disjointed appearance in someone on cross-sex hormones. A transman with broad hips, no adam's apple, and no brow ridges will jar visually even after testosterone has caused facial hair growth. Place your hand over a photograph of Buck Angel from the nose down and look at Buck's eyes and forehead. They are unmistakably female, even now.

This visual jarring attracts attention subconsciously in the viewer, even if they cannot identify the cause. I've sometimes looked several times at someone "odd-looking" trying to figure out why, then they've moved or spoken and I've realised that they are on cross-sex hormones.

The whole point of a lesbian-only club is that it is for homosexual adult female humans only. By definition, that excludes anyone male and anyone heterosexual. It wouldn't be a lesbian-only club if it were "inclusive".

I was sexually assaulted aged eight by two older boys who used my secondary sexual characteristics of breast buds and hip-shoulder ratio to determine that I had a vulva that they could touch without my consent. I know this because they agreed a tactic of "you keep her there and I'll touch her fanny" immediately prior to the assault, as well discussing how my pubic hair felt during the assault. The idea that they didn't know that I had a "fanny" and touched me to determine whether I had one or not is ridiculous and the idea that a lesbian would do that to other women is not only absurd, it's highly offensive.

Anyway, it wouldn't matter if male transitioners and women were visually identical. The males know they are male, so why would they want to go somewhere where all the women have explicitly demonstrated that they aren't sexually interested in male transitioners? Seriously, why?

It's rather a deliberately ineffective dating strategy, isn't it? Naturally they should go to a club where there is a chance of meeting a woman who is interested in a relationship!

VitoCorleone I'm so sorry that happened.

If they knew the policy and joined the club, yes, that would be dishonest.

How do they tie themselves in these knots?

It's so fucking simple

Lesbian = natal vagina ❤️ natal vagina

Not surgical vagina or cock and balls ffs

I'm actually stuck that some imbecile considers it transphobic that a LESBIAN doesn't want to be intimate with a PENIS

That would explain much - thank you.

And there we have the answer!

Not quite - it would be 62% of the 29 trans-inclusive lesbians who would only date a female bodied person, (even though they identified as male). That's . . .

<takes off shoes and socks as needs to count past 10>

. . . that's 18 lesbians lesbianing properly.

The 38% is the percentage who would date a male-bodied person. (11 lesbians semi-lesbiaining). (I think - as you say the mangling of language is very confusing also I'm not very good at sums.).

Personally, I think that If they are prepared to accept men, then even if they choose to describe themselves as "lesbian" they are actually bisexual.

Personally, I think that If they are prepared to accept men, then even if they choose to describe themselves as "lesbian" they are actually bisexual.

Or they are suppressing their innate sexual preference and forcing themselves to date (in all its current meanings) male bodied people because they think it's righteous and progressive and The Right Thing To Do

I don't think you understand what nearly all of those words mean.

Equality doesn't mean 'everyone has the same'.

Inclusiveness doesn't mean 'everyone can have everything'.

Hypocritical doesn't mean 'won't do what I want'.

Attendant doesn't mean 'someone who goes to something'.

HTH.

Good point - there is so much gaslighting and bullying of vulnerable young women going on.

That article.....

And when the overwhelming majority of cis dykes date and fuck cis women, but are not open to, or are even turned off by, the idea of dating or fucking trans women, how is that not transphobic?

This would be because they are men and these women are homosexual.

How is it not quite fantastically self centred to require that a homosexual woman change her entire sexuality and validate a male with her body when she is not sexually interested in male people ?

This whole 'your reality and life must revolve entirely around what is happening between my ears' - it's nuts. It's insane. It's taken controlling and socially incapacitated to whole new levels of dysfunction. You cannot force other people to be props in your personal identity choices . And when this requires wishing a woman to engage in unwanted sex to comply with your needs? Bloody hell.

I can't remember now the article by a similar male writer with a TQ+ identity at the time who wrote indignantly about how lesbians were very kind, would chat away and be highly sympathetic, and then refuse to actually get their knickers off and dtd. The writer could not understand why they would not provide the sexual next step he expected from relational connection. I think the wording was 'they resist the penis!'.

You bloody bet they do mate. Their lives do not revolve around the self images of men.

Indeed.

How is it not quite fantastically self centred to require that a homosexual woman change her entire sexuality and validate a male with her body when she is not sexually interested in male people ?

If "TW are women", and "these TW are lesbians", then why aren't they happy enough to shag each other (after all, they are "women" aren't they?) rather than expecting "the other kind of lesbians" (ie female ones) to have sex with them?

Why is is that men - all men - should have a right to demand the type of sexual partner they prefer, but women - all women - shouldn't?

@Froodwithatowel
It's staggering isn't it. Gender is utterly inate and absolutely fixed at the core of the soul according to the gender borg, like sexuality was before the borg arrived. It's not a choice, it's fixed. And it's bumped the inateness of sexuality off the top spot, so now sexuality is a choice, a whim, bigotry. Apart from when it's fluid of course......

@Emotionalsupportviper
Yes. If these trans women are women why aren't they happy with each other.

I keep waiting for the government to solve the rapist gender problem by making specific trans women only jails. All jailed trans women go to the trans women jail.
Objections are dealt with thusly : "But it is a women's jail, trans women are women, there are only women here."
And if the objections continue : "Trans women's jails are women's jails you bigot!"
TWAW becomes TWJAWJ

The whole article is a series of hair-raising paragraphs.

For example

I know first-hand that it can be difficult to confront such issues. I remember a time many years ago—I was either just about to transition, or I had just transitioned, I can’t quite recall—when I saw a short documentary about two trans women who were life partners. And I am horribly embarrassed to say that, at the time, I was somewhat squicked by their relationship. The irrationality of my reaction was not lost on me. After all, I am a trans woman. And I am also attracted to women. So what was it about the idea of being with a trans woman that bothered me so? Over time, I realized that on an unconscious level, I was still buying into the idea that trans women were somehow unattractive, defective, and illegitimate, and that being partnered to a cis woman was somehow inherently better, or more authentic. After much personal reflection, I had to admit that my reaction was profoundly anti-trans. And I eventually got over my internalized transphobia, just as I had to get over my internalized homophobia the first time I sexually experimented with a man, and just as I had to overcome my own fatphobia the first time I dated a differently-sized woman.

Over time, I realized that on an unconscious level, I was still buying into the idea that trans women were somehow unattractive, defective, and illegitimate, and that being partnered to a cis woman was somehow inherently better, or more authentic.

....no mate, you just knew full well that there is a real difference between male and female people, and you're attracted to the female ones. The rest is just frantic trying to talk yourself into believing something more comfortable and burying another reality where you don't have to look at it. That's extremely sad reading.

Why are these TRA’s so narcissistic that they think EVERYTHING revolves round them?

Biological female lesbians wanting to spend time in each others company isn’t transphobic - it’s fuck all to do with anyone other than the women involved.

They see transphobia on every corner because all they think is ‘me me me me me me me me me’

And I notice that he apparently went back to dating women - even if it was a "differently-sized" one.

"Getting over fatphobia" - cheeky bastard!

I cannot imagine the complications of transgender lives. I do see their need for acceptance is strong; but attraction is a biological thing. We are all orientated to our own wants. You cannot think yourself into an attraction or desire; I'd say if you did it would be psychologically unhealthy or possibly abusive if driven by a partner.

Making something like attraction and desire about a political or sociopolitical agenda is fated to fail. Policing human relationships does not work. People will resist it. They will rather meet secretly or in private places to avoid not being their true selves. They have done it for centuries. All power to this club. It's simply another point in lesbian history.

just as I had to get over my internalized homophobia the first time I sexually experimented with a man,

Lol, does he mean an actual man? In which case he's being transphobic because isn't he a woman now, so it's a heterosexual relationship?

Or does he mean a transman?

Absolute gobbledegook